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Is Vontae Davis on the trade block?

The NFL is aflutter tonight because the Indianapolis Colts are working on a big trade and, of course, no one really knows the specifics but fans across the league are speculating it involves their team.

Miami fans being no different, there is much speculation the Dolphins might be involved. And that speculation further includes the idea that Vontae Davis is the player the Dolphins have on the trade block.

Before we go that far afield let me share the facts:

Indy owner Jim Irsay tweeted Thursday, "SERIOUS TRADE WINDS Swirling! We're talking given (sic) up a high pick for SERIOUS Vet/Starter! ...these deals often crumble n don't reach completion"

Then the Colts' colorful owner added, "Colts fans.. Your GM Mr. Grigson isn't afraid to roll the dice n aggressively improve OUR Indiananpolis Colts n my check book stands ready."

Well, the Colts are in serious need of offensive line help. They are also known to be needing cornerback help. So Dallas cornerback Michael Jenkins comes to mind. Except the Cowboys, through sources, are denying Jenkins is going to be dealt.

And Davis comes to mind because he lost his starting job to Richard Marshall this training camp when he came to camp overweight and out of shape. Davis is back in shape now, but he has still not been able to regain his starting job. And, if you have any memory, you know Davis has a history for being suspended -- having suffered that fate once last year when he showed up late and hung over to a practice after a night of drinking and also in 2010 when he was similarly kept out of the starting lineup but got into the game in the second quarter for breaking a team rule.

Aside from that, it must be said, Davis is not a star. He's a roller coaster -- sometimes very good, sometimes bad. He averages three interceptions and 10 passes defensed per season.

None of this means Davis is about to be dealt. That must be said. But I have an uneasy  feeling about this. Call it instinct.

I did try to reach out to sources to either confirm or deny that Davis is on the block. No one returned a text. Not a one. This, by the way, is rare. The only time this happened in the past 12 months is when I asked if Chad Johnson would be released. Obviously, no one wanted to say anything until the player was actually cut. Afterward, I got confirmation texts on the topic.

All I'm saying is I'm getting the silent treatment on this topic and that raises flags for me.

[Update: At 1:56 AM I got a text message back from a team source. The source was aware of what is being said about Davis and called it, "rumors." So that suggests this is not serious.]

Having said all this, I believe we'll get a very, very clear message on whether Davis is indeed on the block Friday evening when the Dolphins play the Falcons. If Davis does not play you can just about bet the Dolphins are trying to deal the former first-round draft pick.

So would I be surprised if Davis is traded? At the risk of sounding naive, yes I would. He's only 24 years old. He's a kid. There is reason to be optimistic he might mature in the next couple of years and become the player his gifts suggest he could be.

He is also cheap. Davis is signed through 2013 and because he's still on his rookie contract, he'll be making only $957,500 this season and $1,136,250 next year. That is a bargain for a starting cornerback. That is a bargain for a No. 3 cornerback.

And ...

Even if Davis is a failure as a starter, the value of a No. 3 cornerback in the NFL is huge. That player is on the field anywhere 50 to 65 percent of the time in today's pass-happy league. I would suppose the Dolphins would be more comfortable with Davis in the game than Nolan Carroll, who is a nice player, but hardly a lockdown cornerback with the same potential as Davis.

The only way this is a great idea from a purely football standpoint -- off-field and drinking issues notwithstanding -- is if the Dolphins get a first-round pick in return for Davis. That's what they paid for him. A second rounder? Yes, the Colts may not be a very good team and might again draft quite high next year.

But it's simply bad form to continue giving up players that cost high picks in exchange for lower picks. That's what the Dolphins did in trading Brandon Marshall for two third-round picks after giving up two second-round picks for him.

So getting a second or third-round pick for Davis after drafting him in the first round would feel wrong. There is, of course, a caveat to that. What if the Dolphins could get a second-round pick and tight end Coby Fleener or perhaps a wide reciever.

Vontae Davis for a second-rounder and T.Y. Hilton?

I might do that.

 

Comments

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We need cornerbacks...and what if Marshall goes down? what then?

Keep Vontae....coach him up to his potential.

...now focus on the RG position so we can keep our new QB healthy!

yea, I have a tough time with the QB makes the receivers.

Jerry Rice would have still been Jerry Rice.

Moss would have been better without Culpepper

Megatron, enough said.

there are more. Great QB's make average receivers look better. GREAT WR's can make an average QB look better.

