« Look back at Tampa Bay courtesy PFF | Main | Shotgun weddings are a bad idea »

Drafting Jon Martin was a consensus decision

When the second round of the 2012 NFL draft began, the Dolphins knew they wanted to add an offensive tackle. Two players were at the top of general manager Jeff Ireland's horizontal draft board at the position and both were graded as virtual equals.

The Dolphins, with the 42nd overall selection, liked Georgia offensive tackle Cordy Glenn and Stanford offensive tackle Jonathan Martin.

And when the the Buffalo Bills selected Glenn with the 41st pick, there was no hesitation inside the Dolphins draft room. The focus immediately shifted to Martiin.

A scout who was most familiar with Martin was brought in and asked to go over the scouting report. And the file was clean. Martin was described as Andrew Luck's blindside protector, as smart, as a potentially good locker room guy and as a tough player.

When the scout was done with the report everyone in the room was sold. Everyone in the room agreed. No one -- not owner Stephen Ross, not coach Joe Philbin, obviously not Ireland, no one -- said anything that would suggest Martin shouldn't be picked.

Indeed, the idea that Martin is "soft," was never brought up. There were no red flags as to his psychological or emotional state. There were no medical issues.

And based on that strong organizational consensus, the Dolphins selected Martin.

Fast forward 19 months and it is clear the narrative on Martin has changed. His emotional state is such that he's getting treatment for an unspecified "illness." He was considered to be soft by some teammates.

So did the Dolphins completely miss it?

Or did Martin, under heavy and unrelenting pyschological attack, simply lose it once he got to the Dolphins?

Was Jonathan Martin troubled before he came to the Dolphins, suggesting the personnel department missed something, or did the Miami culture ruin him, suggesting the coaching failed him?

To hear former Stanford players such as Coby Fleener and Andrew Luck talk, they back up the initial scouting report the Dolphins had on Martin.

That, however, is not the point. The point is now Martin has fallen away and his representatives say he's not comfortable returning to the Dolphins. So aside from the sad nature of this Incognito-Martin issue, the bottom line is the Dolphins have probably wasted another second round pick.

And the popular thinking among fans is it is all Ireland's fault.

Well, sure, it is Ireland's ultimate responsibility for picking a player that did not return the desired investment. But what happened that day in the draft room was a full-throated approval of what Ireland was doing. That includes Joe Philbin. That includes owner Stephen Ross.

Everyone.

To his credit, Philbin publicly has not distanced himself from Ireland at a time Ross has seemingly done so and fans are on a Fireland rampage. On Wednesday the coach made certain everyone knows Ireland does not act alone on personnel matters. Philbin, you see, is also responsible for personnel wins and losses since he was hired.

“Jeff and I have worked closely since the day I’ve gotten here," the coach said. "He’s been very supportive. We all work together. This is not a one-man operation in any regard. Everybody works together. Everybody contributes."

And when responsibility must be attached or fault found, everyone shares in that.

So if Ireland indeed loses his job for this pick, this controversy, it bears saying he had lots of company in Jonathan Martin becoming a sad chapter in Dolphins history. Philbin approved of picking Martin. As did others.

No one said no.

Meanwhile, there is something to be said for fate because Glenn, who the Dolphins just as likely would have picked before he was selected by the Bills, is turning into a very good player. He has started every game for the Bills this season at left tackle. 

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

I guess you're right in this instance Bill, guy just doesn't use logic in this argument ...

The only thing he really has to hang his hat on is the fumbles but if the line did even a semi decent job, that wouldn't be an issue either.

Tannehill fumbles: sack ratio is 21.6% whereas the league avg for Qb is 22.6%. So logic says line does a better job and even those fumbles would go down drastically.

If Peyton Manning (who fumbles 53.8% of the time he's sacked) played behind this line, it's not unreasonable to think he would have 20 fumbles.

yet yesterday or the day before you said Eli and Big Ben were franchise Qbs...

man oh man mark sure wish we could of gotten manning

Wouldn't it be brilliant if we got a QB just one or two of the 5 things they NEED to succeed?
How about we do that and then FULLY judge the QB?

Tds and yards per game this year..

Tannehill 255 ypg, league avg 251
Tannehill TDs per game 1.6, league avg 1.6

And every fumble is not a turnover as they are not all lost.

Man, keep the statistical analysis to someone else....

The Dullfins will waste 4 years with Tannebust like they did with Hennebust. Clueless FO repeating the same mistakes over and over.

