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The type of QB Mike Sherman looks for

General Manager Jeff Ireland knows the quarterback search this offseason is the thing. He knows it's important. And he's eyebrows deep in working the problem.

He's so fired up about the issue, he's told coach Joe Philbin and his assistants and scouts not to breathe a word about Miami's plans, although everyone knows owner Stephen Ross has already identified Peyton Manning as his target if/when he becomes available.

But outside of names, what are the Dolphins looking for to drive their incoming West Coast offense?

"You like to have a guy that will let the system work for him instead of [him working for the system] -- go through his progressions," offensive coordinator Mike Sherman said this week.

Believe it or not, the first thing Sherman looks at when searching for a successful quarterback is not the arm. It's the feet.

"I like to start with feet," he said. "I want to have a guy that has good feet. If you have good feet, you have balance at the top of your route. You're in good throwing position. I always start from the feet up on quarterbacks because we're going to do a fair amount under center as well as in the shotgun on quarterbacks.

"The timing and the rhythm of the play is so important. In the West Coast offense, tempo and rhythm is very important -- one, two, three. One, two, three. We time the drops. With [Brett] Favre for six years we timed his drops to see where he is in his time from point A to point B."

OK so feet is a big deal. What else?

"Other things in the West Coast offense is you like ot have a quarterback who is able to make a good decision, have a quick release, get the ball out as he goes through his progression."

So if you're judging the QBs available in free agency, the draft and through trade, judge the things Sherman is judging.

 

 

Comments

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Weeden has more shelf life than Manning!

Manning is toast. He still needs more surgeries. He will play half a season max if he plays again at all.

Imawriter why is my sign in name written in your post?

Sounds like RG3 fits Ole' Sherm's wants and needs. Not many others fit his descriptions of a West Toast QB... With RG3, the 3 is actually the amount of years before we compete in the SB guys

We gave up 3 picks, they gave us 1 pick, net difference 2 extra later round picks, its not as bad as some of you like to make it sound. Let's not forget the only RB on the roster at the time was Lex Useless. They had to take a RB somewhere.

Aldon | February 18, 2012 at 07:29 PM

We could pick up either Micheal Bush(Oak) or Mike Tolbert (SD) in this coming FA or added someone like D.Sproles last Yr. while waiting out the eventual cut of R.Bush which was another Knee Jerk reaction by Ireland. I hope and pray we see D.Thomas put up a few 1,000 Yard seasons but remember the Pre-Draft scouting report was clear. It said he ran small for his size, avoided contact and was often injured. This all proved prophetic, I wonder why some teams had D.Murray rated between 4 and 6 as the best available, I thought he was top 2 that's just me. At the end of the day the criticism is aimed at Ireland more than D.Thomas who I believe this Coaching staff will look to get more creative with while not over using Bush but wouldn't be shocked by a move for someone like M.Bush either who should be about a 4 Mil player in the open market.

Weeden has more shelf life than Manning!

redsky | February 18, 2012 at 07:36 PM

redsky,

I really liked Weeden, I saw his Comp.%, TD's and Yards and said to myself this guy will come in and probably compete right away, no concentration issues given he's married and will handle the transition. Then I saw the Fiesta Bowl Vs. Stanford and Luck. The truth is a rather weak Stanford team was able to get pressure on him early and really disrupt his rhythm Offense.

He threw some passes into the middle of the field that Blackmon (best overall athlete and playmaker in this draft)went up and took from the Defenders turning into 14 quick 2nd Qrt. points but in the NFL it would have been 2 picks that even without the scores were inside there side of the 50.

Look at him overall and he seems like a system QB and that doesn't mean he can't play as a matter of fact he seems tailor made for a West Coast attack. I just wonder about when the timing isn't there given the NFL pass rush is head over heals anything he's seen before if he turns into the frog I saw or has it to get over the hump. I guess only time can answer if he's another Chris Weinke or not. We do have some O minded Coaches for him to work with for the 1st time in close to 15 Yrs. though.

