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Dolphins move on Albert should depend on details

Sometimes the devil is in the details and that's where the Dolphins are with Branden Albert.

As multiple media sources reported Wednesday, and as I reported on this blog on March 22, the Dolphins are considering making a trade for the Kansas City Chiefs franchise player.

[Update: John Clayton of ESPN is reporting the Dolphins have been given permission to speak with Albert and he'll visit the Dolphins and take a physical soon. Barry Jackson of The Miami Herald is reporting the sides are talking contract.]

On its face, the idea makes sense.

The Dolphins lost left tackle Jake Long to St. Louis in free agency. The club has a need and coach Joe Philbin didn't exactly endorse the idea of Jonathan Martin as his starting left tackle when he discussed the issue last month. The Dolphins also had a price point for Long and they have not used the cap space that was intended for Long on anyone else.

So the team can afford to sign Branden Albert and believes Albert to be a left tackle upgrade over Martin.

But ...

The devil is in the details.

The only way this trade makes sense is if the Dolphins do it in conjunction with another trade and only after Texas A&M left tackle Luke Joeckel comes off the board on draft day. That's right, this trade only makes sense if Joeckel isn't available because if he is on draft day, the Dolphins look like fools.

Consider:

If Joeckel goes No. 1 overall to Kansas City, then the Dolphins can be certain the best LT in the draft is gone and they move on. But if KC picks Eric Fisher and Joekel drops to No. 3 or No. 4, the Dolphins must, must, must try to trade up to get him. That move would be expensive in that it would require a second-round pick and other considerations. But it makes more sense than the Albert trade because that also will require a second-round pick plus a more expensive contract than Joeckel.

And Joeckel, unproven in the NFL as he is, is probably going to be a better player than Albert.

So the Dolphins would be going for a better player (Joeckel) using basically the same draft pick compensation (well, maybe more expensive but only slightly) and pay a lower contract in the transaction.

So if the Dolphins don't wait for draft day to make this Albert trade, they're not really thinking through all the contingencies. And if Joeckel then falls, the Dolphins will look downright foolish.

Then there is this:

Even if Joeckel goes No. 1 overall as expected, the Dolphins can simply trade a No. 2 for Albert, but they would still look kind of silly. You see, why pay a high draft pick and a big contract to Branden Albert when you could have had Jake Long for the big contract and kept the pick?

You mean to say the Dolphins played hardball with Long only to cave on Albert?

I understand Long is seemingly diminished and often injured. Trust me, I made the point here many times. But Albert comes with no guarantees, either. He basically had a very good season in 2012. But it was only good enough for the Chiefs to want to trade him. He's been injured during his career. He's struggled with weight issues. He was a turnstile in 2009, giving up nine sacks.

And, again, the Chiefs are willing to let him go so they can draft a rookie to play the same position.

So it's not like Branden Albert is a slam dunk worth-it move.

This is where the devil has to be in the details.

If the Dolphins pay Albert as much as Long got in St. Louis, they look dumb. If the Dolphins get Albert for much cheaper, they still have a find a way to recover that second-round pick they still gave up for him.

And how do they do that?

Well, here is my perfect scenario that would prevent me from thinking the Dolphins got ripped off on getting Branden Albert. If the Dolphins trade away their lower of two second-round picks for Albert and then trade down from No. 12 overall to a lower pick in the first round while then pickinng up a second-rounder for the move, I'll be straight. I'll be good.

The haul would then be a lower first, Albert (albeit at a big contract) and two second rounders for all those moves.

The trade down would mitigate the sting of giving up a second for Albert because it recovers a second-rounder for the trade down.

By the way, if the Dolphins somehow end up giving Albert more money than Long got from St. Louis, something is significantly amiss because even with his multiple injury issues, Long was still a better player than Albert when healthy.

All this has to play out.

The devil will be in the details.

