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Mark Ingram? Is he No. 15 overall special?

Why Mark Ingram? What is the facination with this young man?

I get that he is the 2009 Heisman Trophy winner. I get that he is is an upstanding man. I get that he played for a great program at Alabama and in perhaps the most competitive league (SEC). But what is it about him that makes all the so-called draft gurus say he's going to be the Dolphins' choice in the first round of the April 28 draft?

Personally, I believe the Dolphins will select from the school of great need. They will select trade down.

Have I said it often enough? This team needs more picks more than ever with a likely coming rookie wage scale making draftees more valuable and cheaper than ever at a time the Dolphins lack a second round pick. So trading down in the first round and getting back a late second-rounder -- as Miami did last year -- or perhaps and early third-rounder, is a huge necessity.

Failing that, however, would the Dolphins use their pick on the 5-10 and 215-pound Ingram?

There's multiple ways of looking at this. From a historical and philosophical perspective is one way and that one suggests Miami should not go with Ingram.

Last season a alone a swing around NFL backfields revealed only two difference-making backs that were picked in the first round. Those were Adrian Peterson and Chris Johnson.

Other RBs picked that early were not nearly as impressive. Ryan Mathews, Reggie Bush, Knowshon Moreno, Beanie Wells, Donald Brown, and closer to home, Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams were not difference makers despite being former first-round picks.

And in the meantime, running backs that didn't have that type of draft pedigree did make a splash. LeGarrette Blount was undrafted before doing fine work for Tampa Bay as a rookie. Arian Foster led the league in rushing and his pedigree is he was not drafted and toiled on Houston's practice squad before exploding onto the scene.

The point is effective running backs can be found throughout the draft and sometimes as free agents as well. 

Special running backs, of course, are different.

Special ones like Marshall Faulk or Edgerrin James or Peterson are more than worthy of a high pick. But that leads us to the next perspective we must discuss in breaking down the Ingram possibility: Is he special?

He doesn't have great size as established above. He doesn't have great speed as evidenced by his 4.63 time in the combine and then 4.55 time at his Pro Day. By the way, what was going on with this kid around combine time that he was so unimpressive?

OK, well, maybe he's a monster on the field? He was very, very good in 2009 when he earned the trophy. But he was hurt much of 2010. He is a plugger. He merely plug away, plugs away in 5-, 6-, 4-yard bursts to get his yards. The 85-yard runs? The screen passes where he made two guys miss? The run up the middle where he ran around a linebacker and through the chest of a safety?

I didn't see that.

Don't get me wrong. Ingram is a nice player. He's a good player. I'd love for the Dolphins to have him. But I would hate for them to invest the No. 15 pick in the draft to get him.

Please remember that the draft is about getting value as well as a good player for your pick. Think about that because that idea has worked against the Dolphins previously.

I point you to 2008 when the Dolphins could have picked QB Matt Ryan with the first pick. They picked Jake Long. Long is a wonderful player. He's been a Pro Bowl player each of his first three seasons. But he's a left tackle.

He'll never lead a team to a Super Bowl. He'll never have the ball in his hands when the game is decided. He'll never be a difference-maker. So yes, the Dolphins got a great player with their first overall pick in 2008.

But they would have gotten more value if they had chosen Ryan, who is a very good quarterback and might someday do those things I just mentioned that a difference-making player can provide. Again, value can be just as important as production with the draft.

The 15th overall selection, provided Miami doesn't trade, should bring a special player. That pick should go to a difference-maker.

I believe Ingram will be a good platoon back. But a guy opposing defenses will have to game-plan for throughout the next four or five years?

I might need an eye exam. Because I don't see it.

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I am glad I'm not Jeff Ireland and Co. I will only watch, which for some People is good.

VEGETABLE MARKET

fin4, I believe you, slip of the keyboard. All is forgiven.

FIN4LIFE IS A MAN OF HONOR .

ALoco,

The only thing that justifies moving up is if a top 5 player falls 6-10. The huge problem with that is when this happens we could be only one of 9 teams(#7-#15) looking to move up. The closer you are to that player that falls. The cheaper the move up price will be.

Sitting at #15, our best case scenario is if that player fell out of the top 10 completely. Then we should consider moving up.

Why would I compare talking about a better Football team to the biggest mass murderer in History, although this doc. is making it`s case for Stalin, starved and killed 4.4 million Ukrainians in the war, wow !!!

Odin, if I take I-75, what exit do I take in MI?

DB ,


YOU R RIGHT MOST OF THE TIME BUT DON'T YOU THINK SOME LUCK INVOLVED IN THE DRAFT,IT'S NOT ALL MATH ,YOU NEED SOME LUCK TO GO FOR THE PLAYER YOU WANT AT 15 OR MOVING UP TO GET A BETTER PLAYER THAN MOST .


