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Moore and Wooden on the value of experience

Ran into a couple of former Dolphins players at the Jimmy Buffett concert announcement Friday. As I told you in an earlier post, Dolphins great Kim Bokamper and Dolphins mediocre Joe Rose were there. Receiver Nat Moore, a rightful member of the Dolphins Honor Roll, was there as was former safety Shawn Wooden, who is a class act by any definition.

I got to talking with Moore and Wooden when the topic of the new drafted receivers took a left turn and became the topic of the current draft class. That topic also took a detour and got Moore talking about how Ted Ginn Jr. and John Beck were basically thrown under the bus from a planning perspective.

"Look at what the plan was when both those guys were drafted," Moore said. "Beck was supposed to sit a year and learn behind Trent Green. Then Trent Green got hurt and the next guy got benched and now what was supposed to be a two-year timetable is a two-month timetable because Beck is starting.

"Look at Ted Ginn. He comes in as a guy who is going to help the team as a receiver down the road but initially the plan was for him to learn that position while contributing on special teams right away. That was the plan. But they trade away Chris Chambers and now the kid has to play and then they cut Marty Booker and the guy has no veteran teaching him how it's done."

I have long valued the presence of veteran leadership on a team because without it, a team is simply incomplete. Look at all the great teams. None are comprised of just young players. Or just old players. I believe all great teams strike a balance between experience and youth, and are served from both camps.

The same can be said of groups of players on the team. The Dolphins had experience in the quarterback group (Chad Pennington) last year. They had experience in the linebacker (Joey Porter, Akin Ayodele and Channing Crowder) group. They had experience on the defensive line (Vonnie Holliday and Jason Ferguson). They had experience in the secondary at every starting position. They had experience in the running back corps. They had experience at tight end.

But they had no experience of note at wide receiver. And guess which group of players frustrated most with promised potential that did not fully arrive?

The wide receivers.

Davone Bess was a rookie. Greg Camarillo was a first-year starter. Ernest Wilford, the veteran with most experience, was a non-factor. Derek Hagan, a third-year veteran, was a glorified practice squad guy. And Ginn, the No. 1 receiver, was only in his second year and first as a full-time starter.

In other words, the group lacked an experienced mentor among their ranks.

So why is that important?

"It's very important on a football team," Wooden said. "I remember when I came in, guys took me under there wings. Louis Oliver taught me how to break down film. When Sam Madison got drafted, T-Buck (Terrell Buckley) helped him learn the game. When Pat Surtain got drafted the next year, both of them helped him."

So I asked the question that has always floated in my head when this subject comes up. In the absence of an experienced veteran, isn't it the position coach's job to step up and be the mentor?

"It is but they don't do it," Wooden said. "They really can't do it. It's like a family. The coaches are your parents. But the veterans are the older brothers. You listen to your parents, but you try to pattern yourself after your older brothers. When they say things it has more authority because they've just been there. That's how it is on a team. The older players know the tricks, they're on that field, they know what you're going through because they're going through it, too."

And that, according to Wooden and Moore, is invaluable.

"Look, football isn't all about being the best athlete," Wooden said. "I can go over to Liberty City and find five guys who can run a 4.3. But that doesn't make them a professional football player. That doesn't mean they have it up here (pointing to his head) or can be professional or have work ethic."

That other stuff must be learned. And it is Wooden and Moore's opinion that having mentors on the team to teach it to younger players is important. Unfortunately, Ted Ginn Jr. hasn't had a mentor to teach him.

Discuss ....

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mr, dodsworth, who won last night ?

thanks for the info

Elwin Green,

Who said anything about Australian Rules Football? You moron! LOL! I'm American and a Dolphan. I just love Australia. :)

joe rose was a real fin player and and to call him medicore player is insulting,at least he wasn't a player on the worst team ever of JT 1-15

aussieKEN, are you from sidney Australia ? i been there and i loved it

I heard Joe Rose's comments on the air about you dancing Mando. I was wondering when you'd get back at him. Hope you do it on air at 790.

By the way, that afternoon lineup sucks! Steve White should have hired you to be on the air every day instead.