Knee jerk reaction? How so? I don't see how anyone can know the inner workings. You just can't assume nobody else would have traded for him. Meanwhile, Bush did get 1000 yards and have his best year as a pro, so maybe we should cut Ireland some slack.

Since when are scouting reports crystal balls? How many top 10 picks have been busts? If scouting reports were reliable, there would be little need for GM's.

I don't see any more moves coming at RB this season. We signed that Canadian guy, plus Bush Thomas and Slaton.

It is super easy to criticize. But we are on the outside looking in. We are not interviewing the players. We don't watch tape 40 hours a week. We don't talk to their previous coaches and teammates. We know very little about why players are selected or passed up on.

3 picks for D Thomas was insanely stupid.

Knee jerk reaction? How so? I don't see how anyone can know the inner workings. You just can't assume nobody else would have traded for him.

////////////////You can see it anyway you want but Bush was a 5 Yr. Pro who had gotten every chance in the World to be the man in N.O. He was always either hurt or refused to show up at Training Camp because he was to busy with his Hollywood friends in L.A.

You also forget that his competition in N.O. was NEVER would you would call top notch, steady at times but NOT top notch. He was in the final Yr. of his deal and was going to cost 5 Mil against the CAP. They had drafted M.Ingram and got the player like Bush who was NEVER hurt Sproles.

The ENTIRE NFL knew he was done as a Saint, PLEASE!! Ireland feared he could NEVER talk Bush into coming to Miami again he is a West Coast guy and conventional wisdom would have put him in a team on that COAST maybe a reunion with Carroll in nearby Seattle, again PLEASE!!///////////////////////////////////////////

Since when are scouting reports crystal balls? How many top 10 picks have been busts? If scouting reports were reliable, there would be little need for GM's.

///////There NEVER is such a thing as a sure bet but the runs small for his size thing is something that EVERY SINGLE COUTING REPORT I read said about him, not one outside of Mike Mayock was sold on his ability in the power run formation that Miami ran under Sparano and with Saban maybe this staff with more zone blocking will get more out of him.

As far as ZERO moves I will remind you we always go into training camp with 7 to 8 RB's on the original T.C. Depth chart. The Canada player you mention is supposed to be some type of FB (Lex 2.0) Slaton is NO lock we were lucky as HELL Bush wasn't injured, ect...//////////

I don't see any more moves coming at RB this season. We signed that Canadian guy, plus Bush Thomas and Slaton.

Aldon | February 18, 2012 at 08:07 PM

Last year was widely called the best draft for QB's in 20 years. I thought we should draft 2. Ireland, not taking ANY, was insanely stupid too!

Could it be no RB is going to run the house down in NO? They have Brees and a dozen offensive weapons. Maybe Bush just went to the wrong team to showcase his talents? How do you explain his first year on a messed up team he has his best season and breaks 1000 yards?


How many times has every single scouting report praised (and predicted) the #1 overall pick? Well most of the time they were dead wrong. So, scouting reports are toilet paper when reality strikes.

I'm only saying his first year on a new team in a new offense and he performed very well. Let's see how well he does with the new gurus before ragging him.


Objective you are not. The analysts and scouting reports make your mind up for you.

Objective you are not. The analysts and scouting reports make your mind up for you.

Aldon | February 18, 2012 at 08:56 PM

You obviously are a little new to this particular site or something because if not then you've never read a word I've written here in almost 3 Yrs. I read every report out before the start of the NCAA Season. I follow our needs by position through an entire season with QB almost exclusively this Yr..

This Yr. the only QB's I didn't see much of were Weeden, Brock Osweiler or Cousins. I did see however alot of the others and can say that I believe Landry Jones overhyped and wonder given the type of rythm O run at Okla. St if it isn't the reason for the success of Weeden along with Blackmon who I believe the best prospect at any position in this draft outside of A.Luck but then again I loved the way Barkley (USC) played Vs. Luck then one upped him smashing Oregon St. at home which beat up on Luck pretty good, his decision to stay altered everything, again nothing is a given except that Mel Kiper will make more mistakes than any prognosticator.

