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Philbin endorses OL coach Jim Turner

Amid the ups and downs of this season and the drama and controversy of the past three weeks, one constant that has remained (unfortunately for the Dolphins) has been that the offensive line has always been at the core of the issues.

You know the facts: Forty-one sacks allowed to lead the NFL. Two starting linemen gone from the team because they were frenemies or something, guys benched, etc ...

And to me, that begs the question what responsibility does offensive line coach Jim Turner have in all this.

Well, let's get to the news. Whatever part Turner has played in any or all of Miami's offensive line problems and drama, he apparently has the blessing of his boss. That's because on Tuesday, Dolphins coach Joe Philbin gave Turner a pretty solid endorsement when I asked what kind of job the assistant has done so far this season.

"I thought he did a great job," Philbin began. "It’s evidence in the play of our guys the other day.  We had a lot of  moving parts and we’ve had some moving parts throughout the course of the season.  I think his players believe in him. I think he works hard every single day and he’s done a good job."

Now, I understand Philbin isn't going to throw Turner under the bus if he believes the assistant has stunk. That's simply not done. But there are ways to finesse this if the head coach wants to without losing credibility.

You'll recall Tony Sparano was asked in 2008 what kind of job then offensive line coach Mike Maser was doing. I recall because I asked the question. And Sparano said something akin to "he's busy doing his job and he'll be evaluated at the end of the season just like we'll all be evaluated at the end of the season."

That was no an endorsement, particually in light of the fact he was being effusive about other assistants when asked. And apparently Sparano took that tact for good reason because after a season in which Dolphins quarterbacks were sacked 26 times, Maser was fired. Seems Maser rubbed some players the wrong way and actually, get this, was a bit of a bully at times, according to club sources who spoke to me at the time.

The irony.

Anyway, that's not the approach Philbin took on Tuesday. His was a full-blown attaboy for Turner. And that is fine if that's how Philbin feels.

But I'm not so sure the facts jibe with the kudos. The Dolphins have given up 78 sacks in the two years Turner's been the offensive line coach -- and there are still six games to play this season.

Now, sacks are not the full measure of an offensive line coach. After all, quarterback awareness in the pocket affects that number as does inexperienced or poor pass protection from backs. But then there's this:

One player was very good before Turner arrived and has been very good after leaving didn't play nearly as well under Turner. Jake Long was ProFootballFocus's No. 21-rated tackled in 2011 before Turner joined the Dolphins. Last year under Turner, Long dropped to the No. 46-rated tackle in the NFL, according to PFF. This year with the St. Louis Rams, he is the No. 7 rated offensive tackle.

And it is not just Long.

Last year with Atlanta, right tackle Tyson Clabo was the No. 14-rated offensive tackle in the NFL, according to PFF. He allowed only five sacks, including none in the final 14 games he played including the playoffs.

This year with the Dolphins?

Clabo has allowed 10 sacks, has not been able to string together even two games without allowing a sack and is the No. 66-rated tackle in the NFL, per PFF. Did he suddenly forget how to play the game? Did he suddenly lose not one, but several steps at age 32?

Center Mike Pouncey is pass blocking much better now under Turner than he did as a rookie in 2011 before Turner. But how much of that is the fact Pouncey's simply more experienced? And his run blocking in 2013 actually is not as good as it was in 2011.

Now, I'm not saying everyone takes a step back under Turner. Richie Incognito's work got much better under Turner. And John Jerry became a full-time starter under Turner.

But Jerry has already given up twice as many sacks this year (4) as he did last year (2) and there are still six more games to play. And Incognito ... well, let's not go there.

 

 

Comments

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The OL has been a problem, on one level or another for awhile in Miami. The common factor? Ireland. What's his role in all this? They never seem to get the personnel right. Even with first and 2nd round picks. Chemistry is a bigger deal than most want to give credit for. No matter what round you are drafted, every Olineman is 6'4", and 310lbs.