Fed Up, maybe they should get Manningbust so after he loses his first playoff game like he does almost every year, you can come and post in here like a genius too...

I did. I didn't say I wanted either. I'd take Big Ben over Tranny. They are both inconsistent. They just have the ability to win BIG when they're hot. RT doesn't have that

I'm still waiting for the CRITERIA. You cherry pick stats, I'll cherry pick stats.

What makes a good QB? Winning? We haven't won. PLayoffs? Never been, not going
Stats? TD's, Ratio? What?

A QB needs:

1- Decent Coach/scheme
2- Decent OL
3- Decent Run Game
4- Decent Deep WR Threat
5- Decent TE

The Miami Dolphins do not have ANY of these 5. Just imagine Tannehill with 2 of these 5??


Fed Up, maybe they should get Manningbust so after he loses his first playoff game like he does almost every year, you can come and post in here like a genius too...

Posted by: Mark in Toronto | November 14, 2013 at 02:24 PM

LOLOLOLOLOL....he said Manningbust!!

We had no chance landing Manning so there's no reason to dream about it. Passing on Drew Brees is what haunts us to this day.

cant wait bill, maybe 2014

I imagine RT watching another, better QB from the bench if those things existed.

My belief is that Marc=FedUp=Caddilacdeville....because everytime the Tannehill hating starts they are seem to appear.

Why did we have no chance at landing Manning?

Bill A, even with all the flaws in the offense, the Qb is meaasuring up ok against the rest of the league in several metrics. the one falw he has now is the # of int and fumbles which is above league avg. His fumble or Int per pass attempt is 5.4% wheras the league avg is 4.2%. Some of that can be fixed by getting a better o line (easily cut down on the fumbles and give him more time to pass) some more experience also should theorhetically reduce these turnovers as well.

However all the full time starters that have a higher than league avg turnovers per pass attempt are as follows:

Kellen Clemens, QB
Ryan Fitzpatrick, QB
Thad Lewis, QB
Geno Smith, QB
Christian Ponder, QB
Terrelle Pryor, QB
Eli Manning, QB
Carson Palmer, QB
Russell Wilson, QB
Ryan Tannehill, QB
Robert Griffin III, QB
Ben Roethlisberger, QB
Colin Kaepernick, QB
Michael Vick, QB
Joe Flacco, QB
Brandon Weeden, QB
Jay Cutler, QB
Andy Dalton, QB

A lot of them are either inexperienced or playing behind crapola o lines. Tannehill unfortunately has both. Next year as a third year player, it is my expectation that this stat really fixes itself or we may indeed have to go looking for another Qb.

I believe you're wrong Bill. I'm not the only person that thinks he stinks. I don't "hate" him. I don't even know him. I just want the team to have a better QB.

I go way back here Bill. MarK knows. You, I don't know.

Seriously Bill A, unless the team is undefeated, everyone on the team is bust ...

then when they go somewhere else like Reggie or jake and do better than what we replace them with then it's the Gm that's an idiot.

There's always a scapegoat in these people's existence.

everyone we have sucks, everyone we let go is an all pro.

So, what you're saying MarK is that he's AVERAGE?

That's great

...Bill A..I would say if your criteria is decent then we have 2 of the 5..#4 being way above average. Clay isn't horrible, he isn't an all around tight end. But for how we use him..He is definitely under your own criteria..decent.

As far as 1,2,3..I agree. I think 3 sort of goes hand and hand with 1 & 2..Before last weeks game the 2 backs were averaging over the league base line for ypc(if you combined them)..Miller was 5 ypc..That is far from horrible..So again..I would probably lean towards criteria 1-2 as agreeable on your list.

3 by default just because of the philosophy of our brilliant coaches.

Bill thinks only one person is disgusted? LMAO!!

Im with Marc, Tannehill cant throw a long ball to save his life!! The offense has to constantley go on 10 plus plays every single time to score. No quick strikes, no big plays just dinking and dunking.

Im not saying Tanne a bust but he just looks to be average. He has only shown more than Weedon in his draft class thats not saying much.

He cant throw a deep ball!

Mark in Toronto its funny how the dummies that just do not understand the game of football yell the loudest. I will go on record now so copy paste and keep this post so that you can expose me if Im wrong.

Next year IF WE HAVE A NEW GM AND COACH STAFF and they place the CORRECT tools around Tannehill the Miami Dolphins will win the division contend for the Super Bowl.

