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Concerns about Lance Louis, Jonathan Martin

Ryan Tannehill is an optimistic guy. He thinks everything is going to work out with his running backs, his wide receivers, his tight ends, and his offensive line.

That's a good attitude to have because a football season is a roller coaster ride and players rise and fall, so keeping a bright outlook is good. But right now the offensive line is at a low point rather than a high point so the starting quarterback seems to be stretching credibility when he says the guys charged with protecting him are doing fine.

"I think they’re doing a great job, like I said there’s a couple guys banged up," Tannehill said. "There shifting around, a couple new faces bumping in while John’s (Jerry) out, moving Mike (Pouncey) over to guard a little bit, put (Josh) Samuda in at guard as well. They’ve done a good job at handling adversity, handling the change and just preparing for whatever is going to happen, you never know what’s going to happen."

Well, unless the line gets its act together what's going to happen is that Tannehill is going to get hit this year. A lot.

To wit:

On Wednesday, the offensive line added a new twist to the guard search with Nate Garner getting first-team snaps at right guard.

Suddenly, the experiment with Josh Samuda at guard (he's also worked at center) was pushed to a back burner. And the experiment of moving Mike Pouncey from center to guard (which I dislike) was delayed. And the experiment of moving Richie Incognito from left guard to right guard was similarly delayed.

The interesting thing in all this?

The Dolphins signed Lance Louis this offseason to compete with John Jerry for the starting job. The man is in his fifth season. He has satarted 28 career games including 24 the past two years.

So why hasn't he been at least an option to replace the injured Jerry?

The problem isn't that he wasn't the first option. The problem is the Dolphins have gone through four other options -- Incognito, Pouncey, Samuda and now Garner -- and Louis still hasn't budged from the second unit.

I know the thought might be he's still getting back from his 2012 knee surgery. Well, then how is it he's on second team? How is it he's taking all his reps and hasn't seemed limited physically in any way?

The Dolphins have moved four guys from different positions, including center and tackle to right guard but the right guard signed to be the backup to John Jerry hasn't been able to step in and fill that role.


And, by the way, it's not good for Louis if he's not one of the options because that shows limited value to the team. The Dolphins only spent $100,000 in guaranteed money on Louis this offseason so he has to show strong and become a starting option when injuries arise because he'll be very easy to cut at the end of this month otherwise.

So there's that.

And then this:

The questioin throughout training camp has been whether Olivier Vernon has suddenly blossomed to the point he was often beating left tackle Jonathan Martin for sacks. Or ... was Martin simply struggling?

Well, during Wednesday's practice, rookie Dion Jordan got a shot at matching up against Martin. And he had two sacks.

That's great news for Jordan as it was previously for Vernon. But that's a poor reflection on Martin, the team's starting LT.

If a second-year player and a rookie are looking exceedingly good against him in training camp, how's he going to survive the regular season?

Tannehill seems optimistic about all this. We'll see if he can remain that way.


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Save a half million? So you're saying they're paying Martin near 10 million this season? Your numbers are all jumbled. The savings are calculated by using Jakes asking price and subtracting Martins salary. Try again.

On L.Louis?

Anyone remember the veteran OG we brought in last off season and Retired during camp?

Same thing. We took a Flyer. But Ireland made sure to get more than 1 guy for the problem.

When would you like the team to experiment? Now that it is preseason and the games don't count. Or during the season when you should already know what everyone can do.

If Mando was at the Press Conference or Read my post from Yesterday or Talked to Barry Jackson. He would know Philbin said all these games are for experimenting. The Only game he prepares for like a Real game is the Second to last.

I prefer we experiment now. That way Philbin doesn't have to guess in the regular season when one of the starters goes down. Even at WR.

I can't understand why putting together a good O-line is that difficult. Should be childs play compared to other units. But yet, year after year, we have a good LT but no center or good center but no LT or......

At this point, I don't believe Martin will be significantly better than last year. Hope I'm wrong.

Please call James Walker and tell him of the O-line concerns.
He has his nose so far up the Phins bung hole that he cannot see what is going on.

Fraud...Karlos Dansby eats Tricep Muscles for breakfast...

The Atlanta Falcons have a bunch of good playmakers on O and arguably the worst OL in the league. They win that way.