Cant get away from a total embarrassment of a franchise. Starting at the top with Ross. Ireland a joke of a general manager lacking respect from colleagues, fans, players, analysts. History of his drafts BAD. Jury still out on Philbin, but franchise so in need of direction and leadership. Unfortunately, Ross isn't going anywhere. Ross so needs to hire a football man to be the face of the franchise. Whether its Dungy, or anyone else they need a face that can lead and hire the right people.

An unfortunate situation with Incognito and Martin. No doubt Incognito is on the rough side, but every NFL team would love an enforcer type for their team. Martin was never the "football" type as this is a ferocious sport. I don't believe he is cut out to play it. This incident causes a major setback with retooling, that should never have occurred with the right leadership.

Ross…..be an owner, not the face of the franchise.
Ireland….please resign….theres been enough damage.

I think Jonathan Martin set this Oline back.

Sincerely,

The boogie man

Turner is the topic now that Wells hasnt released any info to the clamoring media calling for someones head anyone cmon man give us somethin.
Its still several days until the next test against Carolina,have at it bloggers for the weekday edition of the "Miami Harold" comic strip cmon dude let us draw pictures too.

Jake Long plays much better when he isn't nursing an injury.
Tyson Clabo may not be well suited to play in a zone blocking scheme.
John Jerry has overcome weight problems under Turner and has raised his level of play up to mediocre.
We need help on the offensive line in the form of players, not coaches.

Stephen Ross is a clueless owner!!! It just sucks that Marino couldn't of lead a group to run it!!

What a great job Mike Shula has done with Cam Newton, who appears to be not the easiest guy to coach up. Cam is more patient now, does not throw into double coverages, etc. Under no circumstances I'm saying Tannehill has the physical QB ability of Newton, but everybody can see Tanny is very raw still. WhoTH is our QB Coach now? Fire him.

Jonathan Martin will never be totally accepted on a NFL team again.
There will always be players who feel that he broke an unwritten trust when he went public with things shared in the locker room.
Any team that signs him should be aware that he brings a high potential to divide their locker room with him.

Well we will see what kind of coach he is this week, bc the Panthers Dline is stout.

Oscar I'm not saying Shula hasn't done great job but I don't think Newton's raw ability throwing the ball is any better than a lot of other NFL QBs including Tannehill. Where he excels is being elusive and you don't teach that.

REALLY. So now the OL coach is getting the blame? REALLY.?

So if I'm doing a bad job at work it's my bosses fault? Really? If you write some bad columns in a row is it your bosses fault, Armando?

Pretty clear the problem with the line is the lack of 'togetherness'. How do you expect your unit to play well when guys don't even like each other. You need guys that would go through a wall for you. I don't think we have that.

And when did a coach 'being a bully' become a bad thing in the NFL? When did it become 'wrong'? So it's OK to do in the military but not the NFL? Guys like Ditka and Parcells and Bum Phillips coached in the NFL for years because they were nice guys? Come on!

This whole investigation STINKS of hypocrisy!

Panthers are likely without Charles Johnson this week. That's a big break for the 'phins.

This has the feel of a trap game for the Panthers this week after a couple of big emotional wins against the Pats and Niners. Maybe we catch these guys sleeping this week.


Well we will see what kind of coach he is this week, bc the Panthers Dline is stout.

Posted by: mattybfromnc

Your Panthers will be getting a visit from Mr. Wells as soon as he wraps it up down here in Miami.
Aqib Talib went home to his mommy and daddy and has filed a complaint charging Steve Smith with bullying him Monday night.

If Philbin thinks Turner is going a "great job" and the O-line is underperforming, then isn't he in effect saying the players suck?

Can't blame all of the O-line problems on Turner. But as Mando pointed out, why do otherwise good players underperform when coached by Turner? Not only that but you have to know that Philbin depends on his assistants for player evaluations. This whole mess goes back to Philbin hiring too many who had zero experience in the NFL.

@ cocoajoe
Jake Long hasn't had a significant injury yet this season and is playing much better as a result of that, not because of superior coaching.
Tyson Clabo did not play in a zone blocking scheme in Atlanta.
John Jerry is playing a better over all game this year. Not good but better.
Our problems on the offensive line can be solved with the addition of more suitably talented players.