Name one decent QB who isnt remotley accurate on long balls. I mean its ridicolous

marc, I could understand your frsutration but fact remains 9.9 times out of ten a Qb develops, he isn't born.

Fact is the kid was better last year than many experts thought he was when he was drafted. This year, he's better than last, not like we are just waiting around for somethign to happen, it is happening. How much further he goes is anyone's guess but I have time for him as long as he keeps getting better.

Unfortunately we do place too much on him to win games, more than what successful teams do to young Qbs early in their careers. Big Ben, Brady, very sheltered when they had the same experience as Tannehill for example. A year from now we will have our final verdict on Tannehill.

Coming to a conclusion now is premature at best.

Bill, out of anyone on this blog, the person I pity the most right now is you. If we lose to the Jets, and you have to hear it from those a-hole fans who are all around you, I think I'd rather be in a jail cell wearing a Star of David in Syria. And if we lose to them twice, in ONE month, I wouldn't be surprised if you chose to end it and jump of the GW bridge. Stay strong brother, I'll be praying for you.

marc, I'm saying right now he's average. And when you consider that last year he was not even average that's encouraging. I'm saying that when the rest of the offense has regressed as much as it has around him, it's encouraging. Sometimes you have to project and right now he's trending up, so in my opinion it would be follish to bail since he's already better than half the starters out there.

you aren't going to get a better qb for 2014 in free agency or the draft than Ryan Tannehill.

Ya could surround Tanny with an all star team and he'd still stink.

Next year IF WE HAVE A NEW GM AND COACH STAFF and they place the CORRECT tools around Tannehill the Miami Dolphins will win the division contend for the Super Bowl.

Posted by: Bill Arnsparger | November 14, 2013 at 02:34 PM

This is like saying if the moon were really made of cheese, the price of cheddar would go down.

Tannehill needs to spend all offseason throwing long balls to Wallace. No h0m0

jets will make playoffs at 8-8 then get hammered right away

Posted by: Darryl Dunphy | November 14, 2013 at 02:33 PM

Darryl, REALLY?, you honestly think we have 2 out of 3?? Clay is decent? Seriously you even state he is not a complete TE...that's what decent means...correct. Not a HOF but gets the TE job done.
AS for run game..you have got to be joking? You KNOW you cannot look at yards per rush....look at yards per game. WE RANK BOTTOM HALF OF NFL IN ALL RUSHING METRICS!
I ask you this Darryl next year you are ok with our current TE's? and current running game?

im fine with miller, its the oline. te def need upgrade


Bill, out of anyone on this blog, the person I pity the most right now is you. If we lose to the Jets, and you have to hear it from those a-hole fans who are all around you, I think I'd rather be in a jail cell wearing a Star of David in Syria. And if we lose to them twice, in ONE month, I wouldn't be surprised if you chose to end it and jump of the GW bridge. Stay strong brother, I'll be praying for you.

Posted by: DC Dolfan | November 14, 2013 at 02:36 PM

DC you hit it right on here...that's why us out of town fans are so passionate about our team. I have been abused by Jets, Giants and Pats fans for way too many years. Can't get away from it in my profession. Im not a fan that hides his allegiance either. I have the old 70's logo tattooed on my damn arm!!

ill never buy one thing with that awful new logo on it

I think I'd rather be in a jail cell wearing a Star of David in Syria

Classic line DC.....classic LOL

out of towners = out of touch = clueless

Yeah, I have to agree that Miller is a good back but that running game overall is atrocious. Now ay to dress up 25th overall in rush yards per game. Anyway you slice it, that's no good. Has to be at least 6 slots or so higher to even be considered usable.

Actually Miami fans=empty stadium=clueless. even when we are winning the stadium is half empty and the other half is the fans of the opponent. I would venture to state that the out of town fans have been to more games than the local fans. I have been to 3 games myself this year already and plan to be at the NYJ, Bills and Pats game!

Well, any way you slice it, this weekend's game will be fun to watch. Sd's pass defense is so bad that it may not be able to take advantage of our line, we won't be able to stop Rivers' air show ...

mid 90s Pats Dolphins anyone???

At least you admit that he's average MarK. Good enough. I don't want an average QB.

If it's premature to call him out, than it's also premature to say that NOBODY in FA or the draft will be as good.