They sorta win Atlfin...they blur the line between winning...and losing...no doubt though they win more than we have(((past tense)))


Putting the jokes aside for a second, Jakie Long was/is the reason Jake (got greedy) he was the highest paid OT in the NFL for Yrs.! She was shown on HARDKNOCKS as the Queen Bee of Fins Wives and probably took more offense to the offer than he did judging from her very punlic tyrads on twitter/social media while also having imense influence over the big guy.

(I would have told my wife to shut the F up! and let me handle my business it's not like they were going to go broke!)

That said he went into a Div. were he will be tested and pushed to his physical limits in every one of their 6 Div. games. He would have been better served staying in the AFC East were the caliber of talent isn't what it is in the NFC West from his Pos. I suspect Long will have alot of negative plays on NFL Primetime this Yr. were he'll get called out plenty by their HOF Crew.

Jake would've earned more in Miami. No state Tax in Florida. Compared to 6% in Missouri.

So that 1/2 of Mil you are talking about. Just off the state tax alone Jake would've earned more in Miami. And Miami was offering More than St.Louis. So Jake easily would've made a Couple more Million a Year in Miami than St.Louis.

But keep being ignorant to the facts.

Nice observation in that last paragraph fin4...never considered that...very very true...

The Falcons have been terrific. They go to the SB last year if Ryan didnt have to play through a bad injury in the 2nd half vs. 49ers.

Still... and again.... All of the angst that is now being shown concerning the O-line is being driven by the guys who are paid to provide controversy and conversation. The conversations is a good thing, all of the controversial "shoulda, woulda, coulda" talk is WAY PREMATURE.
I've been around as a Dolphins fan since the team was created in Miami. I know our fans are completely incapable of not over reacting. And with the poor performance of the team over the last decade whwo's to blame them.
But with all of YOU who see what you think you see, or believe what you do, consider this... The coaching staff is so much more connected to and aware of what is going on then anyone who calls themselves a fan or a contrarian. These guys have their CAREERS hanging on Ryan Tannehill not laying on his back with a bone sticking out of his thigh.
Consider also this... The Carolina Panthers released a Guard today (forget his name) who has been a stalwart player at that position. He has been in the NFL 8 years and releasing him came as a TOTAL surprise considering he played every snap in Preseason on the 1st team.
I say that to say this... Miami saw an injury bug create an issue with the receivers corps. They needed to get some warm body's in camp so they got some help within HOURS. If they did THAT for some missing WR's... just what do you think they would be doing if they thought Martin or anyone on the O-line wasn't going to work out? OR if they thought they had a problem and needed to address it?
Common man... Give the team credit and time time to evaluate these guys against another team or two. I think after the off season they put together they earned a BIT of trust. See if they go fishing on the FA market... Miami isn't broke, they even have a decent kicker to deal. If Joe Philbin, Mike Sherman and Jeff Ireland think they are facing Armageddon with the O-line... Mark my words... They will be steppin' and a-Fetchin' to get some help over there... Jeff Ireland is a survivor... He won't go down on the back of Jonathan Martin after making it this far... If JM needs to be replaced... It'll happen.


Agreed. Jackie runs Jake. It isn't even a 50/50 relationship. It is what she says and that is it. That is why I find it asinine when people think it was a choice.

On Mrs. T-Sizzle. To me she is Cute. I wouldn't call her Beautiful. But she does know how to shoot. You have to like that in a women as long as the gun isn't pointed at you.

But you can feel the Jealousy in HK when they showed the Player Wives. Like you said Jackie realized she wasn't Queen Bee anymore. Specially when Ms. T-Sizzle started doing charity work. That must've set her over the edge. That Jake and Jackie were now 2nd Fiddle.


James Walker is a Smart Man. I hated him for his Bills Bias. But even he knows who the team of the Future in the AFC East will be.

If James Walker can be Positive about the Fins. A guy that grew up a Bills fan. Why can't Mando?

Adam Beasley isn't from Miami and he sounds more sincere than Man don't.

Armando has more Jets fan following him on Twitter than he has Dolphin fans.

Another DOOM & GLOOM post by Mando!
Why am I not at all surprised? Smh...

Nothing on how Tannehill isn't throwing INT's. Nothing on how Jordan is starting to make himself known. Nothing on how Wallace and Tannehill are starting to click. Nothing on how improved the secondary is. Nothing on what may be a Top-5 Defense!

Just, "The Sky Is Falling!"

Maybe it's time for someone else to take over this blog at the Herald...just saying...

