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Dolphins in the market for a RB and TE coach

The Dolphins don't just have one offensive coaching job to fill, they have as many as three because they are in the market for a running back coach and a tight end coach as well as a quarterback coach.

I have learned running back coach James Saxon is gone from the staff for reasons that, well, have to do with performance. I covered him as a running back with the Dolphins and like the man so I will not tell you he was fired. Let's say he simply has not been retained.

Tight end coach George Deleone is not on the Dolphins staff anymore, either. He was not necessarily terminated. He has been hired by the University of Connecticut as an assistant to former Dolphins defensive coordinator Paul Pasqualoni, who is the new head coach at UConn.

The Dolphins, who introduced new offensive coordinator Brian Daboll today, thus must still fill positions at running back, tight end coach, and quarterback coach, assuming Daboll doesn't coach the QBs. The Dolphins earlier parted ways with offensive coordinator Dan Henning and quarterbacks coach David Lee.

That means four of the six offensive assistants the Dolphins had when the 2010 season ended have moved on for one reason or another. Wide receivers coach Karl Dorrell and offensive line coach Dave DeGuglielmo are the remaining offensive assistants still on staff.

Saxon joined the Dolphins in 2008 after a six-year run as the Kansas City Chiefs running backs coach. This season the Dolphins running backs were a tremendous disappointment. Both Ricky Williams and Ronnie Brown started the season with hopes of gaining 1,000 yards -- each.

Neither reached that goal and in fact both seemed to regress from previous seasons.

Brown gained 734 yards and averaged a career-low 3.7 yards per carry. Williams gained 673 while averaging 4.2 yards a carry. Interesting that both players are free agents and it is possible if not probable neither will be re-signed by the Dolphins.



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That picture of Daboll with his hand up reminds me of sandler when he says Disneeyland! in Bulletproof... Sparano is such a goon

Armando, you will kiss ass just to keeep your job! you are the worse, because you have no opinion except for pleasing ross so you can have privileges. Tell the truth, you know we need the number one draft next year (Luck) and that will also eliminate the three clowns you love so much! Grow a pair you high pitched girly voiced idiot!

And when it comes to goons, it takes one to know one.
Therefore, I am a goon too.

Suffer one more year and have a decade of Marino (Luck), what would you choose? I have been a season ticket holder for 10 years! Not anymore. Oh, again grow some balls Armando.

Is it just me or does Armando look like a fat Jared from subway commercial

Suffer one more year and have a decade of Marino (Luck), what would you choose? I have been a season ticket holder for 10 years! Not anymore. Oh, again grow some balls Armando.

Posted by: alaindelon | January 20, 2011 at 12:57 AM

I am actually CelineDion.
I am a female - that's why I talk about male structures.




I would swap all next years picks for LUCK....Ditka anyone..?????

15 (- 25 trade down) QB any1 of top 4
2nd rd Jon Baldwin Pitt/ Torrey Smith wr
3rd rd Jaquizz Rodgers rb OSU/ Demarco Murray OK
4th rd Rob Housler te FAU
5th rd Lee Ziemba og AU/ Zach Hurd og Uconn
6th RD Chris Culliver db SC
7th RD Alex Linnenkohl c Oregon St

Hiring Daboll could be a good thing or another bad decision by this FO. Why was there such a rush to get this done? No one else was clammering for him and it would have made sense to wait and see if a position coach from one of the teams that actually made the play-offs would have been available to come in and handle the OC duties. At least interview some of them. But, now we've got Daboll and at least he shouldn't take naps during games like Henning did. Although, from what everyone says about him, he may be Dan Henning 2.0!

It is funny how these blog comments are just a breeding ground for negativity. 1 out of every 10 comments is actually insightful. If you think the Dolphins are so bad go root for the Jets or Pats and stop coming here with your doom and gloom. Postive thoughts people, I am sure we are all true fins fans let us support and hope things will work out. 0-16 and I will still rep Miami Dolphins!!!!!

Somebody tell TS that Larry Curley and Mo are looking for a come back, or maybe Larry, Daryl and Daryl they will fit in (excluding Mike Nolan) with the rest of the losers club.

I love the people who come on here and say how only the posts they like are insightful. Funny thing is, their post saying that never provides any insight!

