« About that voice mail again ... new information | Main | Sage Rosenfels: Ireland 'worst GM' »

Reports: Dolphins knew internally despite denials

Several new layers of the onion that is the Incognito-Martin-NFL review scandal are being peeled back by ProFootballTalk.com and Monday Morning Quarterback this morning. And believing the information in both items should make the Dolphins cry.

In PFT, Mike Florio reports "Dolphins general manager Jeff Ireland received a call from Martin’s agent, Rick Smith, before Martin left the team on October 28. Smith complained to Ireland about the manner in which Incognito was treating Martin.

"Ireland, according to the sources, suggested to Smith that Martin physically confront Incognito. Ireland specifically mentioned that Martin should “punch” Incognito."

In MMQB, Peter King had former Dolphins offensive lineman Lydon Murtha write a first-person account of what he saw in the Dolphins locker room of the relationship between Incognito and Martin and the rest of the organization. And he writes, in part, this:

"Incognito was made a scapegoat for the hell coming down on the Dolphins organization, which in turn said it knew nothing about any so-called hazing. That’s the most outlandish lie of this whole thing. The coaches know everything. The coaches know who’s getting picked on and in many cases call for that player to be singled out. Any type of denial on that side is ridiculous."

And taken on its face -- and if true -- this is truly problematic for Dolphins coaches and Ireland.

If the NFL Review, which began Wednesday, shows that one of Martin's agents alerted Ireland and thus the Dolphins that his client felt uncomfortable or harassed or bullied or upset in any fashion and the response from someone as high in the Dolphins command structure as Ireland was to simply suggest Martin "punch" Incognito, it shows a callous disregard for Martin's well-being.

If, as Murtha contends, coaches know everything, then we have a conspiracy on our hands.

And worse, we have a cover-up.

Consider that Dolphins coach Joe Philbin has said on numerous occasions the Dolphins didn't know anything about Martin's uncomfortable feelings regarding Incognito. Consider that on Sunday -- a full six days after Martin left the team and Philbin visited him at the hospital where he was seeking emotional help -- the Dolphins released a statement dismissing allegations of bullying as merely "speculation."

And yet ... these reports.

The Dolphins can only hope that context and full disclosure and facts over opinion all work on their behalf to overshadow this kind of information.

What do I mean by that?

Well, take the Florio report. Obviously there are only two people on that phone conversation between Ireland and Smith. And Ireland isn't talking to anyone per the Dolphins policy of not commenting during the ongoing NFL review and Smith is obviously the source.

And as Smith's agenda is to show cause on Martin's behalf, the information does exactly that.

But I cannot believe an agent calls an NFL GM and they talk about a topic so sensitive and the only theme coming out of the conversation is "punch" Incognito. Ireland would have to be an unserious goof for that to be true. (And he is not).

Perhaps he suggested Martin "punch" Incognito in passing. And perhaps after doing that, the phone call became more serious. We. Do. Not. Know.

One thing: Ireland has two autistic daughters. He knows what it is to have children who are singled out on a daily basis. I find it hard to believe he simply dismissed the idea that one of his players was being singled out in such a cavalier manner.

[Update: Florio, a friend who honors me by reading this blog, emailed me this morning when he saw this post. He writes in part: "The context was that Smith was complaining about Incognito and Ireland expressed confusion as to why this was an issue and said that Martin should go punch him."]

As to Murtha's contention that coaches knew. That is entirely possible. His saying it makes it sound probable. Yet, he does not know. The last time Murtha was in the Dolphins locker room was during the 2012 training camp. It's been fully 15 months since he's been around.

So he's speculating. As Peter King, who runs MMQB, is a good reporter, I assume he read Murtha's draft assertions and asked questions. And the question that begs asking is, "Which coaches know? Name names."

No one is named by Murtha. He paints the assertion with a wide brush stroke. And this investigation is going to require precision stenciling.

So we need specifics. We need more context. We need more information.

But if the allegations in these two reports are accurate, Ireland and the coaching staff are in a world of trouble.