Save a half million? So you're saying they're paying Martin near 10 million this season? Your numbers are all jumbled. The savings are calculated by using Jakes asking price and subtracting Martins salary. Try again.

Posted by: Phins78 | August 01, 2013 at 01:59 PM

Jake Long signed a 4 Yr./34 Mil. contract in St. Louis with 16 Mil. guaranteed. He got 5 Mil. in signing bonus and is due in base 3 Mil. for the 2013 Season. I don't know how many of you understand how this breaks down but here goes.

The signing bonus (5 Mil) is spaced out through the life of the contract (4 Yrs.) so in actuality Long's 2013 CAP hit is 4.25 Mil. and 5.25 Mil. in 2014, sounds like a bargain you say? Well here is the TRICKY part of the equation. If Long were to deteriorate further due to attrition because of injury and the Rams tried to move on in 2014 they would take a 11.75 Mil DEAD MONEY CAP HIT! Given the balance of his guaranteed cash with bonuses and incentives.

The smart money tells you he's a Ram regardless till 2015 but even letting him go then is over 6 Mil in Dead money that Yr. (balance of guaranteed portion ect..) It's a HUGE gamble on a player who hasn't finished a Season healthy since 09. In contrast we signed Martin to a rookie deal worth 4.78 Mil. his base plus bonus puts him at 1.087 Mil. for 2013 and if we were to be so disappointed to out right release in 2014 we take a 950K Dead money CAP hit.

The math is were this gamble is taken on a player who excelled at LT in College. Even if Martin turns out to be very mediocre at LT for Miami I will wait till late Nov. to compare th Season body of work next to Long's in St. Louis before passing judgment on team error and of course production of Jordan who plays in this conversation passing on PHENOM potential at LT for supposed next Aldon Smith, gambles allaround and I'm pulling for the guys in Fins uniforms.

To Funny I just had to repost it. Mando WE GOT YOUR PLAYBOOK!!


Craig M..

I would agree...


Armando has guys (or himself) to drum up hits anytime he wants...

want to get some riled up in here...bring in YG to BASH Marino for a page or two...

That's not working....create a fake name to talk RYAN OVER LONG....

can't get any hits that way....

Talk about Sanchez...and his 2 AFC Championship game appearances....

not working...

insult ANY poster that stumbles in here and makes a valid football post or point...take the OPPOSITE...just because.....

that doesn't work....

Talk about race/religion/politics.....or peoples mom's....

Armando and STAFF have a game plan for hits...believe me....we have ALL witnessed it....

Posted by: Kris | August 01, 2013 at 12:00 PM

The same guys that loved Henne love Tannehill. Hmmmm.

How can you be anything but doom and gloom when you lose every frikken year? Being positive now would be like being negative after a SB win! Its ass backwards.

Kris | August 01, 2013 at 12:00 PM

Posted by: Dashi | August 01, 2013 at 02:40 PM

This is the truth! I posted about it yesterday! Mando is always here lurking and pushing his regulars into posting back-n-forth frenzy so he can show Herald/sponsers that while a HACK reporter his blog compensates his presence. Neither here nor there AP National reporting is the future in the cyber information age with local newpapers outside of rags like the Miami New times being as extinct as female body hair (if you gt my drift)

Armando and STAFF have a game plan for hits...believe me....we have ALL witnessed it....

Posted by: Kris | August 01, 2013 at 12:00 PM

Posted by: Dashi | August 01, 2013 at 02:40 PM

Their game plan for hits is basically hand off. Let the players play. And uts working. Armando has banned more than a few on here at different times. But he's like a ref thats letting the players play for the most part. Its the right game plan. And makes Armando the most widely followed Dolphin reporter.

Folks in this league that cut their teeth on special teams are worried...after hearing about "probowl" rules...just ask Hester and Cribbs...That crap creeps into the season and all bets are off...the NFL will go anywhere...

Funny to hear guys say 'trading Bess will end up costing Ireland his job'. GIVE YOUR HEAD a SHAKE!! Bess was NEVER a starting WR. Average all the way around. Please tell me how many Pro Bowls he made. Tell me how many winning season we had with him here. Are the guys who KEEP bringing this up, the guys that bought BESS jerseys or something. Like WTF??

I like Bess, but PLEASE stop with over-rating this guy.

Bess is going to have a huge season. He'll be on my fantasy team if the price is right.

