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Still on the Carson Palmer bandwagon as the Fins best hope

Yes, I am still on the Carson Palmer trade bandwagon.

Laugh if you want. I've been there before. Folks mocked when I was all alone on the Ricky Williams trade bandwagon in 2000 -- except for Williams, who called me from New Orleans to express his interest in the idea, and Dave Wannstedt, who pulled me aside and asked what Williams had said before admitting he'd love to make it happen. It happened nine months later.

So, yes, Carson Palmer to the Dolphins? I continue saying it can definitely happen. I said it before. I'm repeating it now. Iit can happen. 'm for it. I will not allow it to die until it is, well, officially dead.

And it is not dead at this point.

The fact is, quite to the contrary. Every shred of evidence (and it is rare evidence, I grant you) coming from the Bengals is they might actually be inching toward the idea of trading Palmer. And every time I ask around with the Dolphins nobody says, "Dude, you're dreaming, move on."

Everybody in the Dolphins organization I've talked to about the idea so far has said things like, "Carson's pretty good," or, "I like Carson," or, "It's one of our what-ifs."

After I wrote the column on Palmer saying the Dolphins view him as a singular special options above guys like Kyle Orton or Vince Young, I told a high-ranking Dolphins personnel man about my column. He didn't say, "We're definitely going to do that." He did say, "He's a great kid. That would be something to think about for a long time. But he's not available right now."

So I'm not abandoning the idea until the idea deserves full abandonment. And that time has not come. Quite the opposite.

The latest twist on this possibility is an ESPN report stating the Bengals are among the teams that would be interested in Philadelphia's Kevin Kolb. Obviously, neither Kolb nor Palmer can be moved at the moment as the league is in lockout mode. But when that lifts, free agents will move, trades will be allowed. And everyone believes Kolb will become available via trade.

If the Bengals, who own the draft's No. 4 overall selection, get a QB, you should think they won't be involved in the Kolb sweepstakes. But if they don't get a QB there, Kolb will be a possibility for them. And if Kolb is on campus in Cincy, Palmer is no longer needed, thank you very little.

So the Bengals will have the choice of allowing Palmer to sit on his backside and get nothing for him. Or they will have the option of trading him.

The scenario becomes more complex if the Bengals pick a QB early because while it suggests Palmer is no longer in their plans long-term, it obviously doesn't close the door on him immediately the way Kolb's arrival would.

A little aside here: I have spoken to a league source whom the Bengals approached about QBs well before the story about Palmer wanting out of Cincinnati broke. The source told me in January that the Bengals were going to be looking at QBs as they prepared for life without Palmer. So at that point, they were readying for the possibility of moving on without Palmer.

Maybe they knew the storm that was coming -- that Palmer, sick and tired of being sick and tired in Cincinnati's often dysfunctional organization, wanted out and was vehement about it to the point of threatening retirement. Maybe way back then, the Bengals believed Palmer had played his final game for them.

I know, I know. Publicly, the Bengals' stance continues to be Palmer is their QB and he will play in Cincinnati or retire. Hey, doesn't that sound like the stance Bill Parcells took on Jason Taylor in 2008? Yeah, that was the stance the Dolphins had just before they traded Jason Taylor to Washington.

The point is, that is the public stance a team must take to keep hopes of getting value in return for a player. If the Bengals even hint they are moving on from Palmer, the price for him drops. And they do not want that because they would want the highest return possible for him.

I know some of you are reading this and telling yourselves, "The Dolphins shouldn't want Carson Palmer. He's not that good."

That is not an opinion without merit. But it is one without facts.

What if I told you Miami can add a QB that threw 26 TD passes last year in what was considered a bad year for him? That number of TD passes, by the way, represents 11 more TDs than Chad Henne threw and nine more than Miami threw as a team.

Yes, Palmer threw 20 interceptions. But Henne threw 19 interceptions and Miami threw a total of 21 altogether.

So plug those stats into Miami's 2011. Would the Dolphins have been better with 63 more points on the board and one fewer interception? Yeah, I would tell you they would have been. No doubt.

Are you aware Palmer completed 61.8 percent of his passes? Are you aware his QB rating was 90 or better in six games, including a 345-yard performance against the Patriots last year? Are you aware the guy was playing behind an offensive line that made Miami's seem like a Pro Bowl unit by comparison?

Are you aware Palmer won't be 32 years old until December? And Tom Brady, the QB everyone in the division hates to face, will be 34 years old during the same season?

