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Getting Flynn at right price as important as getting him

The question today is apparently not whether the Dolphins will try to sign Matt Flynn. It seems if the team gets a chance to sign the Green Bay free agent backup quarterback, that is exactly what will happen.

No, the question I believe more important is not whether the Dolphins will try to sign Flynn but how they'll try to sign Flynn. It's a completely different issue and definitely as important an issue.

Flynn, according to a reliable source, will be in town sometime late tonight. He'll be here, assuming he doesn't get blown away by the Seattle Seahawks and simply jumps at the opportunity. But once he arrives, then what?

What to do with Flynn?

Do the Dolphins commit to Flynn as their starter or do they commit to him as, ahem, a quarterback who will come to camp and compete with Matt Moore for the starting job. In other words, do the Dolphins commit starting quarterback money or do they commit the kind of money a player who has a chance to start but isn't certain of that typically gets?

If the Dolphins are committing to Flynn as their starter, they may have to spend between $7-$9 million per season. The deal would probably extend past two years and there would be a chunky bag of guaranteed money included.

The lesser commitment is obviously cheaper -- probably $4-$5 million per year with incentive clauses that would hike the deal's worth if Flynn wins the starting job, thus deserving more money. This kind of deal protects the team if he fails.

Me?

Flynn is worth one but definitely not the other. He is a value if signing a deal that protects the team in case he's more A.J. Feeley than Drew Brees. He still gets paid if he becomes a star. But he has to earn his money rather than getting it the minute he walks in the locker room.

Makes sense, right?

The problem is Flynn wants to maximize his earning. He will want the biggest deal he can get, certainly his agent will want that. And because he's got two quarterback-hungry teams talking to him, he might be able to leverage one versus the other to get what he wants.

(Personally, I don't see the Seahawks letting themselves be held up. They paid Travaris Jackson a two-year deal worth $8 million last season. I assume if they offer Flynn, it'll be a similar deal and ask him to fight for the starting job. I say this because you must remember Flynn was not Seattle's top QB choice this offseason. They actually scheduled Chad Henne to come to town before Flynn. Henne never made it because he signed with Jacksonville.)

Well, the Dolphins can similarly make the case that Flynn is not their top choice. At least I hope they make that case. Everyone knows they wanted Peyton Manning. And I assume they aren't going to use the money on Flynn that they would have used on Manning.

At least I hope not because that's just dumb.

I guess what I'm asking is for the Dolphins to hold their desperation in check. Getting Flynn simply isn't like getting Manning. We don't even know if he's any good.

With Flynn it's not just about getting him to come. As a relatively unproven player, he has to come at the right price -- for the team.

Follow me on twitter please.

Comments

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The rumour is the Broncos are offering Manning $60 million over 5 years. Where were we going up with that kind of money?....come on! It wasn't realistic to begin with.

GET ROSS AND IRELAND OUT OF MIAMI!!!!

Two points
1- Did Chand Henne not prove that having a strong arm is not a guarantee of wins?
2- Why is Pat Devlin not being tslked about atleast as a competitor?


Look at it this way.

Posted by: JackSparrow | March 16, 2012 at 01:51 PM

=========================================

No.

Phins78 = KOOL-AID DRINKIN HOMER

Phins78 = DULL

Phil @ 12:40 - What you're not taking into account in your argument is that Philbin has actually worked with Flynn the last 4 years. Our other coaches did not coach and work with the "2nd rate" QBs they brought in, so in many respects, they were flying blind.

Could Philbin be wrong on Flynn? Absolutely! Could he be right? Absolutely!

Philbin = Cam Cameron
Flynn = A.J. Feeley
Posted by: MJ | March 16, 2012 at 01:03 PM

_____________________________________________________

And you know this how exactly? Seriously, not a down has been played.

Charter member of Douches of Dispair.

Is always bullcrap to me. They have the stories no one else has. Don't get me wrong ESPN and SI.com and even the NFL network drum up stories too but stories are always leaked for a reason. Maybe Flynn's agent leaked that to get Seattle to drive the price up so Miami has to match. Unless Mort, Schefter, Glazer or Clayton report it then all bets are off.

Posted by: AndyNJ | March 16, 2012 at 01:48 PM

Most, not all, but most of PFT's reports are just taking from all the other sources, ESPN, SI and the local papers for the various teams. PFT is like a centralized feed for all the news going on.

Ahhhhhh pffffftttttt. None of this tells us anything. Stop reading into reports that may or may not be true, it's a waste of time. Reporters are full of s**t and regularly make things up to write a story. They have made multiple mistakes (Hey Petersen is ion the plane with Ross! Ross just undermined Ireland's authority what a joker) and they never come back and admit they were wrong, their sources were wrong, or that they made a mistake. They f**k up and then the next day pretend none of it happened. And now we're going to believe erroneous reports coming from second rate news outlets? How gullible do they think we are. I'm going to let it play out before jumping the gun. Novel f***ing idea.