 

needs to be part of another draft-day trade down

Comments

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Right-O Andy. And nobody has been more suspect of martin than me here. I think he's adequate at RT because he goes agains the other teams other pass ruser or he gets help from the TE - but he's jsut not man enough to play LT. Even against the Jags and Bills - where he wasn't getting sacks, he was getting pushed back into the QB on every play. It was the best you could hope for on each play was a draw.

My 2 cents....

If we pay Albert anywhere near what Long is making.....then we could have just paid Long...and kept the draft pick....

The ONE option Armando didn't talk about is a straight up trade....I have seen some talk about that on here....

Do you really want to send your "franchise" guy in Starks for a potential 2nd tier LT....

I woudn't....

are we still holding the bag on Dansby and that other scrub....why not them...as a package...

Kris, you see Starks as of a greater value than a 2nd pick? I don't. I send Starks for Albert in a second ... then again, i didn't want to tag Starks either.

With Larry Little Calling Our Picks On Day 2. Wouldn't It Be Nice If We Draft 2 Linemen. Larry Can Act As A Good Luck Charm.

Resigning Jake should've Been The #1 Priority. But The Fans Were To Busy Being Selfish Crying We have Paid Jake To Much Money. Well We Should've Paid Him More Money.

The Only Thing I See Ireland Doing Is Trading Up For L. Jockel. Ireland Isn't interested In B. Albert. Doesn't Fit Irelands Style. Overpay and Give Up Draft Picks. That Is Not Building Through The Draft.

Remember Ireland Said He Has Enough Ammo For The #1 Pick. I Would Rather See Him Trade For The #1 Pick. Than For Fat Albert.

Andy,

I agree there, if it's your guy take him at 12, or where ever. I have no ideals about picking a OG or C number #1 even. If they are the guy you want then get him and don't look back.

And if we were picking BPA which Ireland says he does a horizontal draft to marry a need with the pick. So I would say if Warmack is there, he could be the pick. And I would have no issues with that. My preference is just TD's and Turnovers.

Mark....

Its not so much what I see....as I am reading and trying to interpret how Ireland see's him...

Allow me to respond to some comments on here:

Mitch: I clearly said trading up would be more expensive than making the trade for Albert. Skip over that?

Ricardo Aguilar: I have said that you draft core positions in the top 10-12 spots. Core positions are WR, QB, CB, pass rusher and LT. While RT, G, C are not core positions, you obviously misunderstood that LT is a core position.

Pete: The reason I said the Dolphins would be interested in trading up for Joeckel but didn't say so for Fisher is because I know they'd seriously considr doing it for Joeckel but don't know if they'd do it for Fisher.

To whoever said Albert has had no weight issues: Wrong. He had to lose 40 pounds in 2009.

Everyone: PFF is NOT the Bible. Just because they say it doesn't mean it is so. The fact of the matter is whatever you think of Albert, the Chiefs want to GET RID OF HIM. That's a fact. That doesn't suggest they think he's great and should be a keeper.

Glad jake is gone. Watch bradford get killed who unlike tanny cant take a hit. As far as Albert goes , look who he has been protecting at qb the last few years. Guys who hang onto th ball wayyyyyy too long. Nobody can pass protect forever.
And who doesnt want to get paid? Like if a company offered anyone here multi millions , they would say no?

in 2009 armando my wife was skinny also. its 2013 man. hes been solid for years

Martin was a rookie that switched from his natural position LT to the right side then asked at the end of that season to play LT with no prep time... Kinda a messed up situation if you ask me. Give Martin the job now and let him prepare as the starting LT and move forward. Incogs is solid next to him n I guarantee J Martin will look a lot better with an offseason under his belt back at his natural position.

and kc wants to get rid of him not cause he isnt a great player but because he doesnt want to be here and they are in a pickle having first pick and nobody being there other than 2 lt's. if they keep albert they draft fisher and play him at rt. kc radio blowing up right now with teisher on with my boy petro. kc fans mostly mad about this deal going down

This team has way over paid and wasted draft picks on too many OL and what do they have to show for it. They have probably had the highest paid line the last 3-4 years. 2 #1, #2, #3 plus Incognito ( DOnt know where he was dratfed. And They had a mediocre running game, poor passing game and lost 9!

