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On Incognito Dolphins must weigh risk, reward

Since the topic of this blog is Richie Incognito, I must explain the idea of risk versus reward.

Incognito, whom the Miami Herald reported Saturday will visit the Dolphins this week, is undoubtedly a risky proposition for the team.

He is only 26 years old and already looking for his third team. Icognito joined the Rams in 2005 and after two years as a starter in 2007 and 2008 started being viewed as one of the dirtiest players in the league by a poll of his peers. During a terrible season for his team in 2008, Incognito taunted Rams fans after a home loss. Last year he got into a sideline argument with head coach Steve Spagnuolo after head-butting two opponents in a Rams game versus the Tennessee Titans.

The guy has been referred to as "immature" and a "tool" by St. Louis media.

And yet the Dolphins like Icognito.

They like the guy enough to bring him in for the visit and while that doesn't necessarily mean he's going to sign, it goes a step beyond last season when the team claimed Incognito on waivers. The Bills also claimed him -- getting him because they stunk more than Miami -- but promptely threw him back to the talent pool this offseason where the Dolphins have on the hook again.

So one supposes you see the risk in chasing Incognito. He could still be the same immature player he's proven himself to be. Perhaps he's not that good a player which is obviously Buffalo's opinion.

But ...

Assuming the Dolphins don't do anything crazy like offering major guaranteed money -- or any guaranteed money for that matter -- this risk could pay a dividend if Incognito signs and becomes a good player.

The risk could bring a big reward if Incognito solves Miami's festering right guard problem. The position has been a turnstile for five different starters the past two years. Donald Thomas and Nate Garner shared the job and starts last year.

So what if at 6-3 and 320 pounds, with strength that is unquestionable, Incognito becomes a staple on Miami's line?

Who will complain then?

I know there are questions out there why the Dolphins would flirt with Incognito but not show any interest in other troubled players such as Brandon Marshall?

There is a difference. A big difference. Marshall presents a much greater risk. I detailed what a high risk proposition Marshall is over the weekend.

Marshall would require a big contract, draft picks and a long-term commitment atop his troubled history. The Dolphins don't need to give Incognito a big contract, give up picks and show a lifetime commitment to the offensive lineman.

So if Incognito becomes a player, great. The gamble worked.

If Incognito signs and then disrespects coach Tony Sparano as he did Spagnuolo, if he costs the Dolphins yardage with personal foul penalties, if he's the same immature player he's been to this point, then the gamble failed.

It wouldn't be the first time the Dolphins blew it on a free agent.

Except this one hopefully comes with the appropriate amount of measuring risk versus reward.

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Might as well give him a chance,who knows what will happen,but like Armando says,if we don't give him a truck full of money and don't lose draft picks,then we won't lose out on too much.

Poop....I forgot to type " First "

These are the types of signings the good teams make in FA. Depth, strengthening the overall quality of a position. This kind of aggression could be good, we need some fiery, in-your-face type guys in the huddle.

I'm all for it, it can't hurt the team.

Rob,

I did check it out. What I found very interesting was how productive Jerry Hughes was. Graham had good stats too, the arm length thing isn't as bad as initially thought. While you may lock on your players(not a bad thing) this type of research proves you at least look at everyone. Also, Graham's numbers provide credibility to your high mark for him. Good work.

We seem to be in no man's land for a few players. It is debatable that Graham, Thomas, and Williams may be a little too high for 12. And there is no way Jerry Hughes reaches 44. Is Bay Bay Thomas there? Cam Thomas may be too high there. Does Dexter McCluster reach our pick in round 3?

We have debated Brandon Spikes a little bit tonight. Your opinion on Spikes?

If Donald Thomas becomes your 3rd string right guard, then you are loaded on the offensive line.

Hey Bootang,

Did you see the list I compiled of the LB measurables on the last thread?

I was so ticked I missed you by about 4 mins.

sheesh where did you go?---are watchn mcshay again---

Thanks Bootang! It was a fun list to research but, hopefully it put most of the important stats at your finger tips if you need to refer to em.

I also did Morgan seperately down below those guys.

I am glad you liked it bud.

Cheers,

Lets debate best value in 2nd round for dolphins?--dont include WRs?--thats the obvious reach for demaryious from Gtech---give me your favorite 3 choices---Dont use jerry hughes either he wont be there.

allen,

Sheesh bailed at the end of the last blog.

I am pretty sure it's another familiar face on here but, that's fine as there are number that love to go Sibil up in here.

Cheers,

sheesh----was on a rant---dont ever mention Kiper to that kid---his got Daddy issues

Rob,

I just haven't put a ton of time into scouting those guys. I know who I like from the eyeball test, Graham and Hughes.