Where is the homely, homer home? The Phrophet? The Know it all, the predictor of all things? The spam artist?

Gotta be depressing to steal every name out there giving yourself attn & wind up being completely wrong about everything.

Phins78 = likes losing

I would really have liked to been able to hear what Marino whispered into Peytons ears.

It probably went something like this Marino says > you don't want anything to do with this jackazz owner and GM. lol

And Peyton whispered back > I didn't want to play in the house that you built Dan, I respect you and you are my childhood hero and I don't want to break anymore of your records as a Dolphin. I love you man!!!!

Flynn trying to cash out. A person in his position would just want to start. Forget the money and just get a starting job. Sign a 2 year deal and prove your worth. Then cash out in three years once you prove yourself.

If he really liked Philbin and Philbin really liked him, then he would accept that low ball offer and prove himself.

Ummm yeah I don't talk to trolls who have no opinion yet choose to come in and scream nonsense when we're having a fun debate. Move on troll, nothing to see here and no one cares about your ridiculous three worded posts. Bye bye

I will soon be accused of being CHEAP FISH...You just wait n see! lol

So what's plan C Ireland homers? If your boy Flynn doesn't come here then what is plan C? Draft some acorns with those 2 extra 3rd rounders?

Phins78,

I agree with you 100 percent. The idea of him being low balled is not a big deal. Like you said there is no market for Flynn. There are not enough QB needy teams left. The Titans have Locker who they can groom while adding Peyton, The Cards can't go with anything other then a sure thing after the Kolb fiasco and the Broncos need something bigger then Tebow mania to justify the signing. The only other teams left are Miami, Seattle and Cleveland. Only 2 of 3 showed interest so there is really no market.

What's Miami supposed to do make him a ridiculous offer when all they have is one competitor out there? That would be bad business.

Phins78 = KOOL-AID DRINKIN HOMER

If Flynns looking for a place where he'll get the biggest paycheck then let him walk. If he's looking for a place where he'll have the best chance to succeed. Then with Philbin in place, Miami's the no brainer.

In the later case he should be more than willing to sign a contract that's more than fair for both parties involved. ENUFF SAID!

...What is the Market value, if there are only 2 teams in the market??? The rumors that Flynn would recieve a second tier contract have been floating around all week. This is no suprise if the report is true.

This said..JS in La..I read your list. I would agree with most of it..A few switches here or there. And you are right. Your list is right on the mark. The only issue I have is we don not know where Flynn could notch his name once given a chance? Is it possible that he is the perfect quarterback for this system? Getting his opportunity at the right time?

I understand why some are very hesitant at the thought of Flynn..To many unknowns, to much history of failure in similar scenarios(backups becoming starters)There just isn't enough information out there to give the fans any reason to believe Flynn is the answer. The underlying blessing is that the coach does have ALL the information, all the knowledge. Everything we need to properly evaluate, and project what he can do. This cannot be said for any other quarterback, for any other team..

I know the team hasn't done enough in the decision making area to give the fans confidence in anything they do..Sure we have some good players, But the failures outweigh the success. So it is easy, and understandable to be synical about everything the team does, and mocked for showing any support. I just think that if Flynn ends up here it is a move that Phin fans should support. He may not be flashy, he may nt have been the first choice..He may end up being the perfect fit.

Sheff and Mort just reported 2pm est ESPN that SF is the sleeper team for Peyton Manning. Harbaugh flew down to watch Peyton throw passes and are now in the hunt for Manning.

I would like to believe that you're more intelligent than that Captain Obvious. Who cares who it is, the person is a mental midget.

YG, Flynn isnt going to win in Miami. We have no playmakers and Ireland is a baffoon at drafting.

sign flynn and draft weeden in the 2nd or 3rd rd...weedens 28 but roger staubach was 29 when the cowboys took him from the naval academy...let moore battle it out with them as starting qb...what do you all think?

Imagine the egomaniac Ross thinking he ever had a chance to land Manning with all of the dysfunctionality he's created in Miami. Thats highly laughable! LOL

Once teams have a game plan to expose Flynn he'll end up like Fitzpatrick. The bodyy of work is only 2 gmaes so teams dont know his tendacies, once they do its up to Flynn to adjust, who knows maybe he'll be out Dree Brees.

JS in LA,
I could see the Broncos talking to Tebow about a position change if Manning ends up there. Not sure if he'd be open to it or not.....

Posted by: Craig M | March 16, 2012 at 01:29 PM

If you know much about Tebow, he may be squeaky clean Attaboy team player, but he's an alpha when it comes to QBing. He'll get on the field any way he can if that's his only option, but if he can find a starting possibility elsewhere, ..yeah even he would want to go.