Here's some insight to all trufinfans, Miami hasn't won a SuperBowl in almost FORTY years. They haven't won a Playoff game in over a DECADE. They have only MADE it to the Playoffs TWICE in this past DECADE. They're coming off 2 7-9 seasons, and are most likely about to start the season with their what, 13th, 14th new QB since Marino.

So, yeah, I think despair and negativity is a natural response to a record like that. If some people are so happy-go-lucky and enjoy losing year in and year out that it doesn't matter what sh*tty product is on the field, they'll just cheerlead on the sidelines, and that floats their boat, so be it.

But the rest of us, who actually, you know, WANT OUR TEAM TO WIN, we get upset at mediocrity. And will continue to until the franchise turns it around.

So why don't you optimists for no apparent reason go follow another sport, where winning and losing don't matter, since you obviously don't know the goal of a football season.

Go tony it's your birthday Tony is back and I'm glad

It's pointless to talk about draft picks and positions before the combine..... I got alil money that says mark Ingram won't even be the best rb in the draft..... Position coaches 1st..... Fire the saprano underling guegliazamo or what ever his name is and get a real Oline coach.... And THEN the combine and draft board..... But the main concern has to be oline. Tom brady sucks when there is no time to throw, and rbs can't run when there ain't no holes to run through. And our oline can't get fixed with other teams backups and practice squad players...... The only 2 remotely solid guys on our line are Long and Carey.... (and Carey is borderline) gotta spend sum early picks on oline.

I LOVE how other guys come on this blog and use say how the LOVE somebody's post when in reality thier just using the word LOVE in a really, really sarcastic way.....I just LOVE that....

just funning DC....

henne = 0-16.

lol kris. But you feel me right? It's deja-vu. LeVar was saying the same thing on 106.7 last night kris. People were calling in saying he was too negative on the Redskins. And he was like, "I'm going to tell you the truth. I don't WANT it to be this way. I don't WANT to tell you this team is dysfunctional, but that's the reality. So I'm not going to come in here and lie to you just to make you feel better."

And I respect that. Let's just call a spade a spade. We'll all be cheering on Sundays in Sept. But it's January. After another mediocre season. Can the fans vent at ALL? Or are we hurting the poor millionaire and billionaire's feelings?

Good morning fellas,

Miami wants to change their direction on offense and are deciding the coaching was the problem. I agree and also disagree. Miami's offensive play calling was bad last year but so was the mismatched offensive talent.

Ronnie Brown has never lived up to his lofty expectations. He has been a huge disappointment season afer season and I hope he is not retained. I don't want him to have an incentive laden contract. I don't want a franchise on him because he isn't worth it. Brown didn't average over 4 yards a carry in any game after week 4. Ricky Williams on the other hand averaged 4.2 by the same injured/average offensive line. Players were the problem in the case of RB but also coaching because Ricky should have gotten a few 20 plus carry games.

TE is problem because Fasano isn't good enough to consistantly get open. He had his most effective year when he was in a 2 TE set. David Martin and Fasano combined to have a nice season in 08 but Fasano is slow, plodding and drops too many passes for a guy who gets limited opportunities.

HeHateJets, amen brother. The last person I want to see us draft is Ingram. Not sure why people are so high on him. Tried to get someone to answer yesterday, but I got all opinion and no one could give me any factual evidence what the big deal is with that guy. He's a younger Ronnie Brown, that's what I see in him. And we don't need a young Ronnie Brown. We need a Peyton Hillis or a Chris Johnson or an Adrian Peterson without the fumble issues. That's who we need at RB.

Andy, they definitely need to upgrade personnel in many areas.

Unfortunately, I think they'll go in the opposite direction as you would like. I see them retaining Brown (especially if they're thinking Ingram) and getting rid of Ricky, probably because of age. I would love to see a LaSean McCoy-type speed back with a bruiser like Ronnie/Ricky. That would be a good 1 2 punch. And I do see them upgrading TE, so hopefully that helps.

DC Dolfan,

Hey what's up bro? I personally like Ingram a lot. I wasn't in your conversation yesterday but I will give you my reasons.