I just think that Ed Reed has been every bit as, and maybe even more, important for BAL as Ray Lewis. When drafting Earl Thomas, I don't just look at what he brings to the FS position. I look at how he fits into our secondary, and the extra things he brings to Mike Nolan's defense.

Getterdone had me really look at Sergio Kindle. I have started to really study all the OLBs, not just the guys I think could be around in round 2.

You like kindle, i think he is riskier then JPP---i just dont see a natural position with kindle--he doesnt have the production either---one year at lb, the other at end--i like his toughness but i think he is overrated as an coordianted athlete as well--he runs very choppy to me----When you watch Hughes you see a fluid athlete

Bootang,

I was reading to catch up and saw the raging debate over Spikes especially between allen and Sheesh.

For me the jury is out on that guy somewhat.

I mean we are not really sure all of the plans that Nolan has for our ILB's. I am not sure how much coverage vs blitzing they will be asked to do. I think Blitzing he is WAAY stronger than McClain at but I feel McClain would end up being better in coverage.

It's kind of a pick your poison kind of a thing.

Me personally I would maybe go after a more athletic ILB like Mississippi State Jamar Chaney who is 242 lbs but ran a 4.54 40. They could get him in like the 3rd of 4rth round. Micah Johnson would be another ILB that shows promise... A hulking run stuffer type that is a solidly built 258. same 3-4 round grade.

That way I could leave my first and second picks open to grab Graham (Or insert your favorite OLB) then have a flex pick in the 2nd round... GT WR D. Thomas or a crazy speedster in Jahvid Best possibly?

You like Spikes in the 2nd Bootang?

Cheers,

First Incognito...then Marshall. That's how you win the AFC East.

allen,

That's because sheesh isnt sheesh... but anywho.

Hmmm, your second round question of 3 players means no trade up and has to be there types or someone that should be in the second round?

Allen,

A few names that may be intriguing for round 2. Charles Brown. Ricky Sapp. Mt. Cody. Dennis Pitta. Devin McCourty.

Bootang,

What did u come away with on Kindle? Yea or Nay?

Armando, I like your blog, I currently live in Chicago but I lived in FL for several years and I am a Die Hard Dolphins fan!!! As a matter of fact, its close to 1:00 AM and I am reading your blog before bed...
I understand your point of view and I respect it. But other than a NT in the draft, who can bring the dolphins rewards immediately and for at least 4 years to come???????
Brandon brings it, there is a story with the guy, he hates Denver, and coach Mc Daniels is a yound gun that thinks everybody should do it the way he wants to; there is a reason Mike Nolan left the team and we picked him. With the trifecta, Ferg, JT, Chad Pennington.. Brandon can be under control + winning changes a lot of things. THERE IS NO RECEIVER IN THE DRAFT THAT BRINGS WHAT BRANDON MARSHALL BRINGS, PERIOD, END OF STORY.

Rob,

Spikes shows higher than round 2 on tape. I think for him it is important he goes to a 3-4, where he can do what he does best (Crowder role) and not have to have a Dansby role. I just hate killing a guy who made plays consistently for years in the SEC. That being said, we have Crowder, who I think will really surprise people this year paired with Dansby. So no, no Spikes at 44.

Rob

i agree with your mcclain/ spikes view--my gues is nolan is agressive and would want the safties to have range to cover---like in balitmore---he isnt like Belichick--who mostly plays zone---Mcclain would fit better in a system like NE.---

I wouldnt have a problem with Gtech WR---but jahvid best, or any NT---i dont thik they could have the impact of a spikes in a nolan attacking 3-4

I like Kindle, but not top 25. I have Jerry Hughes ahead of him. People tend to fall in love with length at that spot, and Kindle looks the part. Just not enough plays. I liken getting after the QB in the Big 12 to playing with a 17 point lead in the NFL. You rarely have to play the run. So why not more sacks?

If cody is there inn 2nd that is a no brainer but i just dont see him getting past chiefs in 2nd round

ricky sapp---i worry drafting LB with knee problems--look at crowder breaking down--I think Spikes could be a clear upgrade over crowder in his abilty to pass rush---and just make plays in pass game---crowder is awful in coverage ---he is a Limited ILB lacking insticts, on two bad need and a broken foot----i like crowder personality but its time to cut ties or cut torbor---we need another young ilb--

chaney is interesting i just dont know if parcells would take a Lb that small

Bootand and allen,

Was studying Pita and Hughes today as a matter of fact.

I think Hughes definitely has game. I would put him after Graham when I look for explosion, first step and motor. If they went in a different direction in the 1st round than OLB I could see a guy like Hughes in the 2nd.