I will say, I liked Lane Johnson a lot too and I think if it was me I would have traded for him too. Big need on the team (considering I'm not sold on Martin). But I also like the Jordan pick.

To me, Ireland will be judged on taking Tannehill at 8 last year, trading up to get Jordan and all the activity this offseason. His job wil depend on those moved panning out.

I think Mando's still pissed that he lost his radio show...
And, Jake Long is gone...
And, Jason Talyor's not in football anymore...

Maybe someone needs to get Mando a hooker. Then, he'll be much more positive...

A mid-life crisis is a terrible thing..

Bess should have a field day against the Dullfins in the opener!! Sweet Revenge!!

I'm sure Bess will also educate the Browns D on the hapless Philbin/Sherman offence.

IMO one of the things that got Bess traded from the team was...for all the Bess is money on 3rd down talk he got...and rightfully so for a couple years...but last year...time and time again the dude either ran the route a yard short...OR...would catch the ball for a first down then take a couple steps back trying to create more...and lose the first down...very frustratig to watch...
By the end of the season it was like his finishing move...come up short...look over to the sidelines...pound ball on ground...

Bess reminds me of Wes Welker. Always has.

I'm confident that Keller, Gibson and Hartline can be our third down guys. Guys on here won't even be mentioning Bess by mid-season.

I think Bess got traded because they realized Gibson was an upgrade over him and 2.6 million was too much to pay a WR 4 in the last year of his contract.

This was one case of Ireland actually getting something for a player he was letting go(even though the price was really small only like a 4th rounder I think.)

Bess got traded because the Dolfins got mad he wouldnt play through an injury that the team deemed minor.

It is becoming very apparent the all of our WRs outside the first 3 suck. The rookie Will Davis killing them Today.

Quick Question: When does this guy Salguero get replaced? He is absolutely the worst sports guy in the nation. Why is he employed with the Herald? Armando's twitter feed comes across as a teenager who doesn't get laid and he writes for the Herald sports page? Please try to find more than a walking talking monkey to cover the Dolphins... we deserve better than this guy.

There is also the possibility that Will Davis is very, very good.

They didn't get a 4th rounder for Bess NeMo...they traded 4th rounders...

Or swapped...I reckon...would be a better word...

Any other tidbits on practice...Oscar???

Or most probably, they are both combined.

we deserve better than this guy.
Posted by: Mooney | August 01, 2013 at 03:24 PM


I dont think it will be too long before ESPN or Yahoo Sports snatches Armando up. He is the best and we should appreciate him. His insight, connections, and timely reports are invaluable for the serious fan. The other writers copy his stories days after he writes them.

Another sack by Vernon. Kinda hoping he didn't beat Martin, but Martin was on field. Martin seems 2 b having ruff day.

lmao. yeah homers no concerns.

Of course, no pads on Today.

Olivier Vernon sack of t'hill. Looked like he beat Martin badly.

some more for the truley dense.

This is going terribly, RT intercepted, J Martin destroyed, WRs all sucky. My God!

huge hole at lt and nobody here to fix it. unreal them not knowing just how bad martin is

Martin is pathetic


He is an intrepid reporter.

oscar, ross cut the power in the buble 2day, he doesn't want anybody 2 c the product.

All kind of injuries appearing also, Ellerbe, Odrick.

Bess reminds me of Wes Welker. Always has.
Posted by: NFL Analyst | August 01, 2013 at 03:17 PM

Except Welker scores TDs, How many has Bess scored???


Exactly right. Bess isn't or wasn't worth the money....time to move on.

End of conversation.


Agreed on Bess. I like him as a player. But Thigpen basically replaced him. And is more dynamic.

martin Struggling......
I hope Mrs. Tennehll has Life insurance for her hubby....

GO PHINS!!!!!!!!!!

Today, that product is nothing to be looked at, 2 watt.

Lookithat, Jordan drops into coverage.

Except Welker scores TDs, How many has Bess scored???

Posted by: Cuban Menace | August 01, 2013 at 03:42 PM

Welker scored TD's after he got off the Dolphins. Bess will undoubtedly improve from his Miami stint also.

You don't read about wake smoking past Clabo... Perhaps Clabo should try LT? They can still make a trade for someone as well. Jordan is a beast and Vernon is def up and coming. I have the feeling Clabo could at least be average at LT. Also, no wallace or hartline, are coverage sacks part of this?

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