A great running game due to play action can make all of the above look better.

Dolphins should trade for Mike Wallace from Pittsburgh, they need DB help, trade for Davis and throw in a conditional draft pick.

Isn't it obvious now that cj was never serious about making this Team and only joined them for some other purpose? It kinda backfired on him.

Yes. Ideally, a great QB with great receivers(Marino-Jerry Rice)should do best.

poizen.....all true, but your best line is "great QBs make average receivers look better".....cant have this conversation when you're bringing up some of the best WRs of all time (Rice.....he's an exception.....Moss and C Johnson are extremely talented too)--we're talking guys like Welker, V Cruz, Garcon, D Branch, Colston, etc--those WRs, which are more similar to most others, have been helped immensely by playing with great QBs.

BPA,

I actually have been a huge defender of Ireland in that it is well known Parcells would do a draft and the Ireland, Parcells, then Ireland. You can't build a team this way. You have to be able to build off last years draft for your plans to come to fruition. Ireland drafted Pouncey and then Tannehill so his first round decisions look like both will be franchise building blocks. My biggest problem is he didn't do anything to fix the most glaring need on this team at WR.

Miami was in need of at least 2 new WRs with Brandon Marshall on the team. They trade him and then do nothing to address the position on draft day. The only thing Mel Kiper could say on Egnew was "Miami needed a TE to stretch the seam" and then added nothing else. That right there told me he was a huge reach. He trades up for Lamar Miller but also traded up the previous year for Daniel Thomas. Where the helll is his logic with them moves?

Watch this play out. Jeff Ireland will swing a trade that will leave us marveling at his brilliance. Before he is done, Indy will probably be begging him to take Luck off their hands in exchange for Vontae.

Not sure how I feel about the Vontae speculation. First off people, c'mon, this is a BLOG for fyuck's sake, if you can't discuss speculation and rumor and heresay here, then WHERE exactly should you do it? This is the PERFECT place to talk about this stuff.

On the one hand, I think Vontae could still be special (I'm sounding like those guys who backed Henne). He has the gifts, the talent and the bloodline to be a star in this league. What I'm not sure of is if he has the heart, will or determination to do it. And therein lies the rub.

As he was a 1st-rd pick, this would be another dagger in Ireland's heart (the more we lose players he drafted, the more we see his talent acquisition hasn't been reliable). But, I agree with Mando, we can't keep drafting guys high, then trading them low. Also, this opens ANOTHER hole that the team needs to fill (and since they already have so many, you need to start actually, you know, FILLING these holes quicker than new ones are forming.

But, if Vontae were to be traded, this would be the time. He still hasn't diminished so much that he's not valuable. And he's still young. If they wait another year or 2, who knows where he'll be then. And also, I don't see Vontae as one of Philbin's "guys." And I'm starting to see he's like Parcells in that respect. If you're one of his "guys," he'll run through walls for you, if not, you're expendable. So if Philbin has no confidence in Vontae, then they SHOULD trade him, getting good value for him, and let Philbin bring in the players he wants to run his system.

andy--not saying Ireland has done a great job, he hasn't.....just saying that much of this roster was put together by Parcells, thats all--Egnew was rated as the 3rd or 4th best TE and generally projected to go in Rd 3 or 4 (fact.....you don't have to agree) and Miller was projected to go before Rd 4 in general too.....agree that he should've added a WR fairly early, and the Egnew pick looks to be the one where he should've--I just wouldn't write Egnew off yet, thats all (and we'd know much less about Egnew and his struggles if it weren't for Hard Knocks).

Trade talk,

I think Miami fans are hoping for a trade because we realize our WRs are a joke compared to the rest of the league. I don't think Miami is the team in trade talks. Matter fact I know the trade talks aren't Miami.

Trading Davis would be a huge mistake. Yes, he came in out of shape. He will be fine in the end. He is still a good cover corner and can tackle.

I gaurantee Smith shows he remains soft and can't tackle. Watch by the end of game 3 Smith is on the bench serving as Davis' backup.

would Duper or Clayton have been great WRs if not for Marino?--obviously not.....Marino made them, not the other way around.....average or better WRs that a great QB made look a lot better. But please don't include all-time great WRs when discussing this....they are exceptions.

Agreed DC, However, If Vonte has not sperated from Sean Smith or Rishard even to this date, We can assume, maybe the "special" conversation may be over.