#2, 3 or 4 they can find lineman and ones that dont make 10M a year. Winston wanted 4m. He was great in Houston where I live.

Armando....

good response...but your last paragraph "the Chiefs want to get rid of him...that doesn't suggest they think he is great and should be a keeper".....

That is among the worst logic I can think of to use when deciding players worth and/or value....

Last I checked....the Chiefs are NOT the poster boys for how to win in the NFL....take away ONE FLUKE season a few years back....and they are equally as inept as we are/were.....

Also....

SOmetimes price is the determining factor in these things.....its not that a team doesn't like this guy or that guy....its that they know that won't be able to AFFORD this guy or that guy....so dumping him and getting something for him is great forethout...and planning for the future....

reland has RARELY done such things...so I understand why many of us FIN FANS can't fully grasp that concept....We are used to CUTTING a player and getting nothing in return....or letting a contract EXPIRE...and getting nothing in return....

Much rather have Winston or Clabo

You'd better believe that NE is going to add another pass rushing beast in addition to Chandler Jones, mostly designed for RT. So, the more and the better O linemen we have, the better.

Armando:

2009? Really? Are you going to bring up 4 years ago?

Well within that same 4 years period Joeckel was a senior in high school. While Albert was playing in the NFL.

agree with Dusty....Chiefs looking to trade Albert doesn't mean they don't think highly of him. If that was the case why did they lock him in to the RFA deal?

I think the Chiefs know that they will be killed for not taking Joekel or Fisher with the number one pick. I think the Chiefs know that nobody is giving them calls offering fair value for their number one pick. So, they are stuck with the #1 pick in a relatively weak draft where the BPA is a toss up of two LT's. Are they going to use the #1 overall pick on a RT? No....they need to move Albert, take their LT of choice and try to get another player in round 2 to fill another position of need.

Ok, trading up for an unknown, face it neither Joeckel or Fisher have played a down in the NFL , which would require 3 picks or trading a 2nd for a guy in his prime who is a proven LT in the league?? If the Fins don't think Martin can play LT, then options are limited. I take Albert and then see who falls to 12 or try to trade down to recoup that 2nd.

For all we know he could become one of the best or another Robert Gallery.

Kris, yeah, I get the same feeling with Ireland. I think KC would accept that trade off but trying to pry a DT from Ireland seems to be a tough chore indeed.

personally, I see it is a perfect swap. Similar talents, similar age ... but then again, I'm just a desk jockey and not an NFL GM.

Add in Albert has told the Chiefs he won't to RT, he is a headache for the Chiefs. That doesn't mean he isn't good

Armando,

PFF isn't the Bible correct. I brought it up and said it wasn't set in stone but gives us an idea as how well or poorly a player is playing.

The Chiefs obviously aren't willing to just GET RID of Albert. They franchised him and know that he's good enough to franchise and be on the roster but with a new a coaching staff maybe he's just not a fit.

You are quite defensive today and know this just like PFF isn't the Bible neither is the BS you put out there either.

KC is picking first - they have 3 options to replace Albert - Miami does not have that luxury. They would have to use multiple picks to trade up or 1 pick for Albert. I like 1 pick for Albert.

If Miami were picking first this would be a no-brainer and Albert wouldn't be in this conversation. But the fact that we'd have to give up way to much to move up is why trading for Albert makes sense.

how is trading up for joeckal about the same in compensation??
for albert you give up a second and still have a #1. with joeckel you give up a #1 a #2 and more!!!

See what you did Mando, riling everyone here up. When's the schedule coming out? That will settle everything down for a bit.

Kris, you make logical points but think of this:

The Chiefs inept history has no bearing on this subject. The coach is new, the GM is new, the staff is new. So they had no connection to past problems nor did they cost those problems.