P.S... PRETEND WE STILL HAVE THE DOCTOR WHO LOOKED AT ODIRCK AND HE SCREW UP AGAIN ANOTHER 2 ROUND PICK IN 2011 ,OR WE GOT PAT WHITE COUSIN .

No ALoco, Im not advocating more picks for the sake of having them. I like multiple 3rd rd picks because these players are sitting there:

Titus Young, Jernel Jernigan, Kendall Hunter

Having 2 3rd rd picks gives us chance of landing 2 of these 3 really good offensive players.

In MI?

In this particular draft the only player who I will entertain the idea of trading up for is AJ Green A.K.A. Baby Megatron but the asking price will push us out of the market. I use to be all for trading up or trading next years #1 in rd.2 ala JJ if I thought the player was worth it and had my opinion swayed by some of the bloggers on here, you never know what next years draft holds and you want to be holding 5 aces for any eventuality. That said if there is no bonafied megastar sitting there and some team wants a player for need then I would happily trade down for the right price.

I love our team physicians. Bought them very nice Christmas presents.

Jameer Nelson just at a game winning 3pt'er with 5 secs left in regulation for the Orlando Magic to beat the Denver Nuggets! LOL...........

I HEAR YOU DB.

STILL,I CAN'T TRUST A DOCTOR WHO CAN'T SPEAK ENGLISH .

ALoco, are you sure that Odrick is done for? Don't scare me, man. A lost 1st round pick sets a Team back for 1 year.

OSCAR,


ODRICK RECOVERY GOING VERY BAD ,THAT'S WHY YOU DON'T HEAR ABOUT IT ,HE STILL LIMPING AND BEHIND IN THE RECOVERY ..EVEN IF HE COMES BACK HE BE OUT VERY SOON ,I HOPE NOT .HE HAS 2 INJURED LEGS.

Finally my in-laws, all right gang I`m off forget I-75, gonna go Tamiami Trail all the way should be in Naples by 10:45, have a good one all, catch you Sunday Night.

DB....I like sure fire starting talent.....not 3rd rd special teams players.....we don't develop talent very well.....if you join our team as a 3rd rd draft pick you will be traded 2 years later for a 5th...that is not progression...thats not developing players.....

That is the main problem with this crew.....Players don't get developed....

Before I go Aloco has a point drafting a guy who had a metal rod inserted in his leg to fix a break in College is a risky poposition in rd.1, since were talking risks

BEST SHOW ON TV... HOUSE HUNTERS INTERNATIONAL ON HGTV .


GREAT HOUSE FOR 200,000 IN TURKY .I AM WATCHING NOW .

I agree about Ingram, but disagree about Matt Ryan and Jake Long. Jake Long is an elite left tackle in only three years. Ryan is not an elite QB. The only problem with drafting Long over Ryan is that we have lost draft positions since he was drafted. Without him, we would still be picking in the top 10 and at the bottom of the league because our QB's would be on their back every play.

Redsky,

The Spring Break party will be in St. Ignace. That's right on I-75 as soon as you cross the Mackinac bridge.

Go past there about 30 miles hit the Rudyard exit into nowhere. Turn left at the top of the exit for about 10 miles farther into nowhere.

When you hit the blimking light that'll be MY village!

Look for the bonfire and beer cans. Watchout for the bears and coyotes'

Kris,

The problem hasnt been 3rd rd picks. The problem has been Ireland/Parcells drafting thier egos using the 3rd rd picks.

Titus Young, Jernnigan, and Kendall Hunter arent st's players. They are all guys that can make significant contributions to whomever drafts them(3rd rd).

PS- My greatest fear is Ireland drafting his ego no matter the round! LOL............

ODIN,


YOU DON'T TALK FOOTBALL ANY MORE ? FOR DAYS NOW YOU R TALKING ABOUT STUFF YOU LIKE AND HAS NO THING TO DO WITH FOOTBALL .......

I told ALL of you Odrick was a bad pick last year! Armando and I argued over it, then he Odrick got hurt, and I said he wouldn't be back....if you recall, Armando said he'd be back in two weeks....I said he wouldn't, but you all and Armando busted my balls about it, I also told you Henne wasn't it! But no one believed me....except Odin, and Ray and spike from the other blog!!!

The big issue is not a running back, its the center and guards, if they can't do the job no back will help us at all, fix the O line first. Bill

Man, there is so much up in the air for us Fans! No news whatsoever what is going on in this disagreement between the NFL, owner... I don't want to get started, Goodnight. No way Miami can win with a rookie QB. There.