 

 

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

Please.......I saw the interviews with the players last night and that's all I needed to see. Martin quit on his team because the NFL is not for him, the rest of this is just Martin trying to save face and keep part of his contract money. You guys in the media are fools.....all you say is, "I heard from sources close to the team" and then you think you can write whatever you want. Now, you bring in Murtha (who we cut) and now his words are the words of God? Just so you fellow Dolfans know, I live in Los Angeles and our local media thinks this is a huge joke. Our local reporters have made mention, on more then on occasion, that Armando makes up his sources. Enough of this garbage.....let Martin go live shame the rest of his life, bring Richie back, and let's make the damn playoffs

Jonathan Martin is a hero for exposing the abuse, extortion, and racism in his locker room. Somebody had to expose it for it to stop. The end result will be a better locker room united and bad apples like Incognito and Ireland gone. Philbin will be gone too he's not a bad apple... but a totally clueless HC.

And Florio......since apparently you read this blog......you're one of the biggest pieces of shytes on this planet. You're a little weasel and obviously a Dolphin hater. You must be revelling in this stuff. I know you love the spin the stories in any way you can to make the Dolphins look bad. This is dream come true for you.

I understand you're a lawyer by trade. Not surprised. You're everything that's wrong with this world. I won't be sorry when you get yours one day Florio.

Armando, I think you need to reconsider who some of your friends are. You can do far better than this weasel.

nice post mando. not sure why, but I enjoy your blog style over your articles. either way keep it coming. thanks.

Ireland should have been fired after the Dez Bryant incident. Go punch the player, is something that pathetic waste Bill Parcells would have said, figures Ireland would say the same. Philbin, the more I see and hear him, the more I dislike him. Can the NFL take this team from Ross?

thought the same thing Mark--just what we all need on this issue/story......the perspective of 2 women columnists--wonderful.

I can just see how it went down.
After all telling Martin's agent for Martin to punch Incognito is right in line with asking Dez Bryant if his mom was a prostitute.
Ahhh, the circus environment we are!
Looks like a script from South Park.

Craig, you catch what Ricky Williams said regarding this? He is probably the best person in the world to speak on the subject of not fitting in the NFL way ... he had some pretty damning things to say about martin and the route he took.

Ricky was truly unconventional but had honour the whole way...

Let's see, Oct 28, that was one day after we lost to NE. Was that the day that Martin left the Team? How long did that conversation occurred before Martin left the Team? Just backtracking here, trying to get some perspective in this complicated situation.

I'm not sure what we all need to hear on this, or HOW much more we need to hear.....the people whose opinions matter the most, the PLAYERS in that locker room, have spoken.....clearly.....right or wrong, like it or not--who are we all to judge? should we look into details of all of our work or personal life?--how about the work/personal life of all in the media, covering this?--or other coaches or players around the league?--are we all gonna like what we find?

Weird = queeer
Big weirdo = big quueer

Fine Suh 50K. Case closed.

Interesting news, but I will take it with a grain of salt until more is known. I'm so sick of all these Ditka and Dungy types saying that wasn't tolerated on theirt teams. Mcginnest and, Schlereth and all these other players turned analysts acting holier than thou. This is a non story and they know it. The only thing they have to run with is Cogs stupidly used the n word. Maybe this incident will teach him to take that word out of his vernacular. His own teammates who know him seem to be okay with him using it in a joking manner, but the guys that don't know him are killing him for it. Bottom line it's a hateful and controversial word and it's best to not use it. That is unless you truly are a racist, but judging by his teammates comments I don't think he is.

....I find it ironic that people will lambaste an opinion(on this issue) if it doesn't jive with their own. Yet site "I told you so" if an opinion comes out to support their view..Both ways.

For me..And I agree with DC..This is such a complex, and confusing I don't know what to call it..I'm done speaking on it. I got a bit ahead of myself, and should have listened to my original advice..To hear all the facts.

John....the "great Mike Ditka", as he's introduced on ESPN as, said the same thing....Iron Mike....

