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The second round: Heartache for the Dolphins

Once again this draft day, the Dolphins go into the selection process hoping to work the phones to get back a second round pick to overcome a trade or other transaction that led the team to give up the pick.

The second round has been interesting for the Dolphins the past decade. It has been the team's most active round. It has been the quarterback round for Miami, as four quarterbacks were brought to the team as a result of second round investments. The second round, in short, has been a heartache round for Miami.

There are studies that say only 50 percent of the players selected in the second round actually become four-year starters for the team. I would tell you the study of Miami's second-round performance the past decade has not lived up to those modest standards.

But let the proof speak for itself. What follows is what the Dolphins have done in the second round the past decade.

2001  Chris Chambers was selected 52nd overall selection. Solid pick as Chambers was a starter through the early part of the 2007 season. No, he wasn't a star as he was always seemingly an afterthought and never bold enough to demand being anything else. He was in the Pro Bowl in 2005, but also led the conference in drops that very year. He was traded to San Diego in 2007 for a second round pick.

2002: No pick. Traded to Philadelphia in 2001 for a trade up in the third round that netted Morlon Greenwood, who was by most accounts neither a bust nor a good player.

2003: Eddie Moore. All I need to tell you about this trade is that the Dolphins were starved for receiver talent then and went with a linebacker coach Dave Wannstedt said would improve the special teams. In the second round! The other thing I should tell you about this pick is that Moore never contributed on special teams or defense. His claim to infamy was getting knocked out by a patron in a local club.

2004: No pick. The selection was traded away the previous year to New England for a third round selection. The Dolphins used that selection on Wade Smith, a college tight end that they turned into a left tackle. Smith played a handful of years with the Dolphins before being ignored once his rookie contract expired in 2006. Ironically, he played for several more years as a starter with Kansas City and the Jets.

2005: The Dolphins had two second round picks this year. They gave up the first to Philadelphia in the A.J. Feeley trade which was, simply, an unmitigated disaster. The second pick they got in trade with Kansas City when they sent Patrick Surtain to the Chiefs, knowing they probably could not afford to pay him his asking price for a new contract. The Dolphins used the pick from the Surtain trade to pick Matt Roth, who had all of one good season as a starter with the Dolphins -- that in 2008. But in 2009, Roth had this curious episode with a groin injury which led him to lie to coach Tony Sparano which led him to fall out of favor which led the Dolphins to simply waive him and get nothing in return for him.

2006: No pick. The selection went to Minnesota in exchange for Daunte Culpepper. Terrible.

2007: Ah, two selections this time around and both turned into an embarrassment. The Dolphins got an extra pick from the Patriots because they signed Wes Welker as a restricted free agent. So far not terrible. The team used that pick on Samson Satele, who started every game his rookie season. So far not terrible. Here's the terrible part: Welker became Tom Brady's favorite target in New England and a multiple time Pro Bowl player. Satele fell out of favor with the incoming Parcells-Ireland-Sparano administration because he wasn't big enough or strong enough at the point of attack. He was traded away for a chance to move up in the fourth round a mere 18 spots. Are you kidding me? What a another waste.

2008: The Dolphins had plenty of ammunition in the second round with two picks. The first pick of the round (32nd overall) was mathematically a first round selection. The team used the pick on Phillip Merling who is so far a reserve with unmet potential. The next pick in the round for Miami was 57th overall and that translated into Chad Henne, a starting quarterback everyone hopes could become a game-changer but so far has been only an inconsistent game-manager.

2009: You want the good news or the bad news? The good news is Miami found a starter in Sean Smith with the 61st overall selection. Yes, Smith struggled to get on the field last season after earning a starting spot as a rookie, but he is a contributor. He needs to learn to catch the football. The bad news is the team used the 44th overall selection on Pat White. White was a gimmick addition to the offense in 2009, didn't complete a pass and was cut in training camp last season, the classic definition of a bust.

2010: Two picks again. The Dolphins traded their original pick to Denver in the deal that brough Brandon Marshall to Miami. The Dolphins are also invested in giving away this year's second-rounder for Marshall. Marshall for whatever reasons had his worst season of the past four seasons with the Dolphins. Marshall is also now a off-field question mark as he was recently stabbed by his wife in what is his ninth brush with a domestic violence since 2004. The Dolphins picked up a second round to actually use in the draft by trading down in the first round and picking up a second-rounder from San Diego in the exchange. They then used that pick on SOLB Koa Misi, who was solid and a starter as a rookie.