Secondly, NFL teams rarely let outstanding players go elsewhere. There's always a reason. Santonio Holmes was traded for a reason. Randy Moss was traded for a reason. And while those players may have a year or so of solid production, the underlying reason they got traded inevitably resurfaces.

So ask yourself again why the Chiefs are so eager to get rid of this player. What's the reason? Well, they think they can be better without him. They think drafting a LT will be better (also cheaper) than keeping this one.

One thing I forgot to mention in the post is Albert had back issues last year. He missed five starts and three games altogether.

As to his weight that I mentioned in 2009, he's fluctuated. No it hasn't been 40 pounds since then. But he's been up and had to get down.

Are you kidding me Armando??? you can't move up from #12 to #3 in the draft for just a 2nd-round pick. is this your first day covering the draft??? Puhleeeze!

IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY YOUR TITLE WAS SPORTS WRITER. YOUR PRIDE AND ARROGANCE HAS CHANGED THAT TO SPORTS CRITIC. YOU'RE ALWAYS SECOND GUESSING THE DOLPHINS ON EVERY MOVE. WHO LOOSES? THE FAN. NO WONDER JEFF IRELAND IS SO DEFENSIVE ABOUT HAVING TO DEAL WITH YOU. AND THEY EVEN NEED A GUY TO LIMIT THE NUMBER OF QUESTIONS ASKED. Albert is ranked 25th by Pro football Focus 1 sack, 4 hits and 12 hurries, Joeckel is coming up to face faster stronger players so he's no guarantee. Long is ranked 46th with 4-7-10, Gardner 45th with 2-0-11 in his short minutes and Jonathan Martin 76th with 6-4-47 ALL STATISTICS YOU CONVENIENTLY LEFT OUT TO MAKE YOUR POINT. THE PROBLEM WITH YOU IS NOT YOU BUT THAT YOUR BOSSES AT THE HERALD ARE MORE INCOMPETENT THAN YOU, OTHERWISE THEY WOULDN'T PAY YOU.

armando harvin,bush, list goes on forever players traded that are good. cheaper maybe, better well good luck with that

Add to that his age. How many LTs get paid after 30? Aren't this guy's best days behind him? Let's move on, no more FAs until after the Draft.

I meant to say how many LTs have their best years after 30.

hes 28 3 year deal would be great with this guy

Andy, I'm not being defensive even when you call my work BS. Having said that, if you think it's BS feel free to leave.

So, the Dolphins waste a 2nd round pick on Albert, who wants a deal better than Long's and was ranked as the 25th best tackle in the league, but pass on Winston, who was ranked 26th, would come a lot cheaper, and turns 29 this year? Yeah...that makes a lot of sense...

tracy winston is awful and a rt. albert is very good and a lt. wake up man

Armando, thats the problem with this team. Everything depends on the details. They never just go get the player they want.

Mando,

BS more a figure of speech as in BS back and forth. No disrespect intended. I appreciate your work and the blog.

Use that 2nd rd pick on an OT simple solution

Hey Carlos, why don't you learn to hit the unlcock caps button before you engage in your buffoonary?

In case you haven't heard, Jeff Ireland sucks so that's the reason he's second-guessed on everything. The fact Mando presents what might happen and how it would make more sense is a good thing, not a bad thing.

Maybe you see a decade of stinking and four consecutive years of losing as a great thing, but I see it as a reason to questions everything. If that bothers you, take your bunched up panties and go eat rhinocerous butt.

SIGN WINSTON!

Sorry I misunderstood Andy. My bad.

Um, Scourt ... WOW!!!

Here is something I have been thinking about for some time now. Tell me which line up you would prefer. There are countless options obviously but focus on these and let me know your thoughts as Fins fans.