Kindle kinda scares me too. As allen pointed out didn't have huge production but he kinda looks the part. Not sure that guy is a 24/7 I want to be the best football player type of guy... Thats all I want on the Fins.

I really liked what I saw of Pitta at TE. Good reciever in the Whitten mold. I haven't seen him block much and is a bit small to be any kind of mauler in the run game.

TE Anthony McCoy from USC looks like a plodder to me. If I have someone running patterns I want them to be at least fluid enough to dodge guys and hit seems. Pitta, Jimmy Graham, or Clay Harbor are all athletic enough to get it done. I really think Jimmy Graham TE has the best upside of anyone in the class.

Gresham and Gronk are the two leaders but both have inury concerns and both will be much higher draft picks imho.

Cheers,

I heard sparano loves MCCoy from senior bowl---he has a huge frame to throw to with long arms---but his inline blocking is sick---even better in pass protection---he had on on ones with Alulu--who is a 2nd rouns 3-4 DE in this draft---and he locked up that 300pounder 4 plays in a row---

Im a big hughes fan--i think he is more explosive then graham---he actually reminds me of freeney alot---and he looked fluid in positional drills standing up---


I might feel a little more comfortable with graham if i saw at least 1 workout be4 the draft b/c you are looking to drft this guy in a 3-4 when all his tape is him in a 4-3---

Jerry hughes is one of the most coordianted defensers i have seen in a while---you could move him anywhere once he gets stronger--inside or outside

allen,

Agreed. The only way we get Cody is trade back or WAY over draft him at #12 which I think would suck.

He can become disciplined but I hate betting on super fat guys. The Soliai size is about as big as I like to go.

Tyson Alualu DT from Cal REALLY jumped out at me today. He may not fit our scheme but he is gonna make some team very happy campers. Such a ball alert play...always has his head towards finding the ballcarrier.

Fast and near 300lbs. Should have a good career in the NFL.

Cheers,

It's funny because I obviously like Berry and Thomas, but they aren't the traditional type S, they are the type I see that position I turning into. The reason I bring it up, TE is not the same position it was 10 years ago. I think that we have 2 very good blocking TEs, so if you add a Hernandez or Pitta, they wouldn't have to block. These guys are matchup nightmares, and easily could have a bigger impact early on than a WR. Give Henne a seam killing TE and it opens everything up for Henne. Lastly, how often do you see Dallas Clark block?

So I just wonder how much Parcells has changed, if at all. If not, it will be a guy like Derrick Morgan in round 1.

Rob

I heard TE Gronkowski is a big possibilty in 2nd round

allen,

It should be VERY intersting how much Nolan can affect draft plans... he had such KILLER success with Elvis "I supposed to be too small for this" Dumervil.

It will be interesting if we see any draft picks that seem off BP's draft radar typically that get picked up.

I like Gronkowski, but back injuries are very tough things to evaluate. I would be shocked if he was picked in the 2nd round.

earl thomas size just worries me---Berry is a dream safety i agree-----

Jimmy graham TE impresses me as well--

I wish we had another 2nd---some1 sign Fasano
We gotta move thigpen---

you think there is a possibility we carry 4 qb---i find it hard to believe

Nate Allen from S. Florida would be a nice fit in the second round. Good ball skills, flies around the field, can play either saftey position so he has some flexibility. Pita catches a lot of ball up the seam,he can stretch the field, I don't think he will be taken in the 2nd round maybe the 3rd

Bootang... in regards to your, "Rob, I DID check it out..." Interesting how your overall post #5, you make response as if you and some other doooooshie (Rob) are old friends, with some age-old argument that others CARE about. Well, as I reign on your pathetic ASH parade... BITE ME, DUNG HOLE! We DO NOT frigging care about your stupid ash debates in PREVIOUS posts, or this one! YOU are a fool, and so is your buck-buddy Rob! You GET us, "bro"??? Suck it sho-mo! SUCK IT!

I like Nate Allen, have seen him 2x in person, and a few times on TV. He just can't play man. He struggles mightily turning and running with WRs.

Carlito, you are entitled to your opinion.

Rob

I thought of dumerville-but that still isnt Nolan MO--

He drafted Willis at ILB and Manny lawson in first round---

Nolan prob luvs Jpp---parcells prob loves Morgan i would be shocked if any1 else was taken---both defense minds love length and size---and even though dumerville had a great year rushn---he struggled big time vs the run---and nolan def remembers that

allen,

I would not agree with Gron in 2nd at all.

I would much rather have Pitta or Jimmy Graham after him.