There you have it. A decade of second round picks. The total number of picks is eleven, including the picks Miami got in trade and gave away in trade.

The haul from all of that?

Five players that are still on the roster with four of them being starters, and none that are Pro Bowl players. Oh, Miami's second round ledger also includes four outright busts in the second round.

So why are we so eager to get a second-rounder back again?

[NOTES: I will update this blog with several posts before the draft even begins today, so do not go anywhere. Tonight there will be a live blog when the draft begins. And for the moments you must break away from here, follow me on twitter.]

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The Dolphins should just give up the entire draft and trade with Carolina and take Newton. Then the fans will not have to hear about moving down in the draft to pick up a 2nd, this way S.Ross will get to save a penny or nickel././

Rob-OC,

Im not off of Mallet band wagon. Learned lots from Parcell predraft special. Gave me clearer picture of mindset of nfl gm's on draft day.

From this I learned great chance Jimmy Smith or Aldon Smith have better chance of being our 1st rd pick at #15 than Pouncey or Ingram. Based on systemic value, positional value, need, and availability.

According to what Parcells taught on this special there isnt a qb with a snowball's chance in hell of being the Dolphins 1st rd pick outside of Gabbert or Newton falling.

If we have to pick at #15, no 2nd rd pick, and Mallet is still available with our 3rd rd pick. He will be our 3rd rd pick trumphing Taiwan Jones if both available. Qb position has higher value than rb position.

wang chung,

For this to happen Newton would have to grade out as the highest rated qb in the history of the draft. He aint even close. LOL..........

Defense or QB...

ok it's draft day and this time tomorrow i don't want to be hooked up to the life support unit they moved next to my bed recently

i reckon i'll stave off the lsu if we can

trade down to late 1st for a 2nd at least

and pick kaep, mallet, ingram, leshoure, pouncey/carimi/castanzo, any decent de or ilb, or rudolph

or stay at 15 and pick

ingram, pouncey/carimi/castanzo, any decent de or ilb, kaep's a reach at 15 and a project but it would kaep me off that machine coz i'd take the risk to make sure we get him (i don't think he's another p white!), he's unlikely to be there in th 3rd

please mr ireland don't starve me any more!

beerphin,

We aint getting a qb unless we trade to the back of the 1st rd. Maybe #29(Bears slot).

This fo uses a grading system and follows it with religion. They will not choose a qb grading out in the 2nd rd in the 1st rd.

#29 is 4 slots from 2nd rd. There's better chance it would happen there.

Plus Gabbert or Newton dont rate a high enough grade to warrant a trade up.

All of the 2nd rd graded qb's will fly off of the board within the first 15 picks of the 2nd rd. LeShore and Ryan Williams will too.


I know its not a great time to bring it up. But Im sure even Mandich himself wouldnt mind. IMO, Howard Twilley was the better TE of the two. Seems Griese targeted Twilley in that era more so than Mandich.

Posted by: DyingBreed | April 27, 2011 at 10:19 PM

------------------------------

I realize this is from the previous blog entry (and no disrespect intended) but Howard Twilley was not a TE.

Twilley was purely a WR. An original 1966 Dolphin as well. He played opposite Warfield (although Marlin Briscoe probably had as many snaps in the same position).

The Dolphins starting TE for those Super Bowl teams was Marv Fleming, who (despite some of the comments in the aforementioned entry) was a SUPERB player with great size, hands, smarts, and toughness. A tireless and unselfish blocker as well. As a former Packer All-Pro, Marv earned a Super Bowl ring in fully HALF of the first eight SB's played.

On the downside during his years in Miami but still VERY valuable to the overall effort.

As for what Mandich might have said, as somone who DID see those teams I think he'd probably tell you Fleming was the better talent, actually. Certainly true if you look at the entirety of each career.

But that in NO way detracts from what Jim Mandich meant to the Miami Dolphins. It's not so much what he did as a player, but how beautifully he conducted himself as a human being and as an ambassador for the Dolphins (who he loved dearly) and the entire South Florida community.

The love for him is VERY real, as is the grief and loss with his passing. I know those of you who root for the team from afar or are too young to remember can't fully know what he meant but I hope you'll take the time to learn more and appreciate him.