X, Joan Rivers "won," and a more sickening display of injustice I have seldom beheld.

JUST SHUT THE HELL UP MY BROTHER DID NOTHING TO U GUYS.

My brother was a miami dolphin, thats more then i can say for most of U.

dan was worse than joe rose and you know it

Damnn str8 carlito tell it like it is C'money.

mr,dodsworh, who do you like better joan rivers or sally ?

u got to give it Sally.

And that makes me sad....

P.s. if ur gonna shark my style do it right...

PETE ROSE, is a zzzzzz

Foolishness this is..

Tickle me EMo, are you the real tickle or the fake tickle ?

Tickle me Elmo,

I would take a rotund, bulging, overweight, obese Sally Struthers over that insult-to-humanity Joan Rivers ANYDAY.

(But Sally really hit her peak in the early 70s, so, it if's okay with you, that's when I'd like to be with her.)

But getting back to my fantasy of being a running back (with no offensive help) and facing a goal line stand of 4 naked women standing in front of the bed which represents the end zone - I've decided to update my defensive line to make it more contemporary for some of you whippersnappers:

Left Defensive End - Megan Fox
Left Defensive Tackle - Beyonce Knowles
Right Defensive Tackle - Jessica Simpson
Right Defensive End - Rita Hayworth (Okay, she was born in 1919, and she's dead, but she was a fox!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7IxliAPjAk

Here is a You tube vid of my origin. And my picks for this upcoming season check it out.

If life is so fair why do ROSE's have thorns.

and this makes me sad...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7IxliAPjAk

Here is a You tube vid of my origin. And my picks for this upcoming season check it out.

If life is so fair why do ROSE's have thorns.

and this makes me sad...

Im not sure id go with simpson as either a safty or a MLB..

Kim Kardash at T.E. i hope...

and that makes me sad.....

nataniel, can we go with gay friend in there as TE

nice column Armando. Its good to hear some wisdom from time to time. I believe we should have picked up a veteran that was available for mentoring Ginn Bess & Camarillo. I am still wondering whether the Vonnie Holiday move was sound too. I mean the guy was a captain for a defense that was showing up I think he should have atleast been kept until his last year in his contract w a lil restructuring or renegotiating. Anyways JT is still available but how long until he is wearing blue white red uni?? the vets that were avail this year could play still no doubt I bet a few teams will get very rewarded.

AUTOBOTS.. Fall in.

I'm sorry, Tickle me Elmo, but the answer is no. I'm a live and let live kind of guy. Gayness is kind of like dairy products for me. While I do not wish to persecute or be mean to anyone who eats dairy, I can not bring myself to even sample something that makes me retch.

My one exception is butter. I make this exception because butter to me is the equivalent of two attractive, lipstick Lesbians. It's very tasty and not nauseating at all, the way milk, cheese and yogurt are nauseating.

I'm glad we now understand one another.

So not even coffee ? nothing whatsoever mr dodsworth, Or even cream on a cinamon roll or Cheese on a burger ..if this is so.

It makes me sad......

i thought the coach is suppose to be doing some coaching not just the veterans

I do not drink coffee, tea or alcohol. I am not a Mormon. They just don't taste good to me. If it's any consolation, I abuse my body with lots of salty snacks, red meat and soda pop.

Mediocre? WOW.....Exactly at what level of pro-ball did you (Armando) play in the NFL..making it to the NFL and keeping a job on the team is more than mediocre...as far as teachers and mentors, etc.....get real......as someone else mentioned....the best rise to the top.....

Salty snacks??

things that make u go hmmmmmm..

Im out .

What's the best pig's meat you love to eat mr dodsworth ?

I agree that veterans need to be added and kept at two positions; WR and DE/OLB. Who can step in?.... None other than J. Taylor! And if not willing to trade for Boldin, Harrison could provide that for Ginn (same body type and athletisism, just imagine Harrison giving Ginn the knowlegde to become a young Harrison, wow!)