Palmer would make the Dolphins a playoff contender, an actual true playoff contender, immediately. Maybe you hate that idea. Maybe you like the idea of picking Ryan Mallet or Andy Dalton, or Colin Kaepernick or Ricky Stanzi or Christian Ponder and hoping he becomes a good player by 2012 or 2013 or before the Rapture. Maybe the idea of being irrelevant for a couple of more years doesn't bother you.

Me? I know Palmer is good now. I think he'll be good for another five years or so, so the notion that adding him is only a temporary fix is bogus.

I like the fact there are little shreds of evidence that Cincinnati might warm to the idea of actually trading Palmer. 

And I'm not going to drop the idea of the Dolphins getting him until is it absolutely out of the question. That time has not yet arrived.

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MJZ,

A 2nd AND a 4th?

Since we don't have a second, lets assume for a minute that Cinci would take a 3rd and a 4th.

That would leave us a 1st, 5th, 6th and 3-7ths.

Hmmmmmmmmmm........................

That wouldn't leave us much to work with, especially if we miss on one.

But hey! Maybe if we give em our 1st rounder too, we could get them to throw in TO or Ocho?????

Odin, I always appreciate your recognition..thx.

Mando,

I was on the Palmer FA wagon a couple months ago - before the CBN walfed, institutiing the lockout. Then I came to grips with the reality that there is no FA until that is solved. Although Palmer might be an interest, at best, he is not a solution for this organization, IMO. Kolb would be a better FA acquisition.

Why would we seek Palmer from Bengals over Kolb, knowing what we are told amongst the two?

Kolb would be a great addition, pitted against Henne and Mallett.

Since we are facing a QB starting delimma, lets address the problem head on with a QB draft first, and take whatever is best offered at the QB slot in fA as a resort, whence possible...

odinseye,

And this: A certain poster here momma is so ugly that they even banned her photo from being posted on " be kind to animals day! LOL...........

Thank you Redsky!

That's the Dolphins In Depth that I've grown to love!!!!

odinseye,

A certain poster here momma is so ugly she makes Medusa look like Goldie Locks"! LOL...........

Cuban, I think we'll do than better than your prediction, but if we want a good qb from the next draft, we need to have your numbers. This years qbs aren't what we need so it's either Henne or a Palmer.

DYING CREEP......

FLIP FLOP ...FLIP FLOP ......


THE CUBAN BACALA .

Red, with Henne or Palmer I'll stay at 3 and 13..................

odinseye,

A certain poster here momma is so ugly his daddy divorced her, married an olger, and traded all of the kids in for a monster mash mask. LOL.................

Ahhhh Lil Aloco, How was work?????????

odinseye,

Acertain poster here daddy is so gay, when seeing him approach a field of flowers ran away! LOL............

Pretty cute guys!! Should I talk to Armando about whoever it is that's try to impersonate me? I can make it end for you pretty quick whoever you are....

Btw, this was the real Craig M. Maybe I need to look into 'the name in blue stuff'. Pretty cute guys....too bad you don't have the guts to own up to your impersonating.

finally. armando. please keep the logic and reality on the front and center of my beloved dolphins blog. thank you.

Ok Guys Iam out, Have a "Phintastic"Nite........

I JUST CAME BACK FROM WORK AND MY POINT IS THAT DYING CREEP,CUBAN AND SOME OTHERS ALWAYS HERE WHILE I AM WORKING HARD .I CALL THESE PEOPLE ...THE WELFARE GANG .

CUBAN SAID GOOD NIGHT AND WILL BE BACK AS REDSKY...REAL FUNNY .

Palmers Bengals were tied with 2 other teams for the second worse record in the NFL last year... and its not his only trip down this memory lane, hes has some very bad seasons in Cinci, thus the he wants out part, Hes has i think 2 winning seasons in his entire time in a bungals uniform, and this is the guy you want to bring in to replace a promising 3rd year pro? Give Henne some weapons and give him a chance to succeed, and leave palmer alone, instead, help the Jets get him

Also I heard that Sam Bradford didnt win last year and the rams have decided to give up on him and draft a new QB on the advice of the media and irate fans, so maybe we can pick him up after the rams follow the medias advice and just cut bradford....Dito for Stafford in detriot

ARAMNDO LOVE TO IMPOSTER ME ...THIS POST IS JUST BAD FOR REASONS WE ALL KNOW .PALMER IS 43 YEARS OLD AND THE LEADER OT THE GANG OF DEFEAT WANTS US TO SIGN HIM ..........SABOTAGE WRITING

Aloco, Palmer is 33! What you drinkin'

I would give a 3rd rounder for him.. the most.

armando WRITES A SABOTAGE WRITING ,AFTER ALL THESE YEARS HE WANTS ROSS TO TAKE ON PALMER AND GIVE HIM CLOSE TO 14 MILLION A YEAR UNTIL 2014 .

send Henne and a 4th rounder to Cincinnati... trade the 1st rounder for additional picks; and select Mark Ingram with your 1st pick, and then Mallett with your 2nd.. get a OL with your 3rd rounder.