Ingram is a complete back. He can run the ball hard between the tackles. He isn't fast for NFL standards but a lot of very good RB's weren't fast that could of played in any NFL era. He is not like Ronnie at all to me. Ronnie is a frustrating guy to watch. He gets knocked around like he is 200 lb RB too often. Ronnie makes a highlight bounce off one guy, run over the next and run through another but that happens like twice a season. He can't do it on a regular basis because he is a lemon. He will break down or he just does it to players like small DBs but weeek to week he is SOFT. Ingram is a bruiser. He knows what he is. He don't tip toe and run cute like Brown. Ingram also has great hands and for a college RB I can't recall a guy more willing to pick up a linemen or a LB on a blitz.

A lot of people compare him to Emmitt Smith. I don't see that sort of player but do see a notch or 2 below and compare him to Edgerrin James. And no contrary to Armando's belief James was not fast. He was a 4.55 40 guy at best.

Speaking of 40 times, Ingram's draft position comes down to his 40 time. If he can manage at least a 4.55 he is a top 20 pick.

DC Dolfan,

That's funny I saw in your post at 9:12 you referred to Ronnie as a bruiser. Ouch, bro. Ronnie is far from a brusier. He is 230 lbs but tries to run like a LeSean McCoy at times. I am with you on that. I like the LeSean McCoy types too but Daboll didn't exactly clarify what sort of offense this will be. Is it going to be an offense with a RB that catches a lot of balls or a pound it offense. Daboll saying Miami will do a little this and a little that or whatever works leaves me with the same question mark qe had last year as having no identity on offense. The one thing I did like was him saying he would line guys up in unfamiliar alignments and motion guys to create mismatches. I pointed out previously the Eagles offense does it all the time. They line up Brent Celek wide left and DeSean Jackson as a RB and LeSean McCoy as a slot WR. They do a lot of things that work to create mismatches. I hope Miami does the same.

Andy, thanks for the insight into Ingram. I only saw him play a few times, so only went off that small amount of info + what others have been saying.

But, taking your description, I'm still not in love with him as a pick. For the reason you said he might drop in the draft, speed. We need speed at RB, WR, CB, LB, even TE. I'm just not sold on running between the tackles anymore. Especially against teams like NE, Jets, Steelers, Ravens, where the middle IS the strength of their defense, it's pointless to try and drive it up in there. I'm not saying never run between the tackles, but that's ALL we've done last few years, and have become a 1-trick pony that way. I'd rather see someone with more speed at RB that can bust open a 60, 70, 80 yd. run. That would help this offense become more explosive and dynamic.

not sure why in the world you need a RB coach. Either the RB has it or they don't

I say bring back Pennington as a coach\QB

Andy, I say Ronnie is a bruiser because of the way he runs (up the middle, shoulder down). Yeah, he dances at times, but he's not a sweep-type back. I don't see him avoiding contact. He always lowers his shoulder. I do accept that he gets caught from behind too much and he dances and when he lowers his shoulder it's never to run over someone but to run into them, that's all fair I think. But I think he's more of a bruiser (or wannabe bruiser) than a speed back or a finesse back. But I see how people might think that when he's tapdancing at the line.

DC Dolfan,

You make a great point about playing to the strength of other teams like the Jets and Pats and running up the middle. I hear you on that and you are right but you can only pick players in the draft or FA to a certain extent. For example getting a difference maker at WR because of a Darelle Revis but sometimes you have to be the trend setter and say this is what WE do. And Miami isn't going to far from what they have been doing as far as wanting to be a run first team. If you are going to be a running team you need to have a legit RB that can take over a game. Every one has their opinions but mine is Ingram is a legit 1300-1400 yard back (barring it's still a 16 game season).

Like I have said before on here....in the past 10 years we have drafted with our #1 pick....2 defensive back....2 O-line men......and a DE.....

Those are are good postions to draft....but you don't build aroud O-line men....you don't build around a DE....sorry...you just don't...you can't even build around a WR....the Lions even showed us you can't build around arguably the greatest RB of all time.....although I guess the DOLPHINS also proved they coudn't build around the greatest QB of all time....

In any case by hook or by crook....by Henne or another QB...we have to solidify this postion....

DaBall has already implied that he he will explore all options....

WithSparano...he will all DaBoll to any and everything.....wether he passes or fails it will 100% be on DaBoll's ability's.....this is his BIG SHOT....lets see what he's got....

You like Ingram as RB, and I say Murray. You respond that both would be nice. But that is kinda like having your cake and eating it too.

My idea is that either would be an upgrade to Ron&Ric. However, Ingram is projected as a 1st round pick, Murray (unimaginably)3rd. Probably 2nd round.