And Henne would fair even worse than Orton to the fan base if Tebow were avilable to Jags. They'd be all in.
But, maybe they simply can't make a QB move now.

Arizona, maybe.
S.F, maybe (heard rumor Harbaugh was a fan)
Who knows. Just hope whoever it is is ALL-IN on him, and gives it a fair try.

Exactly Andy. It's business 101; chapter 1; NEGOTIATING TACTICS.

Or you can read the book "Dolphins fan from the Herald blog" "How to misinterpret everything your team does in order to ridicule them,,,,,,FOR DUMMIES".

DolphinDave,

I never said Flynn would win in Miami. I only said this would be his best landing spot having Philbin in house. LOL

Here is another head scratcher. Henne has been there for a while. They don't think Moore is the answer and they don't have Flynn in the bag. So Henne walks. Now, what happens if Flynn doesn't sign with Miami? We have a QB they don't think can get it done and lost a QB that could at least challenge Moore for the starting job.

So far this offseason is shaping up to be the worst offseason in Miami Dolphin history.

Phins78,

I'm not saying the report on PFT and from Jason Cole at Yahoo is accurate, just saying that the story is out there. People can make their own minds up on what they want to believe. I happen to think a large percentage of it is made up stuff anyways, but I have to admit, everything I've seen so far, it would surprise me if they are squeezing Flynn. I'm totally fine if they are...I've argued all along that he's not a clear upgrade. Happy to have him....at the right price.

Darryl, the market for Flynn is mnore than the $3.375 mil/year deal Henne signed to be a back up. Start there but it's gonna likely be about double that.

Low balling makes no sense if you:

A. Have a need(CHECK)
B. Best last option available (Check)
C. Are desperate (Check)
D. Will wind up moving your price up anyway(CHECK)
E. All of the above

Should have said 'WOULDN'T surprise me if they are squeezing him'. Sorry....

Who cares! hahahaha f**k Peyton Manning. The NERVE of that guy! Ba Da TISH!

YG, oh ok. Fair point but I still think he'd have a better chance to win with Pete Carrol.

If we could just go back say 15 -20 years ago we wouldn't even know what is going on unless we watched TV or heard it on the radio or read it in the Harold or Sunsentental.

In this super fast information network years everything is out there Just because.

Moore was 6-6 on the season. He has never beaten a team with a winning record. He has never thrown for 300 yards in a game.

=================================================
A word about spinning? Maybe you should realy dig a little more into Moore's stats. To say he has NEVER beaten a winning team is flat out BS...PERIOD..check it, when you do then come back...Thanks

Peyton will most likely end up in Denver or San Fransisco. Of all of the teams that were in the Manning race. Denver and San Fransisco are the most sb ready.

Only these two are a Peyton Manning away to having legit sb hopes.

If Peyton was afraid to play against Belecheat, Brady, Mario and Revis Island...what makes anyone think Flynn can come in and put all them to shame?

Anyone have a killer Corned Beef and Cabbage recipe...

Top of the afternoon to ya all. I'm out.

Some fans are as exited about Matt Flynn as they were about A.J. Feeley.

Now regarding a contract for Flynn, should it go that far.
1) I think he should be given a salary in the range to that of Moore, and he should have to compete for the sarting position.
2) if he wins the starting role an incentive bonus would be offered.
3) the course of his contract would be incentive based.
Earn it you get it.
4) If he walks..let him walk..

JackSparrow, totally agree on Flynn (it's rather unlikely he'll be as good as Rodgers).

Mark, also wanted to disagree with you. I think it's imperative that we grab a QB in the Draft to develop. People, in a league where elite QB play is increasing becoming a necessity, if we get Flynn we'll have THREE back-of-the-draft (or undrafted) QBs. That's NOT a winning recipe. Also, don't compartmentalize the issue. Add those to the 15 or so QBs since Marino, and you'll see we are probably the dumbest team EVER in acquiring QB talent.

We need to draft a QB (HIGH) and develop him. Then let these band-aids do what they do, and when they all fail, we have someone ready to step in.

If Manning ALONE would have turned this sorry bunch of players into a potential Playoff (and SB) team, then you should understand how much one elite QB can affect the quality of your team.

This might not be the year, but we still need QB talent in the franchise (even if it's developing).

So now Mortensen is reporting that SF is intersted in Manning and Manning worked out for them this week. What a STRANGE story!!....so many twists and turns. I said a long time ago SF would be smart to go after Manning and NOTHING.....know this.....how very odd! Last I heard the Smith deal was basically done. So is that on hold all of a sudden? It's a great move for them if they get him. I just can't see them winning a championship with Alex Smith. Yes they were good last year but Smith is still the problem on that team. They'd be gold with a healthy Manning.