I just want to see "other" spots filled before TE as I think the 1 and 2 are for at least 1 more OLB and possibly grab a NT (If they think all there guys will be gone) or grab the best S, OLB, WR that is there...

Then I would come back in the 3rd or 4rth for the Next level TE's I mentioned. Imho.

bootang

Reading my mind---im a nate allen hater---i couldnt stand his coverage or watchn Blount run him over in senior bowl--he is soft, slow

i agree with you i dont want Gronkowski--but thats is the type of player parcells loves---he is a better version of fasano---and they used a "2nd" on fasano---makes me sick to think of that

Bootang,

It's not carlito... just fyi. haters ball is in full swing

Yea it's carlito frUm golfito. All good. If people wanna talk football, great. If they wanna get involved in other stupidity, be my guest, I just won't partake in it.

i wouldnt take a NT in 2nd round----they dont deserve it unless cody----

Spikes, as a LB would have more impact then a youn nose that you have to develope---or a 2nd tier talent weak olb like sapp---no safety is worth a 2nd in my mind---leaves me at wr or spikes in my mind---but demaryius scares me b/c he doesnt run routes---played in a goofy offense---and brook his foot so we cant see him workout be4 draft--- i feel better using a 3rd on him or TE in the 3rd---you find baragin wrs in the 3rd and 4th all the time

I like Morgan Burnett from GT. 235 tackles and 14 career picks. Great happy medium between tackling machine and ballhawk. 6'1 3/8 and 209 lbs.

I think he would make a nice 3rd round pick.

Brandon marshall, TO, Boldin---3rounders

Bootang,

I don't think so... his screen name is always in blue that I have seen.

What is interesting, at our positions of need, NT and OLB, there aren't really any guys who fit that 35-50 range really. A lot of guys who are good in the 55-75 range. So we can either use 44 to trade up (maybe with KC to go get Eric Berry) or to trade down and pick up another pick or two.

Rob,

I'm saying that carlito is carlito frOm and the other was carlito frUm. Not the same.

I like Burnett in the 3rd if we have not addressed the S spot yet.

WOW allen.... NO safety worth a second is a bold statement as I know some will go there for sure.

I think NT will be the single most "CUPBOARD IS GONNA BE BARE PANIC" picks due to how many teams are going 3/4 and how in vogue getting right one will be.

I look for many of the NT types to go a round or even 2 earlier than what they are suppose to because of this.

yea you put me on him-thats was a good call out of you---i like burnett--i actually wouldnt mind him in 2-3

i agree w/ u rob on TE Pitta or Graham would look nice as phins
I think if Jimmy Graham falls to 3rd grab him and snatch Pitta w/ 4th or 5th if he is taken

you guy burnett is the only one i would take in 2nd----i think after earl there is a huge dropoff-----the safety from LSU is the 3rd best ranked Safety---chad jones---thats the type of safety that is becoming extinct----the big hitters no longer matter---cause there main intimidation strength is now a 15 penalty regardless where u hit the wr

FS i liked was robert johnson out of utah 5th rounder or nick polk from Indiana---

Johnson is a ball hawk but too stiff in man---i think Polk is an interesting option which wont go earlier than the 5th

im out brothers---hopefully we get some sharper news soon!!

Rob and Allen I am out. Have a good night. A little over 5 weeks to go!!!

beerphin,

I wish Jimmy had more film footage but that's whappens when your a basketball convert.

He sure has a mean skillset and looked like he was running on rails at the combine... he could wind up with automatic hands...he is that coordinated. The big, legthy frame that can and will get some heft after the NFL vitamin and workout regimes are applied. He is already a good try hard to get in the way guy and I think his blocking will improve.

I wasn't as sold on PITA at first but all he has done is looked smooth and seems to simply get the game...knows where to be and is good at runnin where they ain't. Strong but not as heavy as other higher rated guys at 245. He will fill out some.

I just think that its so very hard to get the one guy that fits everything blocker asn pass catcher that I wouldn't making a bid for more of a Dallas Clark type to stretch the field, draw coverage and pressure the seems.

Leave Fasano as more of an athletic blocker that can catch more occasionally.

Cheers, Bootang...have a good one!

WRONG. The risk is much less with Marshall because he is a PROVEN ALL-PRO, THE BEST WIDE RECEIVER IN FOOTBALL TODAY. He is a sure-thing, game changing WR, what the Dolphins have lacked since the days of Duper-Clayton.

allen,

Good call on the penalty flags... the refs hand them out like candy nowadays. I'm still fuming over some that Vontae got called for that should have been non calls.

The trend is defintely towards running safeties that can cover as well as tackle as offenses try to spread the def out...you sometimes have to win those 1v1 match-ups.

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