That aside you switched the argument because we were discussing if R.Bush wasn't on his way out in N.O. not what his value was at this point last Yr. which was that of NFL FA player on his way out and who probably heads to Seattle or maybe Arz. playing on his Coast as a part timer and be honest every time he hit a hole you held your breath nobody would catch him cleanly. The trade like alot of things Ireland still feel a little pressured. That was my point and you just debated the players and not the reasons themselves for my argument but to say that any ONE report makes up my mind for me is not ever having read anything I've posted which is your right and agenda. My points and $1.00 buy you a cheap cup of coffee but seem to make sense to me and some others on here.

Weeden will be fine also he outperformed Luck and beat him heads up. He is a winner plain and simple...

weeden will never be anything in the nfl, get real

My points and $1.00 buy you a cheap cup of coffee but seem to make sense to me and some others on here.

Posted by: fin4life | February 18, 2012 at 09:24 PM

I like coffee but you have to be very careful with which liquor to mix it with.

Just as Philbin and Sherman have their beliefs in hidden talent, they'll also have some guys they feel are over rated and outdated.

It's going to be a very interesting off season.

Ross should stop charging NFL prices for an Arena caliber team.

Aldon is right. Fin4life is wrong, regardless of how much the nerd reads or humiliates his geek self by bragging.

gggg is wrong.

He doesn't even know what he's saying Aldon is right about of Fin4life is wrong about.

He just flap jaw to listen to rocks rattle.

Shanahan and Elway will both be keeping a close eye on Weeden in the hopes of landing him for a song and dance.

He needs to go to a team that's already pretty good needing only their QB of the future. Denver seems like an ideal situation for him.

Most will think twice before taking him on as a 2-3 year project because of his age.

I can see him fitting in good with Denver, Washington and maybe even Da Raiders(as a quick study project behind Palmer).

Whatever we do, I hope it's NOT Tannehill.

uh odin washington and denver arent close

guys this might sound crazy and I do not know if he is free this year. But could Vince Young be brought in?? He was hurt last season, but if you really want the mobile type of QB he probably would be the best tested of the bunch.

That move would allow you enough money to stay focused on the D in free agency. You could then package some picks to get say Blackmon or stay put and get a pass rusher. Then you could fix the line and add depth.

Seems to me we are being very shallow in our search for a QB. Just because we have Philbin does not mean we cant go in another direction.

I would not be shocked if Henne was not on the team come spring.

I would be ok if they brought in a Linhert or a Young to compete with Moore. The only two QB's in the draft is Luck and RG. We are not going to get a chance at those two so expand the search. I personnally am worried that our RB spot is being over looked. WE did not seem to be able to pound the ball and in our division you win by keeping Brady on the bench. Shoot outs are dangerous and I dont care if you get Flynn, Manning, or Marino out of retirement.

You win with good QB play, clock control offense that keeps your D fresh and pass rushers who make the other teams QB make the mistakes. That is how the Giants did it and how we should develop our team.

Green Bay was sitting at home watching the game just like us.

Go Dolphins!!

Aldon is right. Fin4life is wrong, regardless of how much the nerd reads or humiliates his geek self by bragging.

gggg | February 18, 2012 at 09:59 PM

If you agree with Aldon that's fine but wonder if your juvenile post isn't aimed at simply looking to get a rise out of people while posting ZERO opinions about anything, I may not agree with what Aldon has to say but respect his right to his opinion you on the other hand????

POINTS DEBATED:

Whether the trade of 3 picks for a RB with players like Demarco Murray sitting there Rd.3 (Our Pick in that Rd came before the Cowboy pick)I didn't like it much (thought we were going to get aggressive on a move for Mallett)and was shocked by this selection. He disagreed, I don't see were the humiliation in voicing the opinion??

