« Twelve Dolphins players get at least $100K in performance pay bonus for 2009 | Main | Void at free safety? Dolphins to look at Thomas »

On Incognito Dolphins must weigh risk, reward

Since the topic of this blog is Richie Incognito, I must explain the idea of risk versus reward.

Incognito, whom the Miami Herald reported Saturday will visit the Dolphins this week, is undoubtedly a risky proposition for the team.

He is only 26 years old and already looking for his third team. Icognito joined the Rams in 2005 and after two years as a starter in 2007 and 2008 started being viewed as one of the dirtiest players in the league by a poll of his peers. During a terrible season for his team in 2008, Incognito taunted Rams fans after a home loss. Last year he got into a sideline argument with head coach Steve Spagnuolo after head-butting two opponents in a Rams game versus the Tennessee Titans.

The guy has been referred to as "immature" and a "tool" by St. Louis media.

And yet the Dolphins like Icognito.

They like the guy enough to bring him in for the visit and while that doesn't necessarily mean he's going to sign, it goes a step beyond last season when the team claimed Incognito on waivers. The Bills also claimed him -- getting him because they stunk more than Miami -- but promptely threw him back to the talent pool this offseason where the Dolphins have on the hook again.

So one supposes you see the risk in chasing Incognito. He could still be the same immature player he's proven himself to be. Perhaps he's not that good a player which is obviously Buffalo's opinion.

But ...

Assuming the Dolphins don't do anything crazy like offering major guaranteed money -- or any guaranteed money for that matter -- this risk could pay a dividend if Incognito signs and becomes a good player.

The risk could bring a big reward if Incognito solves Miami's festering right guard problem. The position has been a turnstile for five different starters the past two years. Donald Thomas and Nate Garner shared the job and starts last year.

So what if at 6-3 and 320 pounds, with strength that is unquestionable, Incognito becomes a staple on Miami's line?

Who will complain then?

I know there are questions out there why the Dolphins would flirt with Incognito but not show any interest in other troubled players such as Brandon Marshall?

There is a difference. A big difference. Marshall presents a much greater risk. I detailed what a high risk proposition Marshall is over the weekend.

Marshall would require a big contract, draft picks and a long-term commitment atop his troubled history. The Dolphins don't need to give Incognito a big contract, give up picks and show a lifetime commitment to the offensive lineman.

So if Incognito becomes a player, great. The gamble worked.

If Incognito signs and then disrespects coach Tony Sparano as he did Spagnuolo, if he costs the Dolphins yardage with personal foul penalties, if he's the same immature player he's been to this point, then the gamble failed.

It wouldn't be the first time the Dolphins blew it on a free agent.

Except this one hopefully comes with the appropriate amount of measuring risk versus reward.

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://www.typepad.com/services/trackback/6a00d83451b26169e20120a9393555970b

Listed below are links to weblogs that reference On Incognito Dolphins must weigh risk, reward:

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

And by they way, if the Dolphins continue to play it conservative, as you are prodding them to continue, then they will fall further and further behind the hated Jets, which are putting together a very powerful team..AND IF THEY GET MARSHALL, as reports suggest they are considering, SAY GOODBYE TO THE AFC EAST TITLE.

back for a second

Im sold on spikes or Chaney in the 2nd---

Rob---this kid is flying around like he is willis---either one of these guys will be more productive for our team---then a development need pick---take the best player---

Rob---im a chaney fan--good call

im out

Jed,

I would NEVER hand over the title to the Jets!!!

If we had the lousiest team on the earth I would still want to fight them tooth and nail.

I happen to think the they LOST in the tradeoff of LT over Thomas at RB. I know Green will be their guy but he will have to do it for a whole season before I hand him a mantle.

Over the years we have played well vs LT so him getting longer in the tooth eases any chip on the shoulder he may have imho.

The Charger fans I talked to are not unhappy about losing Cromartie as they say he doesn't tackle...well the Fins will be testing that theory 2x per year.

