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McShay: The draft turns with Cleveland's pick

Dolphins fans know their team has the No. 8 overall pick in the draft. Good pick. Elite pick. But fans are rightly focused on what might happen at pick No. 4 before concentrating on No. 8 because many believe the draft's direction will be decided there.

Simply, the Indianapolis Colts are picking Andrew Luck at No. 1.

The Washington Redskins will pick Robert Griffin III at No. 2.

Most pundits believe the Vikings will pick USC left tackle Matt Kalil with the No. 3 pick.

The Browns, meanwhile, are the wildcard. They can trade the pick. Or they can draft. They can take a running back (Trent Richardson). They can take a receiver (Justin Blackmon). They can take a quarterback (Ryan Tannehill).

"I think the whole draft swings at number 4," ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay said this week. "I say that because the Browns really do need almost all the top prospects that will be available at that spot.  They have a wide receiver need, and you've got Justin Blackmon who is most likely available to you.  You've got a need for running back.  You've got to upgrade that position.  You look at the last couple years, Hardesty is their top back, and he can't stay healthy.  He's three yards per carry in his career.

"You've got Little and Massaquoi as your top two wide receivers, and don't have a number one guy. Then quarterback maybe your third or fourth biggest need when you look at urgency.  But it's still a big need, and I think everyone understands that they need ‑‑ whether it's this year or next year, got to find an upgrade over Colt McCoy moving forward for this franchise to take a giant leap."

McShay, like many of you, looks at Tannehill as a possibility and wonders if he's worthy of No. 8 or perhaps even requiring a trade-up.

"It's frustrating, I know, when you look at Tannehill and how quickly he's risen in only 19 starts, and the production isn't elite and the completion percentage and all of that, but I would have a very difficult time passing on him at that number 4 pick," he said. "I just think that he has everything you look for in a future franchise quarterback if you develop him properly and you're willing to be patient.  So that's where Colt McCoy comes in to me.

"You know that you can win some games and you've got a young quarterback.  Yes, Colt may be frustrated, but I know Colt well enough that he's going to do what's right for the team and handle the situation properly at least in the short term.  Then maybe they can trade him and move on.

"But if you bring in Tannehill and sit him for ideally a year or the majority of the year and put him in towards the end of the year to get him some experience, I just think that you're looking at an organization that has its future franchise quarterback.  Has a guy with all the physical tools, the size, arm strength, accuracy, which continues to improve.  Has the right mentality, can handle pressure, and has intangibles through the roof."

McShay believes Tannehill is a bigger value than either Richardson or Blackmon.

"Richardson is going to be a phenomenal back ...," McShay said. "Blackmon, he's probably going to be in that second tier of wide receivers in the NFL, and that's great.  But they don't win Super Bowls.  We haven't seen Adrian Peterson win a Super Bowl.  We haven't seen Andre Johnson win a Super Bowl.  You have a great quarterback, you win Super Bowls; and I think Tannehill has a chance, if developed properly and patient with him, to become a great quarterback."

Comments

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Agree with bobbyd12, but McShay has always said that there is lots of upside to Tannehill. Patience and belief in any quarterback they bring in is key. Look at Henne they never had any kind of belief in him which is why he never made it here.

I'll post this for YG, taken directly from McShay above:

"I just think that he has everything you look for in a future franchise quarterback if you develop him properly and you're willing to be patient. So that's where Colt McCoy comes in to me.

He's (Tannehill)a guy with all the physical tools, the size, arm strength, accuracy, which continues to improve. Has the right mentality, can handle pressure, and has intangibles through the roof."

Now this is just ONE man's opinion but we've heard this now from a number of people. It guarantees NOTHING but it echoes what others have said. What he hasn't said YG, is 'that he has accuracy problems' and he hasn't regurgitated his completion percentage from the last two years, which is a ridiculous stat when you really look at it, for a 22 year old QB. He hasn't said 'Tannehill is a THIRD round QB', as you've suggested and he hasn't said 'he would only go at 4 because teams are desperate for a QB', as you've tried to suggest. Notice also, he hasn't even mentioned Weeden as being 'the guy'. How come? How come NO ONE is saying, 'forget Tannehill and draft Weeden'? How come no one is saying 'Weeden will give you 7-8 years of better production'? You don't like Tannehill....we get it! But to make crap up takes away from credibility you've never even had.

Last thing I'll add....I have NO idea if Tannehill will make it in the pros. I'm not qualified to make a decision like that. It's not what I do in life. However, if everyone is telling you 'Tannehill is the guy to draft' and you take someone else because 'you're scared of being wrong', then you don't seserve to have success in this league. If you can't evaluate a guy properly, when you're OC was his head coach, then there is truly no hope for you as a franchise. These are the type of decisions teams NEED to get right. Keep getting them wrong and you're doomed to mediocrity.