I thought we could have waited out the eventual cut regarding Bush but understand why Ireland traded here given I doubt Bush on the open market would have come to Miami but there was always Sproles who signed the CAP friendly 4.5 Mil offer and you can make a case out performed Bush and has steadily through out his career.

Here again he disagreed and again that is his agenda, I get the trade but he could have kept all these picks and dealt some in Rd.4 for USC T.E. Jordan Cameron (position of need) who flashed some in Pre-Season for Cleveland before injury. You then grab the Jimmy Wilson's of the World Rd.7 with the throw away picks that were mentioned, hey you know what Ahmad Bradshaw was a 7th Rounder as well, go ask Eli if he is a throw away pick!!!

AGAIN BASE YOUR ATTACKS WITH YOUR OPINION AND FACT WHILE BEING MORE CREATIVE WITH YOUR VERBAL ASSAULTS. I MEAN "NERD" REALLY?? HAVEN'T HEARD IT TOSSED AROUND SINCE GRAMMER SCHOOL!!!

ok who is aldon?

I predict the Dolphins will stink again in 2012.

anybody wanna fes-up?

ya,we aint good swami

Fin4

Fin4

Fin4, getting cut off

Fuggedaboutdit!

I believe the Rams have two good options with their 1st round pick.

1) Trade with Cleveland for their two high picks and still get Blackmon and an o-lineman.

2) Rams offer to trade BRADFORD to Cleveland (preferrably or some other taker) for their two picks or someone willing to offer two 1st round picks (a 1st round caliber player, a 1st round pick and some lower round picks)assuming Griffin goes off the charts during the combine. Fisher decides that he wants his own QB instead of Bradford. He's aware that Bradford is injury prone. He was hurt in college (ankle, surgery to his right shoulder)and missed six games last year.

Fins could be in play in either scenarion. Rams need a 1st round caliber WR (which could be Marshall) and a 1st round pick to get an o-lineman (Fins 8th or 9th pick) and possibly a 3rd or 4th round pick.

Fins would get Griffin or Bradford in the deal.

We can forget about either option if Manning is in playing condition because ROSS knows that he's the only QB that will fil the seats. Ireland's job would be safe for another year if Manning bombs because it wasn't HIS PICK.

Swami with an "i" isn't me.

..The more I think about our quartrback situation. The more I am leaning toward Matt Flynn as the answer. First off. I understand the risks. There are a lot of them. I cannot debate the fact he is unproven..The same is true for any of the rookies coming in this draft. The difference, and it is as obvious as the sun rises in the east, and sets in the west is he knows how to play in this system. He would also be a long term answer unlike a Peyton Manning(who I would also support)

I think about it this way.. We have all agreed that should Philbin endorse Flynn. This is the final word. He will live or die with this choice should he come to South Beach..I cannot get past the fact Flynn of all the available, or possible qb's would be the only one who would be able to execute the entirety of the playbook come day 1. Qb's go years before they can do this. Our quarterbacks have barely scraped the edge of the full playbook. So the offense comes across as unimaginative. It also makes it a lot easier to defend as the tendencies are obvious.

I don't care what Flynn did in college. I don't care about the history of backups getting big contracts, and then ultimatley flopping. Few were in situations were they were in an offense as long as Flynn has been, with the coach who he learned it. Flynn IMO makes the most sense as the guy we should go after.

Swamy, I agree, Bradford may be traded away! Good post!

Darryl D, I get Flynn as a FA and Weeden in the draft. I also try for Blackmon if available!

Darryl. I couldnt agree more. But I also think another option in the draft would ne Kellon Moore. Sure, he doesnt have prototypical size, but niether does Drew Brees, ansd Kellon is only a HALF INCH SHORTER. They say he doesnt have the arm strength. That was said about Joe Montana, and Tom Brady. What Kellon has done, is win. He also has a very high competion percentage, which would be great for the west coast offense. I wouldnt mind signing Flynn, and drafting Kellon Moore. He will probably still be there in 3rd round.