It all depends on what we get for a trade, Mando mentions 1st round pick, and others have said Wallace. If anyone is that stupid to trade any of those for Vonte, I think you need to bite on it. I just don't see anyone offering that much.

I think this Indy thing is swirling around MJD, honestly. Indy hates Donald Brown for some reason, so a 1st pick with Donald Brown for MJD might be on the table.

BPA, you can say the same the other way, and the QB's are the exceptons. I can start naming more WR's, but it is a null point. My point is great's in many positions make oters around them better.

Poizen, yeah, I'm thinking he's not on the trade market either (but it's fun to speculate). Crazy to think Sean Smith could actually be better come mid-Season then Vontae (what a fall).

But, for those who hate Ross, think he's done nothing right, here's another Owner that seems to have sh*t for brains. Why say ANYTHING about trades? Just let the GM handle his business, and stop bringing media attention to the situation. If that were Ross, people would be picketing in Miami right now. Just goes to show, like Craig M said yesterday, "grass is greener.."

agree with poizen.....would be shocked if indy would give up a 1st rd pick for vontae.....aint happening.....and like it or not, we'd have a big hole at CB if we traded him, from a depth standpoint if nothing else.

"....At the risk of sounding naive, yes I would. He's only 24 years old. He's a kid. There is reason to be optimistic he might mature in the next couple of years and become the player his gifts suggest he could be."

Mando,

Yes you are naive. This is Vontae's 4th season & as a pro he just doesn't get it. It should come as no surprise to anyone why Vontae slipped on draft day.

It actually makes me think of another player who had a very high ceiling as a player but slipped on draft day that Parcells/Ireland drafted & his name was Phillip Merling.

Time to face the facts--this team is once again in a total rebuild mode. Usually when this happens a team hires a new GM, new personnel evaluators, & new college scouts but no we're sticking with the same GM that has already failed to improve this franchise than when he took the job over 4 years ago. Now that makes sense right????

There a TON of fans who believed that once we found a starting QB that everything would just magically fall into place. Those fans--like yourself--are very naive. While it's too early to vote Tannehill into the Hall of the Fame I believe he is going to be better than Beck, Henne, & Pat White combined. However, the guy needs help like a big time WR & TE. Watching Jake Locker last night I believe Tannehill is a better QB prospect but Locker has a much better supporting cast around.

Mando check Ireland/Parcells history with 2nd round picks...Now again, would you do that trade?

BPA,

I had no problem with the first two picks of the draft in Tannehill and Martin. A franchise QB was needed and I think Tannehill has exceeded expectations to this point. He doesn't look lost, He has command of the huddle, audible and I just have a good feeling about him. Jonathan Martin has struggled some but he's a rookie and I liked the pick from the standpoint he continued to build off last years first rounder with Pouncey and this could pay off as having a great duo of bookends and also a young core with Pouncey and even Long who's still young. After that he lost me.

Egnew who even if he was a the 4th best TE in the drafted over Mohamed Sanu, TY Hilton and Chris Givens? Value was still there in round 3. A 4th best TE in round 3 has little value unless it's a strong class which this class wasn't. Granted who would've thought Jimmy Graham would become some unstoppable force but again WRs who had production in college were there.

Round 4 going Lamar Miller who I think probably was a steal at that point but he just traded up the previous draft for a RB in round 2. So has he given up on D. Thomas already? Again RB wasn't the need that WR was and again value was still there in both Arkansas guys, Nick Toon and Keshawn Martin.

Bashing Ireland seemed easy in years past but I gave him a pass but yes with Hard Knocks and watching the game with my own 2 eyes and Miami's WRs are not good and could possibly hurt Tannehill's growth in year 1 or worse regress his confidence.

DC,

Right on! If Ross did that the NFL network, ESPN etc would be hammering him. Irsay gets a pass just like the rest of his life. His daddy built ships, left him a gazillion $. He bought a team and got Peyton Manning. What else is there to say.

If Vontae is traded, Ireland is really the worst GM in the history of football. This is football not all of your players are going to be chior boys. First BM, then CJ (Kind of deserve it), now Vontae. Guess what great football players arent chior boys and unless you want a bunch of Brian Hartlines(chior boy) on your team then you better stop getting rid of the talented players. Follow me @DHeatMann

Many People focused on Blackmon and forgot about the very quick and precise route runner Kendall Wright, RG3's main target.

oscar, Kendall Wright looked great last night, him and Blackmon will be stars in the league. Follow me

andy.....like i said, and i agree with you, that egnew pick seems to be where they should've grabbed a WR, whoever it was......but i also think its way too early to write off egnew, or to view those WRs as "great picks"--I don't think taking Miller had anything to do with D Thomas.....Bush's contract is up after his year so Miller can step in to that role, and I simply think they thought Miller offered good value there, which most agreed with......plus he definitely has playmaking ability--dont think it was a commentary on Thomas.