Bobbyd12

sorry bro dolphins will always be #1 for me, and i think judging by the passion in print,the radio, and attendence figures for the marlins since 03 with most others too.

Daniel Thomas rushed for 581 yards last year in 13 games and was injured for a good portion of it.
Had he played the other 3 games his rushing yards would be around 715 based on an average per game.
That would only put him 285 yds away from 1,000.
He could EASILY get that this year and possibly more. Add receiving yards and he could be closer to contributing between 1300 and 1500 yds this year.

J the smoke breather, please keep in mind that Matt Moore won against teams with losing records. Please don't compare a 2 Star generals like Ely to Matt Moore when all we talk about is getting a QB.

The problem here with the Fins is that he won't likely sit a year and as,a result, we will ruin/break tannehill if we draft him.

Running and playing Defense does not win a Super Bowl in today's NFL. The rule changes give a clear advantage to the premiere passing teams. The Giants were one of the worst running teams in the league and their secondary was near the bottom, yet they won it all. QB's and potent passing games win today, so we need to make sure we acquire the pieces to compete.

41phish & smokebreather, LG was Pouncey's natural position and was great at it at UF. UF moved him to center because they didn't have anybody else. Much like the Dolphins. He did well at center (I can recall he lost one game for us though) but it doesn't change the fact his natural position is LG. Look for Philbin to move him back to LG.

And as far as last years draft goes, you can make any excuse you want but there was only one (1) starter.

Professor Lou,

It's ridiculous that guys are writing Thomas off after an injury plagued rookie season. It's the same guys who wrote Odrick off after he got hurt in the first game of the season. Hilarious to hear people call him a 'bust' simply because he got hurt. Personally I really liked Leshoure coming out but the kid was hurt all last year and now he looks like he's going to get suspended. Thomas, if he can stay healthy wil be fine. Guys suggesting we draft Richardson at 8 makes NO sense to me. Running back is not a pressing need on this team right now and I'd be more inclined to draft Floyd or pass rush if Tannehill isn't there.

Mando,

Oh please already....If the Browns take Tannehill @ 4 then they're stupid. That's WAY too high for a QB that was considered a BORDERLINE first round pick just like Christian Ponder was last year.

First off the Browns need to find out if they have a future QB in Colt McCoy. The kid needs more (how about ANY) talent around like Trent Richardson or Blackmon plus they need to protect him better. Sure Joe Thomas is a stud but the kid gets hit too much. He's been thrown to the wolves like too many young QB's trying to get acclimated to the NFL without protection & bereft of talent.

The Browns are in even worse shape then we are on offense which is pretty f#cking sad. IMO-with all of our needs we have on offense I don't see the URGENCY of drafting Tannehill at 8. I don't know if he's better than Matt Moore or will ever be for that matter. I'd much rather see us address our other needs with that that pick & try to get a elite prospect like Coples or Ingram or even Reiff. I'd like to see how Moore (Garrard won't stay healthy) looks in Philbin/Sherman's offense. If he struggles then we'll be picking high again & hopefully we can get a QB better than Tannehill in 2013.

Our fans need to come to grips that regardless of whether we draft Tannehill or not we're going to suck. You can't expect to win many games w/o a starting RT, a starting RG, & average WR's. My point is let's take the best player available at 8 & then worry about drafting a QB high next year. Who knows??? Maybe we trade up next year for Barkley who I like a heck of a lot more than Tannehill.

Wow,
I'm impressed. The majority of fans posting on this site have it right. BPA at #8, and wait till round 2 for your QB.

Faith restoring in Dolfan base.

We Have Draft Picks,

I agree with you on the Browns. For all the reason you gave.

I don't believe it's a guarantee that we suck this year. I think with a new HC and an easier schedule we'll be Ok this year. The time to get a QB is now. These trade up for QBs NEVER work. You saw the price the 'Skins had to pay this year. You'll something similar again next year and that's assuming a team like Cleveland doesn't draft Barkley. Here's a chance to get a sought after QB. There's no pressure on Philbin to win this year and I don't there will be next year. Start the process now, while we have time.

Incidentally, I think Weeden would be a great pick for the Browns at 22 or early 2nd round. Insurance on McCoy and by then they'll have addressed other needs. If they are smart they would take Richardson.