Bravphin, Kellen Moore is another one that should be considered. A Doug Flutie/Drew Brees type. He got a great write up in SI!

Bravphin...Redsky.. I have debated Kellen moore with Yg in the past. I really like Kellen Moore. I thought he was a tremndous college player, a winner, a leader. everything you look for in a quarterback. I had a chance to go watch him play in person this year. It was actually the TCU game that Boise lost.. Moore was great that game..I just can't get over his size..Or lack of. I know some undersized guys have had success in the league. In the case of Moore..when you see it live it is a suprise..Seriously his helmet is as big as he is(joke)..I would be for taking a chance on Moore in a later round. I just don't know that we will do this as we have Devlin on the developmental squad(I don't know where he sits in the scheme of things for the club)..I think that if we do go the free agent route. It would leave us with our starter, Matt Moore, and Devlin. In this scenario, I don't see room for another developmental guy this year..Just my opinion.

DD, I understand your conundrum, but that's why Weeden is a a good good option, for consideration. Ready to go, west coast offense, has beaten Luck and RG3, longer shelf life than Manning!

Has it occurred to anybody that maybe Philbin has no interest in Flynn? Just because they were on the same team doesn't mean anything.

Being that Philbin knows Flynn so well, it seems premature for anybody to say they think Flynn makes sense until we here from the FO they are even interested in him.

..Aldon. Yes it is a real possibility Philbin has no plans to bring Flynn here..In this case all of the upside I see with Flynn here in Miami is reduced to a pile of rubble..I'm just voicing my opinion as to who I would like to see the team go after as our guy. It has no bearing in the outcome..just my opinion.

I've been wondering about the Sam Bradford scenario out loud for sometime as well. You take into consideration the type of O that Fisher likes to run or ran with McNair and see parallels between the two alot more than the Vick or Cam comparisons in honesty. RG111 while being an incredible athlete likes to throw out of the pocket and slide looking downfield more than given credit for. You add his speed and he could be an Air McNair 2.0 you then consider Steven Jackson and see a bigger Eddie George. They only lack the TE (Frank Wycheck) and speedy WR needed to run the type of Offensive team Fisher likes.

The thing is in this scenario you have to wait out how Mike Holgrem and Shanahan feel about Bradford. I get the feeling though that if Peyton is cleared to go it will be the Redskins and Shanahan putting on the full court press. I think Shanahan is tired of the rebuilding mess he inherited in Wash. and will put a premium on his draft picks to restock an old team at WR and RB. They also have gaps at MLB (London Fletcher) with age and need help at CB as well. I think the Owner who breaks the Bank here is Snyder as well in a lets give it are all (Jets style) go for broke in a blaze of glory with Shanahan type deal.

If this is the case then a trade down for our pick 8 isn't as easy to move unless someone big slides and if that happens I gotta hope and believe we make the pick. In the past the trade downs have netted Pat White, Koa Misi and Daniel Thomas while passing on Earl Thomas, JPP ect.. The picks could have panned given we passed on Gronk, J.Graham and A.Hernandez respectively but that's a different story. If we can't move on RG111 or Bradford via trade. I take best available at our pick and go with Flynn for everything Darryl D. posted.

Fine Darryl. I guess I have a hard time forming an opinion on Flynn when nobody knows him better than the new HC. I'll take his word on him, but I will say I am suspect that Flynn is anything more than mediocre at best.

DD, Aldon,

If Philbin gives M.Flynn the cold shoulder it will drop his stock quicker than the Real Estate Fannie Mae mess(joke) In all honesty we can agree on one thing regarding all these players and that's that our attitude towards some guys will affect there marketability and yes maybe Philbin isn't even considering Flynn, definitely an interesting off-season ahead, should make for high drama once Manning hits the open market.