PS. side comment on the Jimmy Buffet thing;
Its all good to have Buffet for entertainment and drunken “culture”, but we need something more!
Example: During the Raven’s game last playoffs; there was a time at the end of the 3rd qtr or beg. of the 4th where if Ted Ginn doesn’t fumble the handoff on a reverse it would of been 20-17 and still anybody’s game. Watching it on TV, by that point of the game there was only half of the stadium left!! What kind of fans are these!!? There needs to be a culture change! Most of our fake fin fans don’t match the new culture that begun last year, the only reason we made history was because the team BELIEVED! Fans do really uplift a team when they believe!
I don’t think Jimmy Buffet will help much with that end of the spectrum, but hopefully a positive change is coming (going back to the Marino days atmosphere were you got chills watching every moment)

Ticklemypickle, the only pig's meat I enjoy is bacon. My wife makes delicious BLT sandwiches. Please don't tell my Rabbi about this. Or if you do, please let him know that my wife ties me up and force feeds me it (which is kind of how she gets me to give her oral pleasure anyway).

mr,dodswort, are you following me bloggers....do you like boiled eggs

Mr. Jophenyfinfan, I do not enjoy hard boiled eggs. The only eggs I enjoy are scrambled.

But speaking of the episode of The Brady Bunch where they go to Hawaii, and Marcia wears a bikini, I've always felt that Maureen McCormick was disadvantaged by the fact that collagen injections were decades away. If Marcia had full lips, she really could have been one of the most beautiful women of all time.

While a veteran presence seems necessary, I don't buy it. First off, there were a ton of vets on the 1-15 team. Secondly Joey had 17 sacks last year. Couldn't he teach or guide someone else to the qb for like say 5 or 6? No, because he was getting guys to open lanes for him.
Now as this team develops we will have vets, like NE with a winning spirit and we will be a consistent ball team fighting for the top.
Under the bus is an understatement. Ted Ginn and John Beck were left out to hang. Both paid for it but Ginn is going to come out this year.

Just wondering:

Michael Irvin and Marvin Harrison, who were their mentors?

As a matter of fact, I am quite certain the Cowboys hired Drew Peason to mentor players after his playing career was over. He was not an assistant coach, but he was there for guys like Michael Irvin.

Sean Dawkins was the veteran on the Indianapolis roster when Marvin Harrison was breaking in. He wasn't great, but he was on par with a Chris Chambers I would say.

Michael Irvin was mentored by the late Harvard physicist, Theodore Golinsky. They came up with the Golinsky-Dusenberry-Bosworth theorem which posits that the speed of anti-matter is inversely proportional to the gravitational pull of electron magnification.

Marvin Harrison was mentored by magazine publisher Silas B. Pocklington. They had a falling out in 1997, parted ways, and countersued over paternity allegations related to Mrs. Pocklington's third child.

NYScott

Thanks. Glad to know that I can have a calm and insightful conversation regarding politics. Hope you and your familiy had a good Mothers Day.

By the way, What ever happened to Cadillac Williams?

So basically what Moore and Wooden were saying was that Cam Cameron and his front office pretty much screwed everything up on the planning front. They're right, too. Getting rid of Chris Chambers? Cutting Marty Booker? WTF was Cameron smoking that year?

Imagine still having Chambers, who could teach Ginn the ropes of being a receiver in this league. Chambers and Ginn as two starting receivers with a healthy Camarillo as your third receiver doesn't exactly jump out at you as a dynamic group, but collectively they would be much more formidable than the group we currently have. I love the toughness Camarillo has and the heart Davone Bess has, but all the toughness and heart in the world doesn't make you run faster, or grow taller, or jump higher.

As for veteran leadership, it is sorely needed to teach Ginn how to be a productive every down receiver. At times it's like Ginn runs around like a chicken with its head cut off. Ginn's best talent is his speed, but not even that can be properly utilized cause Pennington doesn't have the arm strength to throw deep enough to where Ginn's speed separates him from the cornerback covering him. Therefore, Ginn's best bet at being a difference maker is learning to run crisp routes, adjusting to the quarterback and/or different coverages, and being a more efficient receiver across the middle.

Sorry this post is so long but the Dolphins rarely elicit a brief response from me.

LMAO ! What a F'n baby.