..Have you guys checked out "Game Changers" on the NFL Network? Awesome.

So a few days ago I posted my feelings against Vince Young as a possible quarterback for our team. I would perfer Carson Palmer, but I think I'm changing my tune about Young. I taped the re-play of Tenn V. Dallas. Young did some good things in that game. He suprised me with his accuracy down he field. Dallas, had the box stacked on everyplay. Tennessee, attacked the defense by getting the ball down the field. Their recievers aren't the same quality as ours(IMO) but they made an effort to be aggresive.

Yes they had Chris Johnson who had over 100 yards in that game, and yes they had good protection that allowed Young to throw with little pressure. But I was pleasantly suprised with Youngs accuracy that game. One of his touchdown throws was one that Henne(or whoever is quarterback) was one of those throws where the qb "throws the reciever open" it was a jump ball to Kenny Britt in the end zone. Placed above the defenders hands into the taller Britts for an easy touchdown. Good stuff.

But the most impresive part of VY's game against Dallas was how he managed to find the one on one mismatches. Britt like Marshall was doubled, but managed to get open enough to catch a long pass. The Titans don't have much other then Britt on the reciever side. But it was obvious he and Young were on the same page.

I know 1 game isn't enough either way to make a full judgement. Young has issues as well. Maybe I was wrong about him. He looked pretty good in this game.

Draft Mallett at 15, if he is even there...

Keep your eye out on Kolb (in the unlikely event he is even obtainable) and let the three work out for the starting QB.

Bye, Pennigton. And throw Thigpen in to determine who is fourth string.

Two years down the road, we can toss one of these inferior QB's to the trade market and pick up some lost ground.

Whether that be Mallett, Kolb or Henne is aside the point. (I don't see Thigpen being a difference in this hypothetical).

The point I want to share, is, I believe between Henne, Mallett, and Kolb, we would wind up with an amassed QB situation, that allows us to determine our starter, affording us the luxery to dump one in trade a couple years down the road for a worthy draft pick.

The competition at QB would be a sellng point worth note.

I guess it is my turn for a lynching...

Bring it on.

Why do we need a veteran QB?

Why can't Henne play until we find someone better?

You mean Henne needs a vet QB?

I thought we had QB coaches for that.

Oh my.

Gulf...I think that we can either make a trade, or go Via the draft. But to do both doesn't seem to make much sense to me. I would think that if we spent a first round pick on a quarterback, what would be the point of making a trade for a Veteran, unless the trade involved Henne? On the other side of this. If we traded for a quarterback, and Henne wasn't a piece in that trade. I think it would be a better move to take a guy in the draft that would be able to potentially help us immedietley. Personally I see no good in having Henne, Mallet, and a guy like Palmer. All on the roster. Just my opinion, doesn't mean yours is wrong.

Zach..Thanks for the contribution.

In my opinion, we're not going to get everything on everyone's "wish lis and you're just gonna have to live with that fact. If we get Cincy to trade, Palmer would make a nice addition. But, it wouldn't surprise me if they played hardball with him, not releasing him, and forcing him to retire. Mallet would be a nice pick-up in the draft too. But, he may be gone by #15. Palmer and Mallet probably won't happen. That ties up a lot of cash needed for other things (like free agent runningbacks)! I'm hearing some rumbling that Miami will try to trade down out of the #15 slot, but if they can't the pick will be either a guard/center or a linebacker (possibly an inside LB). All of this may be moot if something good doesn't happen tomorrow. Let'em play, judge!nd

Tracy474..Youre first sentence said it all. Great point.

wow this blog really turned into diaper trash tonight. how to grown men act so infantile?

Palmer needs a fresh start away from the Bengals. Who wouldn't want to leave cinncinnati for Miami?

el garbagio

Splashy QB pick ups rarely work. We've been down this road...it always seems to backfire and set the process back. If this isn't the year to draft big then hang on to Henne and pick up Stanzi and look toward the future. Draft until we get it right. Palmer is a re-tread who is all show, no go.

yeah, splashy QB pickups like drew brees in New Orleans, jim plunkett in Oakland, matt cassel in KC, kurt warner in Arizona, randall cunningham in Minnesota, michael vick in Philadelphia ... those hardly ever work. Ridiculous.