NYG were the best defense in the playoffs allowing 14 pts. per game. Saints were highest scoring offense in the playoffs scoring 38.5 pts per game... Giants were the 5th highest scoring team in the playoffs.. so if offense wins championships they shouldn't of even made the conference finals.. since the lions, saints & 49er's all averaged more pts/game than they did in the playoffs... NE Lost the superbowl although they were 2nd highest scoring offense & 3rd best defense in the playoffs.. so 2 out of 3 best defenses in the playoffs made the finals... the other was Houston, but there offense was so battered they shouldn't have even been in the playoffs using their 3rd or 4th string QB..

McShay believes Tannehill is a bigger value than either Richardson or Blackmon.

"Richardson is going to be a phenomenal back ...," McShay said. "Blackmon, he's probably going to be in that second tier of wide receivers in the NFL, and that's great. But they don't win Super Bowls. We haven't seen Adrian Peterson win a Super Bowl. We haven't seen Andre Johnson win a Super Bowl. You have a great quarterback, you win Super Bowls; and I think Tannehill has a chance, if developed properly and patient with him, to become a great quarterback."

Really??? How many SB's has Phillip Rivers won??? How about Matt Ryan who some Dolphin fans (not me) still complain that we didn't draft??? Don't tell me that Tannehill is going to be better than Rivers b/c that ain't happening. I hate how all these so called "gurus" like Todd McShay or Mike Mayock know;

1) That Tannehill can be GREAT
2) The Dolphins will have a good enough team around him to win a SB

This team is MUCH more than a franchise QB (even Peyton Manning) away from contending. And this Free Agency--or lack there--hasn't done us any favors going forward. Jamal Westerman??? Artis Hicks??? Are you kidding me??? We were 6-10 last year!!!!

Wow,
I'm impressed. The majority of fans posting on this site have it right. BPA at #8, and wait till round 2 for your QB.

Faith restoring in Dolfan base.

JS,

How about your faith being restored in ownership & management??? LMFAO!!!

Phil,

I find it laughable that so many fans & "experts" forget that Marino was an elite QB. As good if not better than any QB playing today. Yet even with all these great QB's I believe Alex Smith will wind up holding a Lombardi trophy. If the Niners stay relatively healthy NO ONE is beating them this year. Their defense is the best in football & I don't think it's close.

No team in the last 5 years has won a superbowl giving up more than 20.5 pts/game in the playoffs...

The key to understand the value of Trent Richardson for the brownies is his extreme versatility. He runs with the ball, he tricks defenders, he works as an additional receiver, he blocks pass rushers, etc. It's like having a bit of everything the Browns need in a single package.

the g men had 4.1 yds per carry on 28 attempts. and almost twice the possession time keeping brady off the field. they also had a pass rush capable of messing him up bad. Defense and a good running game(or a short passing game like the wc offense) can still win championships

The highest scoring offense in the playoffs has not won the superbowl in the last 5 years...

Phil,

Exactly. Personally I'd like to see a rule change favor the CB's so they can be more physical or at least have the refs call more pass interferences on the WR's.

The key to understand the value of Trent Richardson for the brownies is his extreme versatility. He runs with the ball, he tricks defenders, he works as an additional receiver, he blocks pass rushers, etc. It's like having a bit of everything the Browns need in a single package.

If he stays healthy (big IF especially for RB's) he's going to be a heck of an NFL player. I'd take Richardson over Tannehill any day of the week & I'd tell Reggie Bush to be ready on 3rd downs. As for Thomas??? I like what I saw from him when he was healthy but he's not Trent Richardson. Richardson will be a game changer for whoever drafts him.

Forget the #8 pick for now, even if its Tannehill, he wont play this year. Did they get Rocky Mcintosh, or Jake Scott? Or anyone else for that matter to improve ANY position?

i'd like to see more d coordinators have the stones to use the existing rules that say there can be no pass interference at the line of scrimmage, CB's should line up and hit/chuck the wr to knock him off his route.in these sophisticated passing schemes timing is everything & the chuck disrupts timing. of course if you miss you better have good safties.

We Have Draft Picks,

Except for us, we had Ricky and Ronnie and it didn't make a Hell of a lot of difference. AP makes next to no difference in Minny's W/L record and CJ the same with the Titans. UNTIL we get the QB position straightened out we're going nowhere. Sad but true....we have a chance to do that this year.

ronnie & ricky did not make a hell of a lot of difference because we had a horses buttocks for a hc who never heard of the flat where even joey harrington could make a throw to a beast/back that could turn that 5 tard dump off into a big gain

41phish and Canada Phil are correct. Good to see some smart people here today.