Odin got directions, I think you said 4/1-3/2011....my cellphone is 305-796-9742, call me....I'm going to try to get there, it'd be an honor and a blast!!!!

Bill, the big issue is a center, as you said, but a qb and rb are more critical. There are other issues to address on the Oline, Special Teams and defense.

YOU DON'T TALK FOOTBALL ANY MORE ? FOR DAYS NOW YOU R TALKING ABOUT STUFF YOU LIKE AND HAS NO THING TO DO WITH FOOTBALL .......

Posted by: ALoco | March 18, 2011 at 09:52 PM


AND....................

I'm not sure I'm understanding you.

OH WAIT!

Let's see:

No CBA

Player greedy

Owners greedier

Ireland is a panzy and THINKS he's smarter than everyone.

We probably CAN"T trade down

Missing our 2nd rounder

Hows that?

Hope I didn't leave anything out.

Now if you don't mind, I was trying to teach a beautiful young Blue eye'd Blonde how to play and old ACDC song.

Bottoms Up!!!!

The problem hasnt been 3rd rd picks. The problem has been Ireland/Parcells drafting thier egos using the 3rd rd picks.

Titus Young, Jernnigan, and Kendall Hunter arent st's players. They are all guys that can make significant contributions to whomever drafts them(3rd rd).

PS- My greatest fear is Ireland drafting his ego no matter the round! LOL............

Posted by: DyingBreed | March 18, 2011 at 09:51 PM


Too true Dying and that's all you need to know about this draft. Not a big fan of trading down (Odrick Misi????)but looking at the 1st round, yep that's the way to go.

BTW Mando, you forgetting Ricky as 2009 MVP? Isn't he in the record books?

Hey Armando, You need and eye exam. Yeah I'd like to see a trade down but for the right reasons (players). There trade down last year didn't produce much (yet). Effective running backs can be found later in the draft, you'll need to do some more research on that one and see who the Dolphins have drafted over the years at the position (mostly garbage). Be careful what you wish for

Now she wants me to teach her Smoke On The Water.

God I love Blondes................every chance I get!!!!

Bottoms Up!!!!

Redsky,

If this is really your number 305-796-9742

Can I call you right now?

Hold on, I'm going to backtrack it.

Where did you say you lived?

hello are you are there or what

I don't understand why are so many down on Ingram? 15 ain't too high to take a prospect like him. I looked at youtube highlights of about 5 backs in this years draft and he looks to me the best.

Agreed! Ingram is not a special player.

They should grab Mikel Leshoure. He's got decent speed, and a great burst through the hole. Far better than Ingram.

Imposter Odin,

You can't be me!

You ain't no Viking Punk!


I got the MUNCHIE'S!!!!

ValHalla!!!!

Trade back draft mock
1st Gabe Carimi OL
2nd Greg Little WR
3rd Rob Housler TE
4th Ricky Elmore DE/OLB
5th Alex Green RB
6th Byron Maxwell CB
7th Taylor Potts QB

Alternate reach mock
1st Gabe Carimi OL
2nd Ryan Mallet QB
3rd Randall Cobb WR
4th Chris Carter OLB
4th Chris Culliver FS
5th Ricky Elmore OLB
5th Alex Green RB
6th Byron Maxwell DB
6th Henry Hynoski FB
7th Andrew Jackson OG
7th Willie Smith OT

What is the ACTUAL chance of us drafting that "Field General" we so very deperately need? Seriously Armando", what are they?

Anybody care to join the GOAL ie gang of a lineman; we are pretty much stuck at qb with henne for next season, there seems to be good enough playmakers at Rb, wr and te later on, a developmental qb who has potential regardless teen conduct, I say add a starter ol in 1st round!!!

im 100% on baord with Kris...we just see eye to eye...forget all this NONSENSE about trading down for an EXTRA pick...why??..what for??...in the last 10 or so year we have wasted close to 50 picks....thats right..50...maybe MORE...why is picking an extra pick up so important?...the important thing is to get a BULLSEYE when you do pick...and trading down makes it easier to miss and add 51 and 52 miss....

Lets trade up...even if you get 2 damm picks....HIT on them...whats the point of 10 picks if 9 are misses?...

Take your shot at 15 or even trade up IF you are certain of your man...yes theres no such thing as certainty...but your chances SHOULD be way better up higher...DRAFT MALLET FFS..!...just frikkin do it....then spray the picks if you want to...or draft a DIFFERENCE MAKER...even ONE difference maker each draft makes it a VERY GOOD draft...trading down simply means your diluting the chances of a hit...unless your an excellent evaluator...and our guys certainly ARE NOT...IRELAND...dont trade down....take the very best QB, or WR or Olineman...one that will make a difference....you can get a RBack in FA....