Mando, Good article, but Before the Rapture? Come On man, you don't believe that fairytale, Do You? Im not saying im some religious expert, But nowhere in the Bible does it mention the word Rapture. NOWHERE. It was made up by a very sick women in 1830, named Margret McDonald, who had visions of the any moment doctrin, it was NOT official Church docyrin until after 1830. Please know this. Satan returns first, claiming he is Jesus, and his message will be Ive come to Rature"Christians" out of here, Its a Lie, The Rapture Is A LIE! Satan will deceive the Whole world into Believing he is the Christ, he is Antichrist or the instead of Christ, to all of my Beloved Dolphins Fans everywhere, know this, a time is comming when a supernatural being will appear on Earth claiming to be the Messiah. he is a Fake. The true Christ does not appear until AFTER the rein of antichrist, God Bless!

DYING CREEP HAD A MELTDOWN LAST NIGHT ...HE THREW INSULTS AT GRAIG M HIS LATEST VICTIM AS HE KEEPS FLIP FLOPING AND CHANGING TO A NEW PLAYER EVERY DAY SO THE DONKEYS CAN FOLLOW A CREEP .


If we have to give up a 1st or 2nd round pick, I say no.

But, I think he would be a good replacement for Chad Pennington.

We could wait another year to draft a quarterback, which is a plus, considering the slim pickings in this draft.

carson is older and banged up with a monster contract. kevin kolb would be my pick;he's better than all the draft day qb's so i'd gladly give a 1st if needed. greg mcelroy would make sense in the mid rounds. he's smart and accurate, alot like a penne but young.

Wait a minute......who exactly was against the RW trade????

I think everyone thought that was a great trade at the time.

Palmer is washed up... I do not want him. Go back and watch the Dolphins game, he was horrible.

The Eagles would be smart to trade Kolb, he is way over rated and no better then Henne.

Mando, I know you probably wont read this.

to start, I like the idea of bringing Palmer here for the right price. Only if it makes sense as competition for Henne.

But Mando, You are out of your skull if you think Palmer would of had the same #'s or better last year in a dolphin uniform.

The bengals O-line was far better than the dolphins last year, and they had less than half of the injury problems our line had.

So, I know you have nothing else to compare since he was not on the dolphins. but let's be fair and say you compared apples to oranges.

Like I said, I like the idea, but considering the offense each team had to play with and the coaching, I think Henne had a better year than Palmer.

I do however think in his prime Palmer is the better QB, so if there is a chance that guty still exists I would like to see this trade happen.

HOW IS IT BETTER TO GET PALMER W/14 MILLION A YEAR AND A RECORD LAST YEAR OF 3-13 VS HENNE WITH 600,000 WITH RECORD OF 7-9 ?


ONLY PEOPLE LIKE ARAMANDO AND DAYING CREEP ARE FANS FOR THAT MOVE .

Good defense of your idea Mando, illuminate all the best scenarios and minimize all the worst case scenarios. Here's a few scenarios you haven't entertained fully (or chose not to include in your piece):

- CBA isn't done until late Aug. Now you have a trade, who knows if it's first day of FA or not, and bring in a new QB days if not hours before the first game of the season. Is that the guy you think will have the best chance to lead the team to victory? Really. With no work with the offense. No understanding of the terminology (or needing to come up to speed immediately). I see that scenario as a recipe for disaster.

- Palmer gets signed, and in one of the early (or whenever) games, gets hit in the legs, re-injures himself, and now we have a high-paid, valuable cheerleader (anyone remember another veteran QB we were all high on until he got knocked out of a game named Trent Green?). This isn't a remote possibility either. Palmer history and age increase the chances of injury, and then what, we put Henne back, who's confidence was already damaged, and now he's asked to lead the team to the Promised Land. Sorry, don't see it.

- Piggybacking off CraigM, what if Palmer comes with a steep price tag (money and even a pick next year). Now next year we're trading back to pick-up THAT draft pick we lost on Palmer? Is it wise to continuously trade back and not get a higher-ranked player? Has that worked for us in the past? To this point, yes, if you're GONNA lose a pick in an upcoming draft, QB is the position important enough to lose it on, but you better be damned right on your bet, because if the QB doesn't add, that hurts your team in the future (oh, let me count the ways: Fiedler, Huard, Lucas, Griese, Feeley, Rosenfels, ok I'm tired).

Let's see what's out there, what happens in the draft, how Henne looks before we make any rash FA pickups (they rarely work for this team at this position, other than Pennington for a whole year, great though it was).

Your an Idiot. Palmer has sucked with a capital S since the knee injury. Would rather take chances with Henne and a draft pick.