If your theory is that 99.99 percent of QB's need development than it's possible that there's a FA waiting to blossom, ala Brees.

Regardless, I've seen all I need to. I don't need stats or metrics. I have eyes.

How about B MARSHALL ;)

Bill, going to two myself this year... I don't think any non season ticket holding Miami Dolphins fans can say that. Going to Steelers, Bills, should've gone to the opener in Cleveland too but I was getting hammered by allergies ...

yeah if i was ross id move this team. fans in miami are pathetic

...Bill A..I was going off your own crietia. You are the one that lisetd what a qb needs..Not me. You listed we needed a "decent" tight end. I said Clay fits this criteria..He is decent.

About a deep threat..You listed we needed a decent deep threat..we have an above average deep threat.

I went on to say that we have a good running game(with the exception of last week, and obvious short yardage situations) IMO this isn't neccesarily the fault of the backs. It is the fault of our scheme, or failure to commit to the run, the offensive line issues(which I agree)..Our pass first philosophy(again a coaching issue)..

To answer your question..No I have had issue with the run game all season. Since training camp to be frank. And no I am not satisfied with the tight ends. But it has more to do with how we use them(the coaching) then the players themselves..

You make it seem like the whole roster is garbage...It isn't. I think it is the system, the coaches tht are failing(with the exception of the o-line)

Marc, never said Marshall wasn't a good player. i said he was an awful Miami Dolphin. he crapped on the organization and it's fans from day one here.

ANy self respecting Dolphins fan should hate marshall too.

I would bet any of you still fawning over marshall have also taken back a girlfriend you found cheating on you ....

(PS, he has still enver made the playoffs and won't this year either)

I'll be at the Jets game.

There goes Mark with his useless metrics like sack to fumble ratio. Who on earth cares about minutia stats like that? You are ignoring the fact that alot of the sacks are Tanne's fault and in the most important categories of all, wins vs. losses, and TD's vs. turnovers he is not doing good, and you are ignoring both of those.
No one needs useless stats when they can plainly see the terrible deep throws, inconsistent accuracy, inability to throw a touch pass, lack of pocket awareness, slows reads, and not knowing when to tuck the ball and run.
That being said, I have not given up on Tanne. But next year is it. If he plays like this next year, he is a career backup. Well, for good teams anyways. Probably still starts for the Phins.

dusty there are no fans in miami. it is all poor anti white haitans and cubans that pretend they don't speak English.

None of them have any interest in football and most don't even have the money for a ticket.

its becoming a bad roster quickly. the dline very talented. lb's are horrible. secondary decent. oline worst in nfl. young solid qb. very good prospect at rb. wrs above avg with gibson. te needs serious upgrades

Mark I was In Cleveland, Indy and Pats game. I am going to Buff, NYJ and Pats in Miami...Im thinking about Pitt also. If my bro in law who is a pitt fan goes Im in.
So we should hook up in Buffalo Mark....Im on here as long as you...except I come on less frequent in the beginning. Only started everday in this season cuz I saw you needed help!! :)

lol elmo

bill save your money. prisoners should have to watch this team. i cant wait till 2014

Well said Masshole

Having a football team in Miami is like opening a whorehouse at the Center for Disease Control.


You make it seem like the whole roster is garbage...It isn't. I think it is the system, the coaches tht are failing(with the exception of the o-line)

Posted by: Darryl Dunphy | November 14, 2013 at 02:54 PM

Darryl I am on record stating that this roster is loaded with some talent. I have stated that the Dolphins GM/HC job will be most sought after this offseason due to our talent. That being said we needa TE and a RB and a real WR.

MassD, how is that a useless stat? It indicates whether he actually has a true fumbling problem a la Matt Moore or Dave Krieg or if it's a more a product of neglect by poor pass protection.

Most of the sacks are his fault. Really? Really???? yeah, I guess he should be able to transport himself a la Spock on Star trek every time he snaps the ball.

Sure some of the sacks are because he holds the ball too long but that is true of almost every quarterback. Still the sheer volumes of sacks he absorbs tells you the brunt of the blame is on the line...

Sure Bill, remember to dress warm, Buffalo is going to be a glacier that day!!

mark what u gonna do with that mayor down there

You will hear the term coverage sack in every friggin game you watch (which tells you the Qb held the ball too long and could've avoided the sack). yet people here will tell you it's an affliction that only affects our QB.

Make him Prime Minister probably.

« 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 »

The comments to this entry are closed.