In the meantime, get your 1972 Dolphins straight! There WILL be a quiz. :)

This fo isnt drafting on gut feelings. They are drafting using a value system and trying to combine it with need and availabilty. Doing this doesnt always have things land just the way you like.

But it will give you a more solid way of choosing players. Still the probability of bust can happen. That's always a probability but a sound system may lower it over time.

dr. roberts,

Had you taken time to read a few posts lower. You would have found Odin corrected me on that eons ago. You could have save yourself from looking like such a dumbass right now. Just so sorry you were so late to the party. LOL..............

Just as I'm equally sorry you're so clueless about the actual history of the Miami Dolphins, despite your tireless efforts to sound so very authoratative.

But glad you're getting up to speed.

LOL

dr roberts,

Wasnt Bob Griese our fg kicker back then? LOL.......

My comments and corrections towards you were respectful, by the way. I don't expect you to be an encyclopedia of Dolphins history.

YOU were the one who chose "dumbass" as an adjective.

I'm more than capable of playing on that field if that's what you want. I'd prefer more mutual respect, however. Your decision.

dr. roberts,

You saw me here and went out of your way to bring up such meaningless jabber. You call that respect? Are you aware of what the term ulterior motive means? Youre a smart guy.

Dude you dont try and put lipstick on a pig and call it respect. Maybe you get away with it with your neophytes but youre dead busted here. JERK!

dr. roberts,

you and I never talk anyway then all of a sudden you want to wave a negative overtone with me. Blow away dust ball. LOL............

DB--Funny you mention that about Griese.

He actually DID have a turn kicking. I think it was just extra points in a preseason game (maybe 1978 or so?)

Also remember Don Strock having to kick in an emergency situation in a REAL game versus the Pats. 1987 I think. It wasn't pretty.

Weirdest? Bruce Hardy taking snaps at QUARTERBACK in a late-season game in '83 (rookie Marino was hurt...can't remember what was wrong with Strock...don;t think we had a 3rd stringer)

THAT was funny. And we won, anyway.

Give it a rest, DB.

Fair enough if you say I overreacted but I'd say the same about you.

This blog isn't your fiefdom. Nor mine. Or anybody's (well, maybe Aloco's but that's another story)

I can see why you'd feel that way. Hopefully, you can also see why being called "dumbass" might strike me as a tad immature. You're better than that.

Here's to better conversations.

dr. roberts,

Blow away dustball Im not your friend in a personal nor web-like way. Nor will I ever choose to. My very last response to you.

Cheers.

LOL,everybody is a G.M.....What job do you all really have?????Yea,genius.......

Definitely NOT a GM...a "draft analyst"...or a wannabe coordinator.

My "expert" draft selections would have been atrocious the past two decades, but at least I can admit it.

(although I still stand defiantly by my choice of Telly Savalas in the 3rd round of the 1971 draft)

An opinion, though? Sure. I think Miami is probably going to be stuck with that #15 despite making every effort to trade down. Mostly because the teams right above them will likely be trying to do the same with a sweeter offer on the board.

Who do they take? It could be a half-dozen guys, all of who have been discussed here.

They HAVE to be tempted by Ingram, for both need and potential. Mallet intrigues for all the physical skills, obviously, but mentally? Jury's out. Also not impossible they go defense against all logic (and fan revolt). But if a guy on that side of the ball IS tops on their board there's plenty of draft history to say that's the right way to go.

I say Pouncey with no conviction aside from it being a fairly safe pick at genuine need at #15.

I know folks are beyond weary with the OL being "rebuilt" for years upon end (so am I) but until they get it right the offense will suffer regardless of who else gets plugged in.

Probably won't be him, anyway. Hopefully they can get a tradedown that parlays into two starters.

Just read the Armando column and it reads WAYYY too much like what I posted above.

I'm changing my first-round selection to QB John Unitas/Louisville.

This is going to be a long night watching New England navigate up and down to do whatever they want while we just sit back and hope to find a potential trade partner for a second round pick.

I wish us luck - we need it.

i'm praying bellichek doesnt take ireland's lunch yet again! we cant afford to keep outsmarting ourselves looking for acorns. we need ballers,not prototypical size requirements. i'd rather have undersized guys who breathe football like welker,woodhead and the pats qb turned WR and kick returner.