Double TE formation - working left side to right side:

1) Keller, Albert trade, Incognito, Pouncey, Warmack/Cooper 1st, Martin, Ertz 2nd

2) Keller, Martin, Incognito, Pouncey, Jerry, Fluker 1st, Ertz 2nd

3) Keller, Johnson 1st trade, Incognito, Pouncey, Jerry, Martin, Ertz 2nd

4) Keller, Martin, Incognito, Pouncey, Jerry, Winston F.A., Eifert 1st

5) Keller, Martin, Incognito, Pouncey, Jerry, Winston, Clay

I like the sounds of #1 above

Nobody here works? I wish I had time to post in the factory I work at.

living in kc i can tell u that armando was wayyyyyyyyy off on the entire albert thing, from how kc views him to how good he is. but ive been on this blog for years and can tell u ive seen the picks armando has called for in drafts and they have destroyed the ones ireland has made. i rem the jimmy graham train among others he was on. give him credit there

Fix The O-Line As A Whole.

Trade a 3rd for Albert. Draft Cooper #12. 4/5th Of The Line Will Be Signed for The Next 3-4 Years.

The Question You Have To Ask Yourself Is Any Of These 2nd Round Or 3rd Round. Or E. Fisher, Or L. Johnson. Better Than B. Albert.

Cause The Question Is B. Albert Better Than J. Long Should've Already Been Answered.

B. Albert Should Get A Better Contract Than Jake. If Not We Have A Problem. We Just Traded For A Guy We Know Is Worth Less Than J. LONG.

yeah albert makes this line go. if u sign awful wisnton this offense will suck

Mando,

My BS, your BS, all of our BS. Just talk S back and forth but no worries, bro words get lost in translation.

I follow you on twitter too, bro. Good stuff

dusty, no offense but I think i'll take Armando's view over yours 7 days a week and twice on Sundays! LOL

dashi not a single gm in nfl now that thinks long is better option than albert

Mando, the Chiefs have the #1 pick and are picking a player regardless of position. Just so happens they have someone of value there but is getting expensive and older. So who would you rather have? A player who is probably as good talent wise but younger and much cheaper? probably.

There is no 1A in this draft unless you go for an OG or a TE (and that TE is not as freakish as Tony Gonzalez or Vernon Davis). The DEs don't have a great track record for production. So the Chiefs are stuck. They'd like to keep Albert but he won't play RT. They aren't dying to push him out the door.

They're stuck and we are in need. Similar to if we drafted Star and Randy went nuts for a trade. Doesn't mean Randy isn't a good player ...

Yeah, well, all the best for the Division Title.

Mando,

No worries, reading it I can see how my words got lost in translation.

I follow you on twitter as well. Good stuff!

good to know u cant read steve, hilarious

Armando knows things...

the debates in here now are pointless, the trade is going down once miamis drs check him out. i just hope the new deal we give him is a solid deal for both

jpao, your first lineup looks best to be sure. But if you add a trade-down to that consider:

LT Albert, LG Incognito, C Pouncey, G Jerry, RT Martin, TE Eifert, TE Keller, WR Wallace, WR Hartline, RB Miller, QB Tannehill.

But also:

CB Hayden (top of 2nd round), DE Lemonier (bottom of 2nd round.

Get Albert, if you want, but trade back and get that second-rounder back, is all I'm saying. Otherwise losing Long looks dumb.

What's the rush to make the trade? Why now? Who's in the driver's seat, Miami or KC? Posted by Craig M
======================================================
I would agree with this thinking. Miami is in the driver seat. They do have options other than Albert with all their picks up to the 3rd round. Ireland should show the same restraint that he has exeplified until KC and their new regime give in and if they do not give in use other options for an OT.

Otherwise losing Long looks dumb.

^^ That all depends on how Long pans out this year (obviously no way to tell until it happens). If Long ends up on the IR then letting him go was good regardless of Albert/Johnson etc.

If the Chiefs played a 4-3, i think they would take Star or Shariff Floyd and call it a day ... I hate the 3-4 defense ... so unnatural to fill those positions ...

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