I'd rather trade for Tim Tebow.

after looking at who we have available to us in FA and possible trades i would rather take my chance on henne. i'm sorry but i'm not willing to give up any draft choices for any of the guys we would trade for and i'm not willing to bring in any of these guys and pay them any significant money. but, bring in vince young or kolb to compete with henne for the starting position. what happesn if henne beats them out? ever think about that one?

Imagine if the Denver Broncos who already have Tim Tebow also pick Cam Newton!
Believe the Broncos offense could certainly continue to change the face of the NFL offense

That would be two of the best and toughest young QBs to ever come out of college football on the same team, were nowadays w defensive players becoming so strong and brutal 2 good QBs is a must.

Home will always be a Miami Dolphin fan first, but will always be a fan of the entire NFL and watch all teams, cheering for great plays on both sides of the ball.

Home would try to catch EVERY Broncos game if Newton was drafted to compliment Tebow
Wow! Would that be exciting to watch

Coming into the reality that Palmer or Young will be this regimes answer to QB competition for Henne, who will probably be the Dolphins starting QB again
Yes, another rook QB will be signed but probably just a long shot needing much development

Gonna be interesting to see what Jeff Ireland can do reaching into his bag of tricks on 4.28.11


Forget trading a high pick for an older player. If you're gonna take a risk like that, I'd rather take it on someone younger.

I'm totally in trade down mode. However, if it's not possible or not going to get good value, stay put and take a chance on Mallett if he's there. He is very talented. He just needs to identify & handle/escape pressure better. He is tall & slow, so..I'm not sure those deficiencies can be corrected.

But, if you're gonna take a risk, take it on the younger guy with a chance to learn.

mallet wont be very good, throwing off your back foot is never a good thing. i wouldnt give up anything more than a 4th rd pick for palmer, if that

yea palmer threw 20 tds not playing for sparano who is Mr field goal. You don't know what the QB is gonna be until he plays for the coach and the new system. IF we can trade our 2012 3rd round pick then do it other than that pass.

BTW Mando I didn't know you should be blamed for the ricky williams fiasco. That trade put us back years.

j

So it was YOUR idea to mortgage the franchise's future for a flaky pothead that netted us zero playoff appearances and set us back years? Good job.

Finally Armando, you get back to reality with your opinion.

This idea is so much better than your previous idea of drafting Newton at 15 if he's available. Ask yourself this, "Would you rather have Carson Palmer or Cam Newton?"

If the answer is Carson Palmer, then what the heck is so wrong offering our first round pick for Carson Palmer and the Bengals 2nd or 3rd round pick?

Seems like a great move to me...Carson has all the skills in the world, he just needs to be in the right organization with WR's who aren't children on the field like "85". I can't even imagine what a Carson Palmer to Brandon Marshall connection can be like. That single trade would put us up in immediate playoff contention again and would solidify our offense. Once you have Carson at QB, use our 4th or 5th round pick on a RB. Then our backfield would be set (I think Kory Sheets is going to surprise people this season).

Thinking about this trade just got me pumped again for this season!

Armando...dude...get over yourself...Palmer is only marginally better than Henne at this point in his career and it is debatable whether he will continue slide downward (see McNabb)...If we could get Palmer for a 3rd or 4th it is a no brainer. Anything more than that and I would take my chances with Henne and a QB in the draft.

I WOULD SIGN PALMER FOR A 162,000 A YEAR OTHERWISE WE GET STANZI FOR 54,000 A YEAR .

This app doesn't work again

Armando,
love the idea, for one, AGE and experience benefits the QB position, hence he is the best option out their for a trade. i believe he can have a drew breeze like career. two, getting a quality QB via trade solves the QB position and simultaneously solves the RB position by hoarding that first round pick allowing it to be spent where it can be exploited -RB. age is not a benefit at RB, so this is where to use it. DO NOT TRADE DOWN, keep that ace card to get the runningback we want, if ronnie drops 25 pounds he can have an excellent year and be the hammer he may even surprise(if he looses the weight). the o-line concern should also be addressed via freeagency as INCOGNITO prooves that age & experience is a benefit here as well and allows us to hoard yet another said pick. to get that 2ND rounder, trade ricky and a high 2012 pick and then use it where the rest or the league would- RECIEVER. the trend of the new highpowered air assault offenses dictate that having a stud recieving crew is NOT enough whereas additions like dez bryant, hakeem nicks, teams like the vikes, lions, eagles greenbay and even the jets have two or three bonafied vertical threats. yes! this is were the 2nd rounder should be spent. and carson palmer WILL thrive. I hope your palmer theory comes to fruition as i hope the first two picks are spent as i said. GO DOLPHINS!!!

Good point drdolphin should we congratulate Armando on getting Ricky here or is it just more of the same mando.

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