Why are some of you allowing this dr. roberts person to make this thread about him? Ignore mates, ignore.

now OT.

The team needs speed and playmakers but I fully expect Ireland to ignore that. Look for a
LB in the 1st
Owen Marecic in the 3rd
Zack Pianalto in the 4th
Nathan Enderle in the 5th
then he will try to address what he thinks is speed in the 6th and 7th unless there is a couple of OLinemen there that he likes.

I will dance when Ireland is FIRED


this is what I've been abou this team for a long time now. Armanso just showed how many times we've actually missed in the second round. Disasterous!! We hit a little more often and we're not a 7-9 football team. People want to blame Henne or the lack of a first round QB...it's all bogus!! Hit on your draft picks consistently and you'll have a good team. It's not rocket science. Look at KC and Tampa from last year for proof of this.

DEAL IN PLACE .............. CARSON PALMER TO THE SEAHAWKS .................

Your right Craig, And the guys that the Bucs drafted didn't take a football genius to select.

Every major football publication in the country probably said that Mccoy, Benn and Mike Williams would be good football players.

Where do you get these things Aloco?? You need to get a job with ESPN...lol.

AND DALTON , THE BLACK HORSE IN THAT RACE.
LESHORE............ WILL BRING ALL WE NEED .

DOLFAN RICK,


PALMER WILL BE TRADED TO THE SEAHAWKS RIGHT AFTER THE 8TH CIRCUIT COURT ISSUE IT'S VERDICT ON THE OWNERS FINAL APPEAL SHORTLY .

Mando, you forgot the totally wasted second round pick on John Beck in 2007. Another Epic fail.

PS, why is he still listed on the "categories" of this blog?

Looking forward to you ripping the draft pick tomorrow am!

DID ANY ONE NOTICE BP COMMENT ,WHY WE DRAFTED HENNE AND NOT MAT RAYN OR FLACCO ??????


HE SAID , (( HE WAS THE CHEAPEST ))........... IS IRELAND HAS THE SAME LINE OF THINKING WHEN DRAFTING A VALUE OR ACRON CRAP ?


I HOPE NOT .

So much for no way is Cincy gonna trade him huh. Guess that will take a QB off the board at #4.

CINCY WILL PICK A QB IN THE DRAFT UNLESS THEY ALREADY HAVE A DEAL TO SIGN KEVIN KOLB .......THEN THEY COULD PICK WR GREEN .

Irelands first pick will be someone that most of have never heard of and most likely a LBer.

As for FA QBs
Forget Kolb - he has less win than Henne.

Forget Orton - he is penciled in as the starter.

Forget Palmer - he and Mike Brown are in a peeing contest and Brown doesn't want anyone else to get the idea that they can force a trade.

Maybe Young or McNabb but I know how most of you feel about black QBs and seeing as Ireland has shown a complete lack of professionalism in his interviewing technique with players of color (IMHO), you can look for him to go with someone like Boller or some other hack and then Ireland will sell the sheep, that it is a real QB competition.

I say the music will start about mid-season and by the end of the year, I will be dancing as they are FIRED.

I missed the Parcells thing but I think Ireland pretty much has Ross's blessing to throw caution to the wind. Well i'm out gotta get some stuff done.

Be back for the draft!

chingata way dyingbreed, tu es mucho mariposa

Mando:
The answer is simple:
1. You have so many needs that you need as many picks as possible.
2. the fact that second round picks has been medicore over the past decade, can't prevent you to try to get them plus you have to thinks that you will get it right! Right?

I think , we need to trade down, then get the best OL available and RB with the second round, then moving to either QB or TE on the third.

I know we can plan draft thinking about free agency but i guess we need to take into consideration which are the possible targets and if the Dolphins are thinking about going hard after Robert gallery (G- Raiders) and Deangelo Williams (RB - panthers), they could gamble and then have a different priority order on the draft then taking a QB but not without trading down (We will get that 2nd rounder!)

ANDY DALTON ................ I AM STILL A BELIEVER ..

THE TITANS THINKING OF PICKING DALTON AT NO 8 FEARING ,HE WILL BE GONE COMES TIME FOR THEIR 2rd PICK............

IF VY IS GONE , IT SURE WILL BE INTERESTING .

Hours before the draft and suddenly everyone knows exactly what each GM will do. I don't pretend to have clue.