BPA,

I like Miller so it was nothing against him but you don't need Miller now so that pick could've waited and should've. I just hope this doesn't hurt Tannehill with a lack of players around him. He can only do so much but when 3rd down comes around and a guy drops a ball or runs the wrong route and they are going 3 and out or worse an interception, it's counter prodcutive to not place Tannehill in a much better situation.

Jake Locker is not the greatest passer in the world but you have to use containment on him otherwise he'll run 20-30 yds on you with ease. Heck of an athlete.

Vontae is the Only Fin to get INTs. INTs win games.

Jung Li, SS has shown some balls skills as of late

DHeat......SS better show those ball skills during games, when it counts....nice to see him do it in practice but I'm tired of seeing him drop numerous balls/INTs during games--and the dude doesn't like to tackle......he needs to step up.

No way they are trading Vontae unless it's for someone equally as young and promising on offense.

BPA, I agree he does play soft at times, but he seems to have matured and step up to the challenge unlike Vontae whos being a knucklehead.

Mark, would you really be surprised if Vontae traded? You do remember Ireland is the GM

Dheat.....true and its good to see.....reality is that we need him, badly, to play well and become a good/consistent CB, especially with so many questions now about VD

Typical Salguero's speculations, wild guesses, and gossip; poor facts.
As usual, Davis was a wrong 1st rnd draft pick. The front office has no talent for spotting talent. Nothing new under the Sun. And even when there is talent around they find ways for trading it. This team is a mess, simply a mess. Ireland is a cancer, a virus, that should be extirpated. But Ross is another desease and both are like symbiotic. No hope for us fans.

Andy, can't hate on the Miller pick in round 4. Any time you get an incredible value - whether it's a need or not - you have to take it. 4th round picks are a huge gamble anyway. MIght as well gamble on someone who has some skills that had many people rating him as a borderline first round pick at some point last year. As far as WR goes, not sure how much better those 4th round receivers are than the guys we have now- i mean speaking in the vacuum that is 2012 anyway.

I'm of the mind that if the area is a true need and it's a vital position (WR is in my opinion) then fix it with a 1st or 2nd round pick or in a significant trade or free agency. Don't try to fix it with late round picks (anything after the 2nd is late round to me). In fact, I'd trade any pick afte ra 2nd if it gets me a considerable starter without blinking.

DHM, good point considering they turned a 1st round pick (Ginn) into a worthless 5th. Say what you want about Ginn and it turned out that he wasn;t worthy of being a first still he made significant game changing plays in at least three wins in his time here. Anyone else on the roster do that? He was extremely valuable in a support WR role and as a A1 return man. Stupid trade and also the fans bear a bunch of the brunt of that with their stupid postings and booing of the player.

Another stupid trade was the marshall trade. Say what you want about him being a fit here or not - getting two thirds is a pittance for a player you invested two seconds and a huge contract into. You simply can't make that trade. As much as I hated Marshall - you just can't take that kind of bath on a move. In hindsight it was stupid to get him in the first place. You simply can't afford to make that kind of investment in a psychopath. Franchise killing move as we are seeing right now.

If we lose 24-year-old Vontae Davis in a scenario outlined by Mando, then I will tell you right now that Philbin is officially a TOTAL FAILURE of Cam Cameron proportions. In fact, I will guarantee it. An untter failure.

This is football. It's not a tickling competition. These fellas are out to *hurt* each other.

Philbin would make a good librarian.

Mark is 100% dead on balls accurate about Ginn and Marshall.

Thank you. Absolutely correct, including the part about the fans' ruining of Ginn's chances here, which really was the incompetent team's fault for being bullied by ignorant 6 pack drinking beer gutted pieces of garbage fans.

God I'm pissed right now.

Tim... I have no clue what that means? Is vonte a franchise player or something? If we got Wallace, or a 1st round pick for Vonte... which will not happen.