Nathaniel D

Rita Hayward, hottest, foxy babe there ever was.
I had a film studies class and "Gilda" was a movie we studied regarding: Lighting, camera angles, and the voyeuristic view presented on film. Gilda, was where I first discovered Rita Hayward and have loved her ever since.

Dolphins4Life, I fell in love with Rita Hayworth when I saw her with Gene Kelly in "Cover Girl" (1944). But she was unbelievably sexy in Gilda. There were a few movies she made earlier with Fred Astaire where she takes my breath away - it's like I'm thinking this has to be the most beautiful woman of all time.

Guys, theres no mentoring ted(wheres the sideline) ginn, the man-child lacks the testacular fortitude to play in the NFL, its best to cut him, his clipboard holding daddy and his cousin the blocking dummie rufus, so they can concentrate on there bicyle shop " The Ginn Bike Emporium"

Guys, theres no mentoring ted(wheres the sideline) ginn, the man-child lacks the testacular fortitude to play in the NFL, its best to cut him, his clipboard holding daddy and his cousin the blocking dummie rufus, so they can concentrate on there bicyle shop " The Ginn Bike Emporium"

Ok Guys, the menace is now taking your calls, shoot a "Q" to the menace.

Menace, have you run out of insults for the Ginn family, or are you savinng up some new material for the start of the season?

I agree Amando. Veteran leadership is very important to a rookie or second year players development. A young inexperienced receiver need an experienced veteran to help teach not only the little things of the game, but also to help keep his confidence up. A young inexperienced receiver needs a veteran receiver to sit next to to talk to about a mistake he made out on the field. A young receiver just has a comfort level with a veteran receiver that he doesn't have with his position coach. Veteran players are such valuable resources to have on a team.

Tom, ive got troves of ginn materal just waiting for the seasom to start, stay tuned for the introduction of his sister Tedmisha ( All the way) Ginn, coming in july.

Liberty city they run from the cops. Better run a 4.3. That lovetown weed sucked. 20 years later fun to hear that name. They give us no chase to win it all this year, I think we do Virginia beach is a great place to live dam hog fans everywhere

And i think i'll also introduce mama ginn, a ladie with a huge heart that would give you the shirt off her back(for a price).

Hey Oliver Stone called; He wants his words back... "Land Sharks".... LOL... Oh Please!!!

They are the Miami Dolphins!

Stop trying to out think your own idiotic marketing ideas!

Miami Dolphins Stadium... Not ProPlayer... Not Cocaine Heaven.... Not AIG B of A Pixar Mickey Mouse Stadium...

MIAMI DOLPHINS STADIUM!!!!!!

every one making fun of the name { Land Shark } but you guys forget it's only one year contract until things comes back,after all the team still lousy,so be happy some body willing to pay some thing.


P'S...the names that Brice Partain will never and pay the huge amount of money they used to pay for name rights,these days are over

cuban, you thing if ted gets married, will that help you with new lines or gets tested positive for some thing.

Ariz., I wouldnt be shocked if ted(opps i droped another pass)ginn tested postitive for having to much estrogin....would not shock the cuban at all.

Ok Guys the cubans almost out of time, so hurry and shoot the Qs now, cause the menace has sh it to do...

dont worry cubes ill take over..papi

that sounds so nice and logical. but let's get real. who took the Eagles LaSean Jackson under their wing last year? or Joe Flacco? or Matt Ryan? these were rookies who took advantage of opportunity and made the most of it. ted ginn was considered an iffy pick to begin with. and it's ultimately up to him to prove his worth. what about davone bess, no one held his hand, yet he overcame being a walk-on and not only made the team, but evolved over the season into a fine receiver. those veterans like to sound like teachers, which is cool, but fact is, as several others have noted, cream rises to the surface. and hard work pays off. ted ginn can't blame anybody for his failures as a top pick. he's coming along though, and he may yet right himself. but please, don't blame the coaches for not surrounding him with teachers. ... and john beck, as nice a guy as he is, is/was simply not as good as chad henne, or chad pennington. life can be disappointing, and beck is probably going to have a disappointing career. thank god it's his problem, and not ours!

HOW ABOUT ANY UPDATE ON JT!!

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