I just hope we get some offensive fire power in this draft. You just can't spend every draft focusing on linemen when you have nobody to run, only one ordinary TE, and no speedy wideouts. Some want to blame the oline for the decline of R&R, but one has to consider it is them that have declined too.

Better offensive weapons will show our current oline is better than it is. Even with King Kong at center Ronnie will still dance and hesitate, Ricky will still fumble more than normal, and neither will break tackles like they used to.

leave it mando to rub on our wounds more. YES WE KNOW. for the 1000th time we know our FO has been terrible with the 2nd round selection. give it a rest.

Jake Locker isn't graded out of the 1st rd... He will probably be picked up by Minnesota at #12

We'd be lucky to draft him in the twenties of course but the only reason he might drop that far is out of necessities for other teams behind us. The only team that might go after him is the Patriots because they can afford it and they will need a replacement for Brady evenetually... if we were to trade back and still land him it'd be great but the Seahawks will take him if he falls to #25.

I like Ponder/ Dalton with a tradeback as well. Ponder at the end of the first or Dalton in the 2nd...

This article is ridiculously negative. Chambers, greenwood, wade smith, matt roth and koa misi were all good picks. Merling still might turn into one. And Brandon Marshall is awesome - another 1000 yard season despite bad QB play. It's like every pick has to be a pro bowler or else it was a bust. No team hits on every pick every time.

trade back 24 NO + pick up 4th and 6th while trading down (w alternate)

#24 Jake Locker QB Washington/ Christian Ponder QB FSU

#56 Allen Bailey DE/OLB The U / Bruce Carter OLB UNC

3rd Taiwan Jones RB ECU/ Shane Vereen RB California

4th Da'Norris Searcy SS UNC/ Chris Culliver S/DB South Carolina

4th Charles Clay HB Tulsa/ Jordan Todman RB UCONN

5th DeMarcus Van Dyke DB The U/ Curtis Marsh DB Utah St

6th Zane Taylor C Utah/ Brandon Fusco C

6th Andrew Jackson OG Fresno St/ Julius Thomas TE Portland St

7th Lee Smith TE Marshall/ David Arkin OG Miss St

7th Mike Mohammed ILB California/ Jeff Tarpinian Iowa

7th LeStar Jean WR FAU/ Armon Binns WR Cincinnati

Agree w/ lacesoutdan,
I'm not sure that a few of those picks weren't wasted becuz of terrible job coaching and getting the right guys on the field...

You know for the past 4 months I've been thinking the phins need to trade down to get that pick back. But the more I look at this draft the more I wonder if its just better to pick at 15 and just live with brandon marshall as part of our second round this yea.r The reason i say that seems to be talent. Last year we HAD to get a 2nd rounder back. it was the best draft in a decade with people coming out early fearing rookie wage scales. This year, the second round is not that great. Last year drafting high in the second was like getting a 1st most other years. This year its more of a bone yard. Im fine with skipping the second round if we have to. Get a damn good player at 15 and move on.

If we have to pick at #15 it will come down to a position that impacts the game most:

Pass Rusher: Aldon Smith
Corner: Jimmy Smith

If Aldon Smith isnt available it will be Jimmy Smith.

If its Jimmy Smith, either Sean Smith gets traded or the experiment begins at one of the safety spots for him. Jimmy Smith will be a 2011 starter.

beerphin,

those don't look like bad picks, but you know the dolphins don't draft hurricanes.

DB... I NOTICED YOU WENT TO SLEEP AT 5;00 AM AND NOW 10;00 AM ....DRAFT DUTY ?

Im not sure if Ingram or Pouncey grades out high enough to go at the #15 spot. Miami uses the two back system so rb may not grade that high because of the "split-carries".

Pouncey vs Aldon Smith or Jimmy Smith going #15 may be of lessor value in positional impact.

Absolutely Aloco, duty calls. Its D-Day!LOL.....

Dolphins would not take Allen Bailey. Serious concerns about his work ethic. Took too many plays off at UM.

THE RAIDERS ARE DYING TO MOVE UP .THEY DON'T HAVE A FIRST ROUND PICK ...THEY NEED A PARTNER ......... AL DAVIS WANTS YOU ,DOLPHINS .

If Raiders had a 1st rd pick Ryan Mallet or Taiwan Jones would go 1st rd. LOL............

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