Cheers,

allen,

Have a good one bud.

Chaney is by far the fastest ILB of the bunch too which bodes well in coverage.

Cheers,

picks
1. Mike Iupati OL Dez Bryant WR
2. Koa Misi OLB Daryl Washington OLB
3. Jimmy Graham TE Dennis Pitta TE
4. Lamarr Houston DT or Torrell Troup DT
5. Major Wright FS Kam Chancellor FS

Jed,

I think that this classic ongoing battle to get Marshall or not gets blown out of proportion.

EVERY single poster including myself (Armando too) first praises and acknowledges Marshall has mad skills on the field.

So the arguement that he will have a million catches or can catch 4 TD's a game is never in debate. He is all that and the bag of chips talent wise.

The people that don't want him think that the legal system / Goodell will end up stopping Marshall where the DB's could not. They envision the guy getting into trouble and having to pay for it through suspensions.

It's the reason with all his worldly talents he has seen littel love from anyone yet.

I think the price will drop unless Seattle decides to pull the trigger as they are the only ones to meet with him.

If Denver wants to move him they may get someone to bite for a #2 or #2 plus conditional.

Cheers,

beerphin,

Nice... stepping out with the Mike Iupati call. I think the kid will play for a long, long time at a high level in the nfl.

Once he gets to the NFL they will teach him how to hold and get away with it more as he has strong hands. He has to move his feet better to stay with his guy to avoid reaching, holding but I think he can be a solid player.

Are you saying at #12 or the ever popular trade down?

I also think Chancellor has potential as well. Big guy and if he can track the ball will be a good one vs the run for sure.

Both those TE's are my favs in the draft. The value in them is where you can get them. Gronkowski and Gresham will be much earlier choices. That frees up earlier picks in my mind.

Houstin is active and has great fluidity for a guy his size. I am not sure he can anchor vs the run to be in the middle but I would think he could play DE in a 3-4 or be a reg DT in a 4-3.

Cheers,

'member back when Kev Gogan was first considered? everybody complained... he got in, solidified the line and when he left, they all cried? Hope this kid has some Gogan in 'im!

beerphin,

I am also thinking that if I was going that high for Dez I would just assume do what I could to negotiate with Denver for Marshall. The thing about Marshall is at least he is a known talent on the field. Off the field has struggled at times to say the least.

With Dez you have a talented looking kid that has laziness red flags all over. If the Fins knarly research shows that they were rumor thats one thing but, I think they will end up finding out that he was late to a bunch of meetings, games and therefore may simply not have the drive to be crazy good. With all it takes to succeed in the NFL I want the 100% effort guys with my #12.

Just my opinion. I like your list...it has a lot of very solid football players on it.

Cheers,

John Garry,

The Incognito kid is who you're referencing?

John,

I am all for bringing him in... if he would sign the right contract he would add solid depth at the very least and should start.

He came into the league at 305lbs and now is 320-324lbs. I hope his "Rage" issues aren't steroid related.

He seems like the consumate tough guy type.

Cheers,

I see the Juggernaut going b4 20 If we wanted to solidify our line he'd be my choice to do it... Imagine Iupati next to Jake Long... we'd be competing for best OL in AFC East. I'm a huge fan of OL and DL i think they are the most under appreciated players and while i like how our O line is playing it wasznt long ago it was utter garbage. It is key for RB and young QB I think if Spiller and Bryant are gone u gotta go Iupati... Lots of Linebackers and safeties in this draft... Only one Samoan Juggernaut

who isnt lazy in college?... I see a Larry Fitzgerald like ball player in Bryant. Marshall is a lil slower and can be bested by Andre Goodman as we have seen... Dez Bryant could explode as a superstar and u'd rather have him over a proven (while in nfl) problem child/ Diva/ locker room havoc?

have Marshall meant to say

Marshall is an undeniable talent but also an undeniable ass. this is just my perspective from the media and interviews w this guy I'm up for trading our 4th this yr and next and Camarillo that is about it for Marshall

cam thomas has the same exact production as Travis ivey NT from Maryland over last two years----one is a 2nd round pick the other is a 6th and they both are projects with nfl talent---ivey 6"3 1/2--345

These NT people having being drafted early pther then cody and williams have horrible value---they are all projects and people are reaching

beerphin,

Yeah... if I had the choice of known star caliber WR in Marshall and unknown star caliber college player I would side with the vet every time.