Letting Jake Long walk away was MORONIC!

From the previous blog there were some folks discussing why T-Hill has issues with the long ball. Here are some observations to be taken with a grain of sea salt.

1. Marksmanship is not a born trait, it is a learned one. True some are born with a knack to perform one or another skill a bit better than others, but only with practice does one excel at it. T-Hill just needs to practice the crap out of throwing the long ball, and he too will develop the ability to do so.

2. Bob Griese at one point in his career starting having accuracy problems, and one day someone suggested he get his eyes checked, and sure enough they found out he had a vision impairment that was rectified by the wearing of eyeglasses. Maybe it's time Tanny visited the Optometrist?

3. Other NFL teams flip flop their receivers all the time, why is it cast in concrete that Wallace will NEVER line up on the left side of the formation? The Shermanator needs to be held to atone for this complete lack of creativity.

4. And of course lastly, because opportunities are so few for Wallace one would think that the warrior/gladiator spirit that well should reside within him would suggest that he take a greater advantage of those fleeting opportunities to do a better job of attacking the football and taking ownership of every ball in flight within his domain.

I hope J Martin can return to RT for us next season but they have to stop the racism and extortion on the Dolphins.

Craig M....

in short...YES...it is the boss's fault...

Leadership starts from the TOP (FO and HC)....and then trickles down....Coordinators, Assistants...postion coaches....players....and so on and so forth all the way down to he way the gatorade mixer mixes the gatorade....and how fast he can get it into the players mouth during practice...and games...

With each screw up...there is a Leve within that stucture that a "boss" is responsible.....

Gatorade mixer isn't moving dast enough...then you get up in the QC coach...or what ever role you are calling it...and for the most part...it should end there...either with a highly motivated...exceptionally renewed gatorade mixer...or a replaced gatorade mixer....

If the ENTIRE organization is embarrassed....then the level is exponatially higher....Mr. Ross will NEVER speak on a trivial issue such as why the gatorade taste like SH@T...but if the issue is big enough to where he has to address it...then you can believe that someone wasn't doing there job...imo...the OL coach first...and Philbin 2nd....I have no idea how Ireland even plays into this....other than he brought COGS here....it was Philbin and his staffs job to coach him...and provide structure and discipline....

So yes....The boss is responsible for the screw up of those he works for....

and in the military it is even worse....

a knuckle(private) headgoes out on a friday night....and gets a DUI...he could cost his PLT Sergeant his job (the knukle head's boss's boss)....

If the same knuckle head pulls a stunt like COGS did in the FINS sponsored golf tournement...

Then he will most likey have every fired from the Battalion Commander on down...I'm not gonna try and explain the rank structure...but that is a crap load of people....all who's career will have been ruined...because they are in SOME WAY connected to the knuckle head thu leadership....

Hooray! Craig Moron is here! Hooray!

This Spring all the "experts" were saying we needed to draft or trade for help on our offensive line.That just goes to show you that even the "experts" are right once in a while.

Tannehill is our franchise qb all you idiots need to look at the stats both him and lucks number are just about the same except for int. so you all should put a sock in it

Posted by: 6bucks7games | November 20, 2013 at 08:35 AM
======================================================
As I pointed out "Can't blame all of the O-line problems on Turner". But if you think a chicken can pull a wagon, I say hitch 'em up!

TannePuke is a bust just like Henne.

To Anthony at 08:40, do you also hope for the eye of Cat-5 hurricanes to pass over your house?

Learn football south florida

The guy has no time to even set in the pocket I think tannehill is the real deal

Posted by: cocoajoe | November 20, 2013 at 08:43 AM
That would only work if it was an itty bitty wagon, Joe.

I think a lot of blame goes on Turner. Coaches are there to lead, influence and teach.
We've all had bosses/supervisors who sucked...hard to stay motivated when a person you disrespect is barking orders.