As HE-HATE-JETS bets, Ingram wont live up to his Heisman status in the NFL. I got a lil $$$ to wager same.

Trade Brown, and several others that just can't cut it (Chrowder, etc.) and work with that to our advantage. Get our 2nd round pick back, even if its a late pick. That should solve the RB problem: Murray, late 2nd round.

But the Oline is our top priority. Period! Without a good one, the team remains disfunctional. Regardless of weapons. We dont neccesarily need to use our 1st round draft on this problem, but it can be traded down to likely address two keys to the OL in one shot.

Kinda like killing 2 birds with one stone.

Gotta get to the dock, grind alil chum...

Andy/kris, so I guess kris isn't on-board with McShay's mock draft saying we'll pick Pouncey (C Florida) and Andy IS on board with Kiper (Ingram).

I'm sure you've both opined on this, but I just saw the Vince Young interview. Now, don't get me wrong, he's DEFINITELY not the long-term answer. But he could be a short-term fit, especially if we trade/drop Thigpen and obviously are retaining Henne. Also, Young could provide some of the speed we need and might fit well with a bruiser back like Ingram. I'm liking the Young direction more and more. Sure, he's not an accurate passer, but he's a gamer, brings a different look to the team and is a proven winner in this league. He's also going to want to impress and continue his career, so I see him being on his best behavior. Plus he'll be cheap and won't cost any draft picks.

Comes down to I think we could do worse than Young. Obviously, my dream of a 1st-round QB draft pick is looking more and more like it ain't happenin', and other "pocket-passers" are going to cost picks/money, and we DEFINITELY need competition for Henne, and at least we should all be able to agree that Young IS an upgrade from Thigpen.


I like DeMarco Murray too. He is very shifty and has nice speed and quickness. The knock on him is he disappeared too many times behind a blue chip offensive line. But that happens in college.

I think the biggest issue is his injury history. He had a dislocated knee cap. Once you dislocate your knee cap it is so much more likely for it to happen again. It might not ever happen again but it could. I dislocated my knee cap when I was 16 playing football and it didn't happen again until last winter when I simply stepped on ice and planted my feet just so I wouldn't slip and my knee turned sideways bro. So that could be an issue

Dear Mr. Salguero

The picture of Tony Sparano and Brian Daboll on the Herald site looks oddly similar to Will Ferrel and Chris Katan from "A night at the Roxbury".

Could that be a editing error ?

Soiled :)

Dear Mr. Salguero

Little known fact

The photo of Tony Sparano and Brian Daboll was taken just outside of a Clarion Inn on ladies drink free night.

Still the Dolphins couldn't score.

Soiled :)

Soiled....that is the "best picture ever"...its going up in my man-cave to kick the season....YEAH.....

DC...gotta do some work...i'll answer you later

Work shmirk. kris, you're the CEO, ACT LIKE IT! Anyway, where are your priorities man? Dolphins, THEN work!

Why is everyone okay with blaming Henne for Hennings inept offense yet no one will allow themselves to make the same excuse for Daboll? He didn't have stellar play at QB in Cleveland. He had 3 mediocre to bad qbs. Anderson had one good season, so did Thigpen. Wallace, McCoy, unproven with no experience. Almost the same situation yet you blame him. Is it too hard to ask fans to allow someone to prove themselves on your team before hating them. To give someone a new chance before judging them. Plent of coaches have gone from losing situations to situations where they thrive. It's possible that could happen here, it is possible.

So to help him along in getting making our offense better everyone has decided to call the guy every name in the book while questioning his intelligence and coaching ability without even having seen the guy coach our offense. So really what you're doing as fans is counterproductive. You want your new offensive coordinator to be successful so instead of letting him be comfortable in his surroundings and get underway you put massive amounts of pressure on him by tearing him apart and questioning his hiring which isn't going to do a thing to change it. It makes no sense.

I have to admit, I like Tony Sparano personally. I think he's a good guy. If he can turn the team around and gets retained as Coach, I won't shed a tear.

Then again, if the team stays mediocre, I won't shed a tear if he leaves either.


I am on board with you that Miami needs to draft a QB in the 1st round. This isn't that elite QB class but there are 4 guys with 1st round talent to me. Ryan Mallett, J. Locker, Cam Newton and Gabbert. But I think you are right with Sparano staying I don't see there being a chance in hell that Miami drafts a QB so that's why I switched my focus to the putrid running game and Mark Ingram.