Marshall's numbers are high enough up the food chain that I would not take the chance that an outstanding college level WR can come in and blow the lid off the NFL. I think Marshall is a top 5 type talent. Johnson and Fitzgerald I would take over him in a second but, he would not get too far down the list talent wise.

The talent eval game is so fickle that even proven guys in the NFL can and do play better or worse than on their last team due to fit, coaching style, team chemistry, luck, etc. Anytime a player changes teams from college to pros or pros to other pro teams you can never be 100%.

So I would hedge my bet rationalizing that at least Marshall put up good numbers already in the NFL in Denver... Dez simply can't make that claim yet.

All that said I would not pursue Marshall as I think he is a ticking timebomb. He can always prove me right or wrong. "IF" the tooka 2nd and "IF" he took a contract witha ton of "we don't have to pay you if" clauses I would at least entertain it. I doubt his agent would do it.

It's kinda like when Ricky signed that 1st contract in N.O. It was low on gaurantees and heavy on incentive clauses. His agent got nuked for it in the media.

Cheers,

allen,

Hopefully the Trifecta can snag a solid NT as late as possible. I like Dan Williams as the best nose prospect and Cody is doing the right things now to go high in the draft.

I agree with you there will be guys drafted late at many positions they it just gets harder. Usually there is a supposed hole in their game or they just fell through the cracks but there are 5-6-7 rounders that outplay early guys every year.

Cheers,

I think the TRIFECTA are stupid for not taking Marshall...its really stupid...he will mature now, you watch and settle down to be a Pro Bowl player for 5 LONG years with the Jets....we have GINN dont we...oh and Fasano...GREAT.!

Continually digging for the best answer here is a guy I like a TON the more I watch him. This guy would be a Godsend in the 3rd although he may go in the 2nd round.

Jamar Chaney ILB Mississippi State. Looks similar to a Weatherspoon ILB type... shorter, compact, very fast. I REALLY think he shows up big on film. He plays very quick, covers well, can sift through trash, ran the fastest by far for any ILB at the combine, has averaged 5.87 tackles a game for his career in the rugged SEC., You can tell on tape that he trusts what he sees and goes hard after he diagnosis a play. Has Blitz ability and looks like you could play him at OLB as well. Don't take my word for it... here is lots of very clear actual game footage...

VS the RUN

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LMZmeY-kgo&NR=1

VS the PASS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6FErsTC47s&feature=related

Blitzing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSWuUoOzrxs&feature=related

What do you think?

Cheers,

A big nasty o-line guy is great. It gives the running game more of a punch.

Hi Rob, appreciate your comments. The Dolphins have had so-called ticking bombs before..but in this case the risk is worth the reward and so-called problem players have been known to change their ways in a new town with a different coach. At the very least, I just want and hope the Dolphins will investigate the Brandon Marshall option thoroughly and seriously because he could really make a big difference on the football field, which is much more important than whether he has made personal mistakes in his past.

Marshall: "I am a guy who prides himself on work ethic."

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-gameday/09000d5d8134a5ed/Marshall-turning-new-leaf

There is nothing wrong with this dude. Don't believe the mis-hype anymore Dolphin fans!

"I am a guy who prides MYSELF..." made a mistake typing that..

This could be a plan to increase team speed immensly which is what we need. We were flat too slow on DEF last year and Coach Sparano was always lementing the need for chunk plays.