I predict Turner is one of the fall guys in this s**t storm.

John in Springs @ 8:38....good stuff

it must be all of the dioxin in the air and water in nj if u tink tfumble is a qb worth a chat
.
lol

The dreaded vote of confidence is typically followed up by the imminent dismissal of said recipient. I predict Mssr. Turner is toast.

wit lux on this team wit the d the phinz r 9-1
fax jax.
.
lol

wow!, lux and mw ,td td td td td td td td td td td
.
lol

Mike Wallace KNOWS TannePuke stinks!

Thanks CocoaJoe, my favorite place on the entire eastern seaboard is Cocoa Beach and specifically Canaveral Pier, I refuse to call it anything else. My second favorite place has got to be Picnic Tables, great waves, great rock reef, I love surfing Brevard County waves!!!

6bucks, ha!...funy, old reference I rememebered that seemed to fit

caddy, just tink of lux chucking 2 wallace every game.
hold onto 2 u'r jox stupid homers
.
lol

yeah, tint wit his pop gun arm
.
lol

heck, l00k at mccown winning games 4 da bears
shuld have kept him
.
lol

Has Irescum resigned yet?

Posted by: Marc from nj | November 20, 2013 at 08:46 AM

Some of us live and breathe football here in South Florida.

5-5 and the stupid homers r doin' back flips
.
lol
never play a homer in a limbo game u will surely lose
.
lol

Jim Turner enters his first season with the Dolphins after being named offensive line coach on February 2, 2012.

Turner joins the Dolphins after having spent the previous four seasons (2008-11) in the same position at Texas A&M under then-head coach and current Dolphins offensive coordinator Mike Sherman. While with the Aggies, Turner molded one of the best offensive lines in college football. In 2011, his group led the nation in fewest sacks allowed as the Aggie line surrendered only eight over the course of the 12-game regular season. The offensive line also paved the way for the Aggies to boast the nation's 21st-ranked rushing attack.

Turner worked with the Boston College staff as offensive line coach in 2007. Prior to his stop in Chestnut Hill, he served two years (2005-06) as the offensive line coach at the University of Delaware. In the 2006 season, Turner added the title of assistant head coach and recruiting coordinator for the Fightin’ Blue Hens. In the 2006 season, he helped tackle Mike Byrne earn All-Atlantic 10 honors as the Blue Hens were among the Division I-AA leaders in several offensive categories. The 2005 Delaware offensive line allowed only 13 sacks and Brian Sims earned second-team All-Atlantic 10 honors.
(from NFL.com)

So it seems Turner has no NFL experience but a pretty GOOD college resume. Also note he is a Sherman guy.

Oscar- unlike Tuner, the QB coach is a relative of Sherman who needed a job, no resume at all.

Philbin would endorse any idiot on the team.

Mando, you're an outsider to the team. The media will never get the straight goods. That's just not the way it's done anymore. We all understand this. By the tone in your blog, I wonder if you do.

When you ask a coach a question, it sounds like the teacher in Charlie Brown...

WHY, not go there Mando in regards to incognito, its hard to chat about someone YOU personally threw under the train, The Herald burned Incognito at the stake like a medieval witch hunter. And we're still reading about that damed investigation about a little boy who couldn't. Bye,,,,

Ireland and co need to be held accountable for nickel and diming jake Long. Just gave away a four time pro bowler for nothing over saving a couple of mill over a few seasons when the team has $20M+ in cap space going forward.

But he's not alone, I remember banging my head against a lot of you here over this same topic. You simply have to hang on to your best young players especially under the age of 30. I'm sure the franchise felt secure letting the man walk because the know it all fanbase had his back.

Why this franchise's fans like to pizz all over it's own players, I have no idea.

Major fail all around.

Why is it no matter what the blog subject is, some people keep complaining about T-hill and Wallace?

These guys are not the problem with this team.

Jake's cap hit this year is less than Clabo's.

I agree with FED UP @ 9:10...