JackSparrow,

Dont think for a minute Peyton was afraid of what would be his afc east opponent. He was afraid his greatest opponent would have been this fo itself and the gross dysfunction of Ross/Ireland.

Thats what Manning feared most and you cant blame him.

Craig M,

I'm happy to have Flynn at the right price too.

Just don't know if Ireland could be carrying it too far in trying to get some srange version of a "hometown discount".

Peytons not afraid of anyone. That's reporter talk. The same guys that were in charge of the projectors in high school. (come on now, tell me Greg Cote didn't run the projector at your school!) They are the ones who think a professional hall of fame athlete would be scared to play in the same division with people who are of equal talent.

That is loser talk. It is an idea spawned from mice, not men. If ANYONE has ever heard of one professional athlete saying he didn't want to play in a certain place because he was afraid of the talent on the opposite side please let me know.

The JAGS need a WR..Cleveland could be in the mix also.
I can nearly bet he will not fall to 8.

I am glad we don't have Manning, he is a walking injury just waiting to get injured again. I am tired of all the hype on the news about Manning too, there are other important players and teams than the Peyton show. Matt Moore played very good for us, Henne sucked, and bringing Matt Flynn in would be a good idea. I think he is smart, and able to go forward with the West Coast Offense we are about to embark upon. I am also sick of listening to all the negative comments by the sports personnel, just because we don't have Manning doesn't mean our team and the organization sucks, we are only a few players away from being great. Go Dolphins!

above post, strange* version of a hometown discount.

finfaneurope,

I agree with you, but I don't think that's going to get it done to get Flynn. I think Seattle will offer him more. Gotta say guys, this isn't really a ringing endorsement of Flynn by Philbin and if the FO isn't listening to him and Ireland is making his own decisions, well that's a bad way to start a relationship too.

Yeah NYG, throw it all in a pot and boil it for like 6 hours. Then take it out and eat it.

I got that from my recipe book titled "Irish Cuisine".

...For those who are concerned there wasn't much interest in Flyyn is a reason to worry about him being a success here please explain how that any logic?? I would understand that point if the Phins showed no interest..But lets look at this from objective point of view..

I would agree that Flyyn is a system quarterback..Hpow many teams that really need a quarterback use a system Flynn is familiar with? 3 Seattle, Cleveland, Miami. The other teams that are looking for a quarterback have the ability to do it in the draft...Indy, Washington, add Cleveland(I think they take Qb Tannehill, this is why they are out of the Flynn hunt..I could be wrong here)...The other teams..Arizona, Denver, Tennessee all have quarterbacks, and are trying to improve their stocks by adding Manning. It is fair to say that Flynn can't hold Mannings jock so he is out as an option for these teams..

So this leaves Seattle, Miami as the 2 destinations. Where Flynn knows the system, where he could have success..Both team have shown interest..The idea that there is no interst in Flynn is flawed a bit. There just aren't as many teams that really need a starter.

IMO, if Flynn doesnt wanna sign for backup money. We may as well flip him off and draft a qb 2nd rd. Econimically it really doesnt make sense to have Moore, Flynn, and draft a qb 2nd rd anyway.

It also doesnt make sense for us to draft a qb any lower than 2nd rd. Even signing Flynn doesnt answer the age lingering problem of finding a "franchise calibre" qb. Because even after signing Flynn we have no idea if that question's been answered.

Manning to SF made the most sense since day one. Is this what he's been waiting for all along, a team like SF or Houston to show interest? How'd you like to be a Titan fan right now? Owner offers a 'lifetime contract' to Manning and he says no. Played his College ball there, Dad knows the head coach well.....God he's going to be hated in Tennessee now...LOL. Or a Cardinals fan? Have to pay Kevon Kolb his $7 milion bonus tomorrow, after getting your hopes up that Manning was coming....wow!

"if the FO isn't listening to him and Ireland is making his own decisions, well that's a bad way to start a relationship too."

Well Craig,

I can almost picture Philbin sitting across from Ross and Ireland, with the same look Sparano had on his face at that "contract extension" press conference.

If Flynn couldnt beat Rodgers he sure aint gonna beat Brady.

Yeah NYG, throw it all in a pot and boil it for like 6 hours. Then take it out and eat it.

I got that from my recipe book titled "Irish Cuisine".

Posted by: Phins78 | March 16, 2012 at 02:19 PM

phins78,

Sounds good to me. Heading out to pick up a nice corned Beef, cabage, some potatoes and carrots. And of course a case or three for those 6 hours of cooking time. lol

DD @ 2;20,

Spot on post, regarding who is interested in Flynn and why.

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