1.) The first step is the Fins could sign either Otogwe or Sharper whichever they think fits the most. If Otogwe's injuries are too big of a risk sign Sharper. He seems to be agitated that N. O. has not already shown him more appreciation... Like Thomas Jones he would sign elsewhere if the contract was fair enough.

The draft would go:

1st rnd: Brandon Graham to play SOLB. He pressures/sacks the QB and will NOT let runs go outside of him to his side. Ran a 4.72 at the combine. SUPER motor! Weatherspoon would be another potential pick. Can play ILB or OLB. If you could swing a trade with say the Giants that may bite in a flop of picks for McClain if he is there then you could get say an extra 3rd.

2nd rnd: Jahvid Best the do everything RB/WR/KR/PR. He is a Spiller clone and actually ran faster than him at the combine 4.35. His coach said he is very underrated as a receiver. Averaged 8.1 yards a carry as a Jr. and 6.1 as a Senior when people really loaded up for him... that sick! Last 18 games he had 27 runs of 20+ yards, 6 runs of 60+ yards and 4 runs of 80+ yards. His middle name should be "Chunk Play". RB's Ben Tate 4.43 @ 220lbs or Toby Gerhart 4.55 @ 231lbs could be other options if you like bigger backs.

3rd rnd: ILB Jamar Chaney ILB/OLB 90 tackles in SEC 2009. Active in run, pass and has blitz ability too! Ran a smoking 4.54 at the combine to lead all ILBs by a ways. He shows up big on tape. Doesn't get caught in trash, reads and runs hard to the ball. Verflexible with great change of direction. Maybe the most complete LB in the draft and weigh 242lbs.

3rd B the "Giants flop trade pick" S Morgan Burnett from GT. 6'1 3/8 209lbs ran a 4.55 in the 40 at the combine. Played in 40 games in 3 years, had 93 tackles 2008, 85 tackles in 2009. Has 14 career picks which same as Berry! Awesome all around player that can tackle and ballhawk.

4rth round TE Jimmy Graham. Tall, fast, great hand eye coordination, probably highest upside of any TE in the draft. Ran a 4.56 at the combine which was 2nd fastest amongst all the major TE's. 6'6 1/4 and 260lbs. TE Pita would be a great pick as well if Graham is gone. If both are gone G John Jerry is an impressive specimen 6'5 3/8 and 328lbs. 4 year starter. Had a great week and game at the Senior bowl and I thought outplayed Iupati in that game.

*FA Sharper or Otogwe

1.) Brandon Graham OLB/DE 4.72 @ 268lbs
2.) Jahvid Best RB 4.35 @ 199lbs
3.) Jamar Chaney ILB/OLB 4.54 @ 242
3b) Morgan Burnett S 4.55 @ 209lbs *Giant trade
4.) Jimmy Graham TE 4.56 @ 260lbs

Last part of the draft is WR,DL or BPA!

That's 4 Defenders and 2 Offensive guys and both sides would have scary fast guys!!!

Cheers,

I'm Out! Catch all you Fin fans later...

Cheers,

I hate how the fins r sitting around talking how to improve the team like a bunch of confused monkeys when the jets clearly already know...you get people. DUUHHHHHH!!! Amando - LT??? CROMARTIE??? give me a break!! U have another year Parcells. Then ull prove to the world ur an old dog with no new tricks and this is a different NFL than the one u grew to know. You have another yr, Bill.

Incognito, this story is incognito. Hijacked by the draft experts. Oh an Marshall. He isn't coming here so stop screaming for him.

Just another example of the Dolphins continueing to play it safe......oh they'll take the odd risk for an OL or LB but god forbid an actual playmaker!!!!
Any chance they work a trade out with San Diego for Ronnie before the draft, they need a RB so we hear and before anyone says nobody will trade for him till he recovers, I had the same injury and without proper rehab or treatment recovered in 8 months without no effects so he's gonna be fine!