As far as VY coming to Miami, I would like it. I think he is a very talented QB that hasn't put an ounce of that talent to use because he is not a hard worker. I think he is also very immature. I saw the interview and he was asked was he still an elite QB or was he a starting QB still. I can't recall which but he answered with a half smirk and laugh and said that's funny. I shook my head like he still is an arrogant athlete that don't earn anything he just expects it. So although I do like VY and his talent I am not sold he would work but if a QB isn't drafted he is worth the risk to me simply because he does have a winning record as a QB and does have talent he just needs to mature and finally get that he is not above the team and has to WORK HARD at his craft.

gulfdolphin, the frustrating thing is that Henne is AWESOME at practice. The coaches have said time and time again how he hits every receiver and makes all the reads during practice and it hasn't translated to the field yet. Sparano stated in back to back games this year that Henne had his best days of practice throwing something like 27 for 30 and 24 for 27 with a couple tds each time. So my big question is why can't he carry that over to regular games? Is the defense playing soft in practice and if so why? How would that help your qb get better? Or is it some other reason? I just don't know but I hope a new qb coach can find out and get Henne over that hurdle.

Drafting a qb in the 1st is a huge mistake imo. I know we need one but lets not pass over better players to draft someone out of position. All of the qbs are projects, none are said to be NFL ready and have too many kinks to work out. We need someone on offense who can make an immediate impact. We can not afford another qb bust and taking a projected 2nd or 3rd rnd qb with our first round pick and having that guy become a bust could be a nightmare for this team. Play it safe, take a speedy wide out or dynamic RB.

DC Young had Chris Johnson and a top 10 o-line. He wouldn't have anything resembling that here and if you think his accuracy was questionable there wait until you get a glimpse of him behind this 3rd year rebuilt o-line of ours. Disaster.

phins78, I agree that Daboll should get to show what he can do before he's dismissed. However, I think people are responding to what he did in Cleveland because they had the same problems as our offense (and it didn't seem like he had answers).

But, to your point, I think he'll have more weapons here, I think he learned from that experience, I hope he sees the mediocrity of coaching and playcalling, and works hard to fix all of that.

On Henne, there are conflicting reports. You say the coaches all say Henne was great in practice. Greg z. who goes to camp and seen him first-hand, said Henne was horrible. So, which do we believe? And more importantly, who cares, because in the games, Henne was mediocre. But he'll have his chance too. Right now, he's our starter. We'll see if he keeps that spot or loses it. If he keeps it, we'll see if he grew and learned anything or not. But again, people are going on all they can go on, which is his stats and game record, and again, they've both been mediocre.


You have to think for one Henne can't get hit in practice so he sits comfortably back there. Also in practice teams rarely blitz. They go basic vanilla against the offense so the offense gets work in too. If the defense is godo and offense bad then and that D shuts out the O in every practice then they O isn't getting quality reps.

I have made this point a few times about Henne. He has good games versus teams that run 4-3 and only rush their front 4 (Titans, Raiders some of Henne's better games) but against the 3-4 (Ravens, Steelers, Browns, Pats, Jets) or even 4-3 teams that blitz (Lions shifted and moved their D-Line) he sucks. The blitz affects all QBs even good ones but Henne is affected just by the look of a blitz. The blitz doesn't even have to reach him. Just the idea of not knowing where the blitz is coming from rattles him. The game has never slowed down for Henne.

I said it before good coaches see that Henne struggles against this so as more and more tape has come out on him teams are using that 3-4 or blitzing Henne because the game is too fast for him. The reason other coaches don't blitz and use the front 4 pressure is stubborness that their philosophy is best in win, lose or draw.

These guys will do to Ronnie and Ricky what they did to JT. Well, we might want you back, but let's see how the draft goes.

Honestly, that would be a mistake. The problem with the running games has more to do with the O-line than anything else. Both these guys can still play.

Having said that, Mark Ingram wouldn't be a bad pick at 15. However, I'd like us to give up picks this year and next to move up and get Cam Newton.

Mike B,

I agree the o-line is a problem but Ricky averaged 4.2 behind that same shaky o-line. Ronnie has never lived up to #2 overall pick. He sucks to me. He is 230 lbs but runs like a 200 lb RB. I hope Miami revamps their backfield. Ronnie stinks.