Philbin obviously feels he is in a pretty scure position after recieveing the (dreaded) vote of confidence from Mr. Ross....along wth (I am sure) some pretty positive...if not outright ("your myn man Joe") private pat on the backs from the Owner....

I would cation Philbin this....Sporano was his "man" to...until he tried to sneak to California to hire Harbaugh...

Sporano was was "his man" even after that debacle....getting millions o dollars and years added to his "your my man" contract....

Philbin is now the HC following all that hub bub....

Philbin needs to take into account the circumstance of how he became the FINS current HC...and all Sporano did was LOSE football games....never once did he allow the FO to be embarrassed on such a level as this.....

So word of Advice Joe....

If your gonna be @ the head of an embarrassing scandal....You had better win about 10 football games along the way....

Kris, no matter what anyone says to the media about job security it means crap. They may as well answer the question about a coach like this ... "that cow is pretty fat" ... it holds the same water as "he's doing the a greaat job"

All that matters is wins and losses v expectations. And Philbin after this year will have burned up all goodwill. Starting next year, he will have to produce ... period.

There is also a Picnic Tables before you get to first light at Patrick Air Force base in Cocoa Beach,but the best breaking wave period on the East Coast of Florida is Sebastian Inlet.
The inlets in general are the best breaks in Florida.
The one at New Smyrna is good also as is Ft Pierce Inlet.
Canaveral Pier sucks for surfing relative to other spots like 1st and 2nd light at PAFB where their once was a pier but it was washed away and now it helps hold the sand in place on that beach break.

I don't disagree with that Mark...

but Philbin Rushing to tie himslef to Ireland last week...and the OL coach this week....not smart in my opinion....Philbin tried to present himself as some "above the fray" type of coach....and now we see he is as down and dirty as any other....and there is nothing wrong with that....just be who you are....

example:

Chad Johnson gets into altercation with a KNOWN physically violent..and mentally unstable "wife"/reality star...before the sun sets...Philbin CUTS him...and ended his career....

COGS molest (and that is putting it mildly) a woman @ a FIN SPONSORED event....and.....

he doesn't miss a game (FACT)....

If he was punished monitarily....the amount was kept seceret....

and PHILBIN was COMPLICIT in the cover up....

It sounds like I am decribing two differnt men...in how they handle discipline problems...but I am not...its the same coach....

and an INCOSISTENT COACH....coaches an INCONSISTENT TEAM (.500)

Please Armando, the reason both Long and Clabo do not rate as well with Turner is because they are mis-matched in the system. The Dolphins prior to Philbin and Atlanta played a traditional blocking scheme, not a zone blocking scheme. The Dolphins did a poor job of upgrading the OL talent to match the system. This falls on Jeff Ireland, whether trying to hang on this year and upgrade next or by picking whimps like Martin. Ireland has not provided the coaching staff with OL players that match the system.

Toronto, get off your high horse already.

You simply do not give a guy like Jake Long the kind of money he wanted. Has NOTHING to do with saving a few million.

Has all to do with finishing the 3 previous 3 seasons on IR. Period. End of story.

If you can't play, you don't deserve to get paid. For whatever reason, he stunk here his last 2 years anyway. And if I recall correctly, he was benched earlier this year for ineffectiveness.

Can't blame Philbin for backing his Oline coach. Can't really make the Oline coach the fall guy for what he has to work with either, unless he was heavily involved in picking some of those players. Let's face it, the personnel falls back on Ireland and Philbin again. They pick the players and the players suck.

So for Philbin to defend Ireland? Now THAT's a mistake.

Is anybody else enjoying Tom Brady's whining over not getting the pass interference call at the end of the Carolina game as much as I am?
It's called Karma,Tommy Boy. You finally get to be on the receiving end of a bad PI call after benefitting from so many.

I'd also like to point out that Jake Long was not the type o OL Philbin likes. Mobile, athletic, good in space.

Long was more of a mauler in the run game & abosrbe in pass protection. Long arms but, not very athletic. WHy overpay him to stay if he isn't a fit schematically?

People need to use some perspective & not metrics. You come off as a joke.

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