LT report:

"The 2006 NFL MVP spent Friday with the Jets, capping it with dinner with coach Rex Ryan, general manager Mike Tannenbaum and other team officials."

With Rex "Tubby the Whale" Ryan at the table , I'll bet LT walked away from that dinner table starving! Not even the breadsticks were spared.

all in for marshall

i just saw that the Jets have made yet another move to get better as did the Broncos. Yet here the Dolphins sit. I minor upgrade at ILB and a back up QB . Its sad to watch the are dilutional. The AFC has 6 teams clearly better getting more so. They all have drafts . The fins will be watching the playoffs from home !! They have only two early picks yet need a stater at S,NT,WR (maybe 2)TE, and Both OLB spots and they do nothing............

i say brandon marshall especially if we could trade down in the first round and pick up more selections. we need alot of positions; WR being crucial. marshall make everyone better in our receiver corp. zach thomas knows him and concurs.

Another defensive oriented draft is coming. We will fill the holes and defense and ignore the offense like usual. We have one player on our team that can run but he is soft and has no clue at wr (Ginn). The rest of our skill positions are slow guys who can easily be bottled up.

The game has passed Parcells by and we are fielding a football team that resembles a team playing in the 1980's. Fins and Bills will be fighting for last place and a .500 record. Brown and Ricky are probably the oldest rb combo in the league. Ours wr's and worse than the Rams. That says it all.

The thing is, for everyone against marshall, we need him worse than ever. Why? Because this team CANNOT draft. We have the worst drafting the last five years of I think any team. Check it out. Why has parcells done? He has given us te worst wr core we have ever had, he keeps crowder, overpayed and crappy. He does crazy things like signs pennington, not only as a fourth qb but am expensive backup, ginn is still on this team (really)....gibril wilson at four mill, after paying 8 to Wilford for sucking. This team has zero playmakers (besides Ronnie, and he needs to play a full year) and we are ending chad hennes career before it begins with the worst receiving core inthe league and will do nothing about it!

Incognito is like having another Bryan Cox on the team, as in years past. Which will bring a little attitude, not mouth Joey Porter, and grit to our team. Not really a bad thing as long as he keeps it under control.

jury is still out on sparano as coach and ireland as a talent evaluator. they even have a difficult time talking to the fans who love this team. armando cant even get an interview so we may get a glimpse into what direction we are going. i really don't understand their reluctance to talk;other GM's do as well as CEO'S of major corporations. we just get coaches speak or downright misinfo! i don't think i've ever seen ireland smile or tell a joke. he always is stiff. we play the same way they act. LOOSEN IT UP!!!!

OK kids The Cuban has arrived to judge the "NJ Buffoon post of the day" Aka "The Plungies" Good luck to all lame posts, I'll be posting the winner(Or loser in this case) at 8 pm tonite.... good luck...

Why should the Dolphins sign Marshall? Ask yourself this, how would you like if he signed with the Jets? Goodbye AFC EAST for the next five years!!!

As Armando points out, even if Miami does take a risk with Incognito, I'm certain the contracts will have an easier back door to bail out of then Lady Gaga... I have watched some You Tube on the guy, he can annihilate a defensive scheme up front. As far as an pure blocker for the running game is concerned, you will be hard pressed to find better. And a talent he is also capable of which even Smiley is hit or miss in is "Blocking on the run" Smiley is known as one of the best "Pulling" guards in the NFL, but struggles to get off blocks and keep moving with the play.

Whats your thoughts Cuban" I know you generally have a good perspective?

This could be a good pickup, if they can get him for the right price and he behaves himself... Sparano likes his O-line mean and nasty

Armando,

Any chance we can get a link to the video of the headbutting?

Derek, You can never have enough Off. linemen IMO.

Why should the Dolphins sign Marshall? Ask yourself this, how would you like if he signed with the Jets? Goodbye AFC EAST for the next five years!!!

Posted by: matt r | March 15, 2010 at 09:24 AM

The early leader.....