Defense, being able to have at least 28 runs per game at at least 4.2 average, and defense still win championships, same as it ever was.

Same as it was in 1984 and 1986 and 1992 and 1996 and 2006 and 2012 and every other year in between.

Football is a man's game.

I do agree, however, with the idea that rule changes favor passing. The victim of this, as we've seen, is RBs! Now everyone thinks that RBs are a dime a dozen.

What's funny is that with small rule changes the other way (making completing passes harder), all of a sudden Adrien Peterson and D. Thomas types become the stars again.

And of course pass rushers.

41phish,

And that's fine but until we get a QB that can light things up we're going nowhere. It's a coincidence that no success since 1984 and no QB since then either. The only years we made the playoffs we got good play out of Fiedler and Pennington. It wasn't good enough and it wasn't sustainable. Ricky led the league in rushing one season and how many playoff games did we win that year?....Answer...ZIP!

Hi all.....IMHO we will trade down and maximize picks

....too many holes to fill with the 4 picks we have in rounds 1 thru 3.....

...it will be Moore and Gerard this season, and we draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round this draft...

..trading down from the 8 spot should get us one more pick in the first 3 rounds to facilitate that...

..that's how I see it up to now....

im sorry you must have mistyped craig m. you must have meant no QB sice 2000 correct.

i do want a qb, no doubt. other wants though:
1)an offense that wasn't created at the dawn of man
2)use of the men you draft/sign for something other than keeping sun and rain off the bench.sparano wasted:wr's moore and wallace;clay thomas,and bush's patch catching skills;john jerry,nate garner,and ryan cook-all who would be better them colombo
3)3 olb/de's in the draft that can put the fear of God into tom brady like jason taylor used to do.

....if we trade down....counting the 8th pick in round 4....that would give us 6 picks in the first 104 slots...

...that's an average of a pick out of every 17 ..

...that's a pretty good ratio of picking at the top end of the talent pool..

Just to everyone here who say we won't develop anyone and stuff like that...HOW DO YOU KNOW?

This is a new Coaching staff. This is a WHOLE NEW PHILOSOPHY they are implementing. They are KNOWN already for developing their talent. People are acting like this is the same Miami team we've seen since Shula. What I'm here to tell you is it isn't. Things feel different to me. The whole FA period has been different. The WC offense is different. The 4-3 is different (from the last few years).

I know some want to hate for the sake of hating, and I'm fine with it. But I'm telling you there's no validity to your arguments. Now, you might say Philbin won't be as successful here (for a myriad of reasons), or Ireland won't get the talent they got in Green Bay, or we won't be successful until we get a Rodgers caliber QB. But just saying no one will be developed is a comment no one can make right now because no one really knows. It's all too new.

That's what I happen to be most interested in. Watching Philbin go to work developing the talent. In a year we'll know if he's on his way to being the new Shula in Miami or the same old Cam Cameron (type). I may be blind, but I betting against Cameron.

Ross should hire McShay to do the Dolphin draft.

i agree buster

if blackmon & richardson are gone the closest guy to a sure thing would be floyd, but the draft is deep at WR.i think you can get tannehill like talent with osweiler, cousins or weeden. we are rebuilding at leaast on offense so 6 picks in the first 104 sounds like a smart play if you feel the 4 2nd tier qb's are interchangable

CraigM,

I saw your little meaningless post top me. Franchise qb come far shy of guarranteeing sb's. Dude you dont even know the difference between a franchise qb and an elite qb. There's a HUGE difference.

Elite qb's are the one's who usually get to sb's. Franchise qb's are usually perrenial playoff fodder. FRranchise qb dont usually beat elite qb's.

I dont know about you loser. But after the past 15yrs of mediocre Miami football. Im not looking for a qb whose ceiling is to make us perrenial playoff fodder. But Im sure thats good enough for a loser like you. Isnt losing your primary forte?(for-tay)

Some fans are as excited about Philbin as they were about Cameron.

CraigM,

Also dunce brain, McShay says Tannehyill has the tools to be a franchise qb. He didnt say he was a franchise qb. Chad Henne has all the tools to be a franchise qb. But is he a franchise qb, mr. dunce cap? LOL

Its all meaningless until we get Ireland out of Miami.

BUSTER ...IT'S NOT HOW MANY PICKS WE GET ,BUT HOW GOOD THEY R .......