DO NOT keep trading down

Some of you guys are probably pretty gross physically (be honest) but for the ones that aren't: God, we could have a good time.

I'd run my hands through your hair and massage every inch of your body. You'd get off SO awesomely in pure ecstasy. We'd be sweating and gasping in a post-orgasmic fit of laughter.

Dolphins should trade down. We need safety help (the starters are physically sound but questionable mentally at a position that demands intelligence) and the OL obviously still needs resolution. And why is anyone kidding themselves about Henne? He is a seriously flawed QB. Physically adept, mentally not the right fit. Do you see guys like Brady or Rodgers playing so emotionless?

He is NOT the guy.

Redsky...im also with you...Im extremely doubtful on Odrick..even tho I was hoping we would draft him...from the little I have seen he looks very slow and cumbersome...bad footwork...im surprised...

Oh and it was also me that was high on Brandon Graham last year along with Rob and a few others...he will be fine...but then again I was high on Sergio Kindle too...shows how much I know...lol

I would not take Ingram at 15. I think if a QB they like is not there they move down to later in the first and pick up a second or third as you say. Then if Ingram is still they select him or possibly Ponder if he is available since most of the good QBs will be gone by late second.

Ok...what are our GREATEST 2 needs?....for mine...its QB and OLine....

Can we get a QB in FA?.....maybe...only VY may suit....so we HAVE TO draft...we have NO CHOICE...so we must hit high...its gotta be at 15...or its a waste nothing surer.

Oline next...wh is in the 3rd that we could take?...

Wr....lets go FA for this one same as RB

Aloco...you are correct...whats the point of picking up an extra TURNIP..????

John Jerry MUST improve...he just has to...so far he has been POOR...but so was Soliai....

Odin...I like Tim McGraw..."Shes my kind of Rain"....and Trace Adkins...try Kenny Chesney..."You and Tequila"

What about "Short Change Hero" by The Heavy ....awesome song....ou of FASTER...

Do you know these?

BIGALFY,

DID YOU SIGN FOR THE GHS YET WITH 0X80 ?


I AGRRE W/EVERY THING YOU SAID IN YOUR LAST 5 POSTS .

I LIKE TO DECLARE RIGHT HERE AND NOW............


OUR FIRST ROUND PICK OF 2010 .......... ODRICK IS A WASTED PICK ............. FA IS THE WAY AND I SEE JEFF IRELAND GOING THROUGH THAT TO GET US A QB,RB ,TE ..................

DB,


DID YOU KNOW THAT BP TRADED DOWN TO GET ODRICK ?

YOU MAY HAVE A POINT FOR US STAYING IDLE AT 15 .


Did I miss something? Has Ryan lead Atlanta to a Superbowl? Has he been to 3 straight probowls? No. When will you stop whinning about Ryan/Long? You have the BEST LT in the game & it's a CRITICAL position. Without one, you go nowherer & Qb's usually struggle.

I'm tired of this second guessing & MMQB. In 2008 Jake Long was considered the BEST player in the draft, not matt Ryan & not Chris Long. In fact, there were alot of questions on Matt Ryan just as there are with this Qb class.

Seriously already....GET OVER IT.

i have zero confidence in jeff ireland and team doctors. jeff picks guys with broken legs and the medical team gives them the thumbs up. they are idiots. later we give away a healthy jason allen and sign an injured al harris who lasted 1 game. jeff will suck up to the boss and i'm sure sparano hates them both. should be a fun year.

ARMANDO,


PLEASE THIS WEEKEND WORK YOUR MAGIC AND FIND OUT WHAT THE DEAL WITH ODRICK INJURY AND IF THE FINS HAVE STILL THE SAME DOCTOR WHO LOOKED AT ODRICK .

(( SEND ME MY DOCTOR FRON BOSTON ,I CAN'T TRUST A DOCTOR WHO CAN'T SPEAK NGLISH )) ........... GODFATHER QUOTE .

I never liked Ingram for the 1st pick either for many of the same reasons Armando listed.

However, we don't need more picks, we need more qbs. Our overall roster is not that bad. We don't have a QB though and it really shows. I would mortgage this whole draft if it meant finding the QB of the next 10 years.

I almost wonder if it would make sense to try to trade our #15 pick to a team for their late 2nd round pick this year and their next years first round pick.

We could then package the 2 first rounders next year to try and move up for the #1 QB in next years draft?

Just trying to think ahead - I know this front office is in win now mode, but we would have a chance to get a real franchise qb that way.

Just a thought

agreed. I'd be very disappointed with Ingram at 15

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