Philbin would be a GOD! I am confused about what you mean. Vonte can't even head and shoulders beat out Sean Smith...

while its disappointing and a little surprising to see where VD is right now, most folks here and fans in general liked Davis a lot in yrs 1&2, and for most of last year too after he got his act together......his personality and immaturity are the 2 biggest issues, and not small issues, but don't act like we all thought that was a bad pick at the time--his brother Vernon was also undisciplined and sort of a loose cannon early on.....but matured into a very good player.

Heatman I agree. SS had a great INT last game (stolen by refs). I think Smith might step up this year, but we also need Vontae.

Vontae has a legit chance at a breakout 7 INT year.

Philbin is an utter DISASTER if we lose VD after also losing Marshall.

I'm not counting Chad Johnson, who was done. Didn't need him here to begin with.

And, again, I told you all in March that we would have brought in Randy MOss.

Mark Toronto,

Good point but I just felt like this was a deep draft at WR. I guess you're right on with Lamar Miller too. Round 4 is no guarantee so I can't complain about the pick and in hindsight if Egnew was legit I wouldn't be complaining either. I remember on draft day wanting Mohamed Sanu in round 3. He was the steal of the 3rd round IMO and we got Miller the steal of round 4.

I was glad to see Vontae Davis stand up to steve Smith. Vontae had Smith locked down; which is why smith wanted to fight. David has lock down ability at times. Remember, he did a good job with Randy Moss.

I have to do something constructive for the rest of the day, so I'll see you tonight.

Tim Couch, I too wanted Randy Moss, obviousley he's not the same player but guess what he'll instantley be better than any WR on the roster right now. Its not like geting Hartline back will drastically improve this sorry WR core.

While I'm gone, I want no queers, lesbians or as-holes here.

Vontae will be fine, very talented player and still young......but we all have to live with his tendencies, immaturity and inconsistencies......thats the reality--live with those, and be frustrated with him at times, or not.....but no one denies the guy can play.

HOHO!

Vontae Davis = huge dissapointment

Poizen, I could be wrong, but my theory on why Vontae has not beat out Smith (or the guy on the other side) is that Librarian Coach simply doesn't like him. Librarian Coach is more concerned with what color pens people use and whether they don't have an arrest record (as most black NFL players do). We've seen that approach and it doesn't work. It's not a tickling competition. So far Philbin is exactly like Cameron.

We've seen it in other sports too. To win, you have to have the athletes. These athletes usually have several arrests for such things as hitting their wives or girlfriends. This is simply a fact.

Philbin is not letting VD play because Philbin doesn't like "thuggish" guys.

So Kevin Coyle running out of approaches for this defense, he said he tried to inspiration humiliation and threats, but nothing seems to work he stated, last year we never heard that from coach Nolan, is this a indicator of the defense not buying into Coyle defense philosophy? Any feed back on that, anyone. It's in the sun-sentinel that's write.

while our WR group would still need upgrading, if Chad Johnson was still on the team then a lot of this hand-wringing wouldn't be going on.....while he was not a long term solution, he clearly provided a talent upgrade for this year at least--while he was also a loose cannon, and he's had some ups and downs, he's never done something as nutty as what he did to his wife......no one could've predicted that--sucks, and I agreed with letting him go, but thats the reality.....if he's still here, as we expected, the group looks a little better at least.

I haven't checked the blog either preseason game. Has there been any links up for the games? I have zip zero going on tonight with both kids home so I need my Dolphins for sanity.

Do our high picks not turn into stars because they are bad picks or because of below average talent/coaching around them?

Trade rumors aren't about Vontae, they r about MJD from Jags!! Imagine what a running back like that does to a rookie QB! Surprised Mando never sniffed it out.....

VD is another example of how poor drafting by Ireland has totally destroyed a once proud franchise. In the the 2009 draft, Jeffy selected VD with the 25th pick and GB selected Clay Matthews with the 26th pick. Want that one back, Jeff?

Tim, I get where your coming from. I am not in the locker room either, only can judge what I see. I do not have the same impression of Philbin as you do. Is he OCD about minute things year, I guess. But his coaching and discusions with players seems to be very good. That is just my opinion. He sits with all of his players has an open door policy and backs up his beliefs.

Cameron... He was weak, sounded weak, did not make a strong move or decision his whole time here. I do not see to many similarities between Cameron and Philbin at all. I am just one different opinion. So I can not discount how you feel. I hope you are wrong though. :)

andy.....nfl.com for the game, but it costs a little bit.....not a lot.

Its crystal clear. Ireland is totally incompetent.

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