WE R LIVING IN THE CELLAR DUE TO THE SAME THINKING YOU DISPLAY IN YOU POST @ 1;37 PM.......

couldn't agree more DC

this does fell right.i think philbin has the right stuff.the last regime did not seem to be able to get improvement from the young guys like wallace,moore,jerry,jones,clay,gates(the list goes on). they also stuck with duds like colombo and misi way too long. i like it when my coach says "i dont know about lydon murtha @ rt we have a lot of evaluation to do" this lets lydon know he better work his ass off. unlike sparano telling us he's happy with the job colombo is doing.

One thing we can all be thankful for: we are not to be coached by career 321-losses loser Mustache Man III Jeff Fisher. We already had Wannstache and Stachano.

2 staches running dinosaur systems was sufficient, thank you.

YG........


AFTER EADING YOUR POST @ 1;45 PM ,NOW I KNOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN ELITE AND FRANCHISE QB ............

YG IS THE BRAIN FOR FOOTBALL IN THIS BLOG .........

Who cares about the crap Dolphins?

CRAIG M......

ELITE QB;\\TOM BRADY
ELI MANNING


FRANCHISE QB;;;;;


MATT RYAN
BREES
P.MANNING....THANKS YG/DB.

uhh mr panthers rock
good luck to them tonight but you came to a dolphin article to post so we're talking about um...the dolphins!

BUSTER ...IT'S NOT HOW MANY PICKS WE GET ,BUT HOW GOOD THEY R .......

Posted by: ALoco
-----------------------------------------------------
Exactly ALOCO...and generally speaking...the higher you can draft , the better talent taht is available...

....trading down MAXIMIZES the number of picks made in the early rounds...

That has nothing to do with any inability to make sound choices..we are hoping that coach Joe has an input, and that will carry the day...

...as opposed to Sporano's apparent nil effect ....

....but , hey , I still luv ya cuz....(despite your constant use of caps) ;-)

read this boys.

http://weblogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports/columnists/hyde/blog/2012/04/draft_winds_breaking_down_bran_1.html

BUSTER .......


AFTER FURTHER THINKING ,I A GREE WITH YOU.........

ALoco,

Exactly! Elite qb's win sb's. Franchise qb's get bounced from the playoffs.

Count the last 10 sb winners. Its safe to say at least 9 of those sb winners had elite staus qb's.

I count Drew Brees as elite. He's won a sb. It took and elite type effort for Alex Smith to bounce him from the sb this year. But proof Alex Smith isnt elite himself. Was Eli-te Manning!

So... the over/under on next season Dolphin wins in Vegas is 5 1/2. Guess they arent too impressed with Garrard or Philbin. Or losing Marshall. LOL

2 WATT...... TELL US THE NEWS INSTEAD OF MAKING US TYPE AND GO TO ANOTHER SITE..


Check out what Moore did in the last nine weeks of the regular season versus a rather prominent Super Bowl hero:

Matt Moore vs. Eli Manning
W-L Comp% Yards TD-Int Rating

Moore, Miami 6-3 .612 1,791 15-5 97.8

E. Manning, NY 4-5 .583 2,806 16-11 86.4


From a study done on the relation between Wonderlic scores and performance during a player's first 3 years in the NFL:

"We found in no cases was cognitive ability related to (football) performance. We did find a negative relationship for tight ends and defensive backs. For defensive backs, it was the most pronounced; basically, the lower you scored on the Wonderlic, the better you performed."

ELI MANNIG GOT TO BE ELITE TO WIN 2 SUPER BOWL .......HE'S DONE BETTER THAN HIS BROTHER WHO'S GOING TO BE INTERCEPTION MACHINE NEXT SEASON......

ALoco,

Marino was elite. With any symbolence of a running game and defence. Marino could have retired with at least 2 sb rings.

There's only so much even an elite qb can do if critical talent around him totally sucks. Marino could pass for 300-400yds when defenses were geared to shut down the only weapon we had. Which was our passing game.

JONTHAN.......


MOORE WON UNIPORTANT GAMES,BE REAL.AFTER 0-7 HE FACED LOUSY TEAMS WITH PLAYERS NOT PLAYING SO THEY DON'T GET INJURED.........

THE
CELLAR !

Tannehill or wait until the 6th. I don't want any of the 2nd or 3rd round QB's. They'll probably all be busts (or at least the one we pick), and then we won't take a stud in next season's draft. Just ride the season with Moore, and if we completely suck we can get Barkley or Jones or one of the other two 1st round guys.

Don't get me wrong you need a QB to win a superbowl, you need a running game & you need a great defense... & I am sure you could win a superbowl with offense & no defense, but the superbowl is usually won by who ever is playing the best defense in the playoffs, not by the team that puts up the most points... doesn't make sense does it... you would think if you averaged more points a game than any other team you would win, but hasn't happened in 5 years... Think about that?

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