Greg Z,

"jury is still out on sparano as coach and ireland as a talent evaluator. they even have a difficult time talking to the fans who love this team. armando cant even get an interview so we may get a glimpse into what direction we are going. i really don't understand their reluctance to talk;"

You sir are a buffoon, they do not "have a difficult time talking to fans and media" they have a policy against it.

get it?

Derek, Think about the Offensive line as a bus, If you have a tire that's "Flat" it takes away from the performance of the bus, The bus must have plenty of "Spares", there's alot of nails in the NFL........

The tuna strikes again..... Signs Dansby then goes into hibernation.....

Who is starting at Safety next year?


Wake me up when we dont have the best White WR corp in football......

Oh, I forgot, we need to perfect the Oline so we can get mount those 15 play drives and then give up 7 in 2 mins....

Shouldn't you at least act as if you read the article and try to comment on it. Seriously, five posts in and the subject was changed. Mando does allow us to have free reign in here but a little respect to the writer would be nice. So about Incognito, much like Marshall I don't want this guy on the team. He's selfish and immature and one selfish penalty can cost us a game and I

Carlito from Incognito

could see this guy blowing up on Sparano and effecting the team. I understand the low risk and you could just cut the guy at his first sign of trouble. I guess if they tell him there wil be a no tolerance policy and he will be one incident away from being cut it might not be too bad to give it a try. He could be a huge upgrade at the RG position.

Look... as far as the Marshall thing goes... I think there are a bunch of us who would love to have that guy in Miami and the whole thing work out. I'm one of um. I don't like giving up the pick... but whatever. Here is the thing... pounding it around and around in circles isn't gonna change a damn thing... >Tuna don't blog<
Marshall is the ONLY FA at this point I am of mixed feeling about. All these bums the Jests are jumping on Tomlinson, Cromartie... those noodlers are Wannstedt fodder man... been there, done that... it don't work. Thirty something washed up oft injured players don't work out. I believe this, the longer Marshall sits there without someone making a real move, (A) He ends up on a team behind a #2 and a few players, Quinn going to Denver hurt any chance of a Thigpen trade. (B) The guy has deeper issues then what we are being told. I am starting to believe (B) may be the problem... I cannot wrap my mind around why NO TEAM out of a possible 31 are willing to grab him as shallow the talent pool is for WR's.

Marshall: "I am a guy who prides himself on work ethic." That's one of the funniest things I've ever read. The video of him pouting, knocking down balls from his QBs and sitting on a water cooler staring out into space should accompany that quote.

Now that Quinn was traded for a 6th, do you like Teddy for a 4th?

Thanks for your reply "Cuban Menace".... I agree with you summation. I believe Incognito will end up here, they wanted him in December. He will go under the micro-scope... any hint of issues doing preseason and he will be on the first thing smokin' outta here....

Seems like one person is posting under a bunch of different names and whining an awful lot. And what in the hell does this mean, "Its sad to watch the are dilutional". Wow.

Why havent we moved Pat White or PigPen???

Scrub QBs are being traded left and right for reasonable 6th and 7th picks. We could find our Safety in these rounds since we dont want to pay the established Pros

Derek you are correct, Marshall is a Virus for any team that's why nobody wants him especially giving up a first rounder, Look for Denver to finally settle for a third round pick for this individual....

greg z I think you may be a bit misguided. Sparano and Ireland don't have trouble talking to the fans, they just don't do it. No trouble there except from fans who for some reason need to hear every thought they have as if running an NFL team isn't enough to do. I would rather they concentrate on making the team better rather than sit around wasting time explaining to fans their thoughts on every detail of their decisions.

Now that Quinn was traded for a 6th, do you like Teddy for a 4th?

Posted by: Waterboy | March 15, 2010 at 09:49 AM

You would have to GIVE up a draft pick to get rid of Ted(No Nuts)Ginn waterboy.......

« 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 »

The comments to this entry are closed.