It does scare me that Ronnie is injury-prone (and now 30yrs old).

This is going to be an interesting draft if the CBA doesn't get done because although the draft still takes place there will be no free agency period until the CBA is resolved.

So Miami might very well draft a QB in round 1 not knowing how they could upgrade the position. They may not intend to bring back R. Brown but might have to if they don't go after a RB in the draft.

Yeah, you're right Andy. Messes up the whole dang offseason. I hope they just grind it out and get an agreement by March. Then some things can play out so teams know how they want to approach the draft. Looks like a bunch of non-seniors are coming out anyway though.


Posted by: DC Dolfan | January 20, 2011 at 08:29 AM

DC @ 8:29. Good post.

Miami has been so poor for so long, losing has become acceptable & almost common place. Just the thought of getting back to mediocrity is a saving grace for some fans & a reason to preach patience.

In the NFL, at the end of the season, there is 1 champ & 31 chumps. No prizes for 2nd place & beyond.

Ideally if Miami can find a way to move back in round 1 to pick up that 2nd round draft pick then Miami could either go best offensive linemen available with that late round pick or get Ryan Williams from Va Tech. I like Williams a lot he is fast and shifty. He reminds me a little of DeAngelo Williams from Carolina who happens to be a free agent btw. The only problem with him is he only shows glimpses of that ability. He shares carries at Va Tech and also has had a few injuries in college. Nothing major as far as injuries just the usual wear and tear on RBs.

A player who might be a look in round 2 is Bilal Powell from Louisville. He is 6 ft 215 lbs and is blazing fast. He breaks off long runs on a weekly basis. I will have to look up his stats but he has big time speed and watched him in his bowl game vs Souther Miss. I am going to be paying close attention to him in the Senior Bowl this year.

2011: SHORT TERM PLAN - TRADE (Package)LB Channing Chowder W/ Ronnie Brown for a 2nd rounder or, W/Ricky for a 3rd.

MID-TERM: From Free agency, pick-up OL, Rush and Cover LB and Safety.

Posted by: QE | January 20, 2011 at 12:29 AM

I'm not sure how many times it's been said but you cannot trade players that are not under contract.

Good morning... If the CBA is not resolved before the draft. There is no way that we can draft a first round quarterback. To use a pick on a player that will not be a starter THIS year is crazy. And because if the CBA is not resolved this means no camps, no practice. No chance for our new toy to even get unwrapped. Unless this gets resolved, we need forget drafting a first round project.

Andy, I think we should trade back and pick up a 2. Then trade out of the 1st all together if we can to acquire a 1 or 2 next year & some later picks this year.

The likelyhood is that these guys are gone at seasons end. I don't want them drafting high selections that another coach or Gm may not want.

Acquire some ammo to make some draft moves next year & in the early part of the draft.

Bilal Powell's career stats:

229 carries for 1405 yards and 6.1 average, 11 TDs. Also 18 receptions for 158 and 3 TDs.

Had long runs of 80, 47, 74 and 85 yards this year.

Not only that Joe, NOTHING can be traded until the CBA is worked out...

I believe we'll see a world of difference in playcalls and adjustments with Daboll. But unfortunately Henning wasn't the only problem.

Sparano: Can a tiger change his stripes? Hard to change coaching philosophy. Shula did it but Sparano? Better game day coaching? I doubt it.
Ireland: Already stated he's going to continue to look for acorns. IMO, worse at his job than Sparano.
Philosophy: Bigger is better, position flexibility, ultra conservative-play not to lose...all these need to change but will they?

Oh yeah, we don't a QB either.

Joe Schmoe,

There is a strong chance Miami trades back to pick up that extra second and being able to draft 2 players to help this team immediatley within the first 64 total picks (1st 2 rounds) but this regime isn't worried about the 2012 draft and acquiring extra picks for it.

Sparano knows he is only in Miami by default and Ireland should know although he was retained this year he isn't too far from being fired with another losing or no playoffs.

So I don't see that happening under any circumstances.

Joe....saw your post yesterday....pretty much agree with everything you said.....lol

Today though...not so much.....

I never believe in trading back.....never....imo you if you can't get what you want...then take the best player available....then you have trade bait (ie...the stater who just lost his job) for next years draft....

But I think you nhave to take 1st rd talent....no matter what postion it is in.....

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