Aldon..As I mentioned. There is a ton of risk with Flynn. I understand this. I also will not pretend to know anything about him except what I mentioned. This is HUGE IMO..It will be easy, and put the debate to rest come the free agency period..If we do pass, and look elsewhere..There is nothing to say. At the risk of sounding redundant..The system familairity is what is the hook for me..Obviously we agree(I think) that if Philbin trusts Flynn to sign him. There shouldn't be much argument as far as the direction we go.

fin4life.. I think most of us are on the same page as far as the Philbin-Flynn situation. Some, if not many bloggers may not perfer Flynn, or think we would be better off going another direction..But it is going to be hard to debate the selection should Philbin make his bed with Flynn..Weather or not he works out would remain to be seen. This has been said more then once, and will probably be repeated again..Philbins life in Miami will be forever tied with Flynn should we go ths route..This IMO would speak volumes as far as trust in Flynn should he be the QB we aquire.

As far as Bradford..You may be right. I just think other teams are going to have a hard time taking on Bradfords contract when they could take a top rookie this year at a much lower price.

If the STARS don't align our way then gotta admit that I hate the idea of reaching on the 2nd tier guys at QB in the draft. I then really look to grab the highest rated at position of need and make a go of it with what we have while waiting out the next class. I know people will blast me for the statement but then we can take a guy our new O.C. can work with lower round and forget Devlin he isn't a guy pegged by this group. If Philbin decides to make a stink about Offensive moves by Ireland I really think it will finally carry weight with Ross as well this will be more of a collective effort than before IMO.

As far as Bradford..You may be right. I just think other teams are going to have a hard time taking on Bradfords contract when they could take a top rookie this year at a much lower price.

Darryl Dunphy | February 19, 2012 at 01:02 AM

Great point, 6 Yrs.//86 Mil with incentives//50 Mil guaranteed. If you move on Bradford you better be sold on him because that deal is a killer, you could also try and restructure but doubt his camp would budge an inch on the guatantee.

fin4life...The evaluation process has not even really started..I say this because there could be guys whos stock rises to a first round grade that right now are thought to be second even third rounders. What I would hate to see is the club draft a quarterback in the second round because we failed to sign a free agent, or complete a trade. Especially if there are other position players the team has graded higher. It is possible one of these darkhorses stock rises to a late first round grade but is passed by the teams in the later part of round 1 who aren't in the market for a qb. It would be feasible to think the teams ahead of us in round 2 have their QB situation addressed, and a guy the team likes is available..In this scenario I could support a move in round 2...

A lot of ifs, ands, or buts...I know.

A lot of ifs, ands, or buts...I know.

Darryl Dunphy | February 19, 2012 at 01:18 AM

Good post 110% agree our thinking here couldn't be more lock & step!

..I'm calling it a night...Have a great Holiday weekend! Be safe

If you go by Sherman's formula for first thing you look for in a qb(Feet). Then Luck and RG3 are far and away the top qb's available in this year's draft. Especially when you add next, decision making, and quick release.

Does Flynn have these qualities? Only Philbin knows. I also expect Philbin gives Peyton the full looksie over before proclaiming to Ross and Ireland it's a full go to sign him in fa.

Also, with all of the trade up possibilities in lieu. Im also sure this new hc and oc will be at RG3's combine and and pro day workouts nbringing along thier Nasa certifie3d Hubble telescopes.

Armando, between the under-par blogs and increased amount of trolls the blog is a getting a little dull.

Please bring on the draft and FA already so there's something to write about.

MiamiD20, I'm also tired of the repetition, but until the FA and draft

All we have is conjecture!

What a bunch of sleepy heads! Goodnight!

uh odin washington and denver arent close

Posted by: dusty bottoms | February 18, 2012 at 10:15 PM

Uh, Dusty you smoking the paranoid stuff again?

I never said Denver and Oakland were close. Where the fvck you getting those hallucinations from Home Skillet?

You would do better to just stick with the "Everything Sucks", "Whoa is me mentality". That seems to be your best contribution round here!

PS: Maybe you do better with ALoco/Oscar/YG/MJ/C63, etc, etc. Duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh!

Armando.

Armando.

Armando getting cut off.

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