Blah, blah, blah. Do the Fins have a losing record? No? Then STFU until they do. All else is popcorn farts by a failing media desperate for attention or fodder for Ireland haters ecstatic over the Fins' national coverage.

Mark,


Did you see the Dolphin interviews on NFL network yesterday? They stood up like men and said to the media

"We are done with you pushing us around"

I was so proud to see Tanny and Hartline stand up like leaders do. Hell, Clabo has garnered new respect from me. Why do people want to make the assumption that when you say stand up for yourself like a man, they take that as "Martin punch him in the face" You can stand up for yourself with words. Like I said yesterday on the blog

"We might not have had leaders yesterday, but we do today"

Then today we have Armando's stupid friend Florio throwing more flames on the fire. Talking about how Martin's agent said that Ireland wanted Martin to punch Incognito. Doees this sound remotely plausible, thats far fetched for even Ireland haters to say.

Adam Beasley do you read this blog? I hope you do, cuz you sir are a complete azzclown bastid. I swear to god, I hope you shart yourself at the next press conference while wearing white pants. You have used this whole thing to move your carrer forward, trying to become famous. Guess what? It wont happen, your articles suck.

Why is Sage Rosentard chiming in now? When was the last time you were on this team? How did you last more than 1 season in the NFL. Thats right, because you rode the bench and collected NFL wellfare checks. You gingerfukk!!!

Tampa I hope you guys are ready to have your mouth s%^t in and have your real mothers slapped. I would say we will slap your dads too, but what are the chances many of the players on the team even know who their father is.... Im fired up...Its time for a PHINS RAMPAGE UP IN THE PIECE

Everyone should read this.


Richie Incognito's bully reputation goes back to 2002 - USA Today

www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/.../incognito.../3439819/‎

by Brent Schrotenboer

Another thing that's being overplayed in this story is Cogs past. He's admitted he's not a choir boy and was dirty in the past. But he knew the Fins was his last chance and according to teammates and coaches he hadn't been a problem. He has been characterized as a prankster however. And after Martin got demoted he was crying in his cereal and overreacted.

You guys ever wonder about these words coming out of Mando's mouth - "Sources close to the team say" Dude, we all can't stand Mando, but he has all of these sources telling him info? Mando has access to info that even Peter King can't get? Mando is a joke and so is the Herald. You want to shut this fool up......stop reading his articles


By the way, nothing wrong with Ireland telling Martin's agent that his player to stand up for himself 'by fighting back against Cogs'. This isn't tiddly-winks folks.

Posted by: Craig M | November 07, 2013 at 10:28 AM

Advocating violence in the work place is OK? One the field is one thing but, in house? Not that is was in question before but, you're a joke!

Dear oh Dear, what will you say when you're beloved b/f Ireland gets fired for this? Stock up on Kleenex now.

I see a Real Sports episode with Bryant Gumble coming

Martin. The first active NFL player to come out of the closet.

Jonathan Martin is a hero for exposing the abuse, extortion, and racism in his locker room. Somebody had to expose it for it to stop.

Posted by: Vazman | November 07, 2013 at 10:32 AM

Truly an idiot.

If Ireland did tell the agent that Martin should punch him the face......I THINK THAT'S AWESOME........hell make Ireland CEO.

Let's not forget the time Ireland called a fan an ahole because he asked him to fire himself.
Ireland should have listened to that fan. That fan was not an ahole, he was right on.
Free Ireland! From his contract. And free all of us from his disastrous reign as one of the most imcompetent GMs in NFL history.

Advocating violence in the workplace?! That's the business of the NFL! Oh lawwwd

Not only that, Armando said Florio reads his blogs. I HIGHLY doubt Florio is in here reading your sissy rant to him or any other incoherent drivel on this blog.

No wonder why you're blocked all over social media sites. Reading you is like torture. We see why they block you!

geez, what world are half you guys living in here?--this stuff surprises you, in the context of NFL players/coaches/execs?--you're surprised that some/most of them suggest handling this "like men", the old fashioned way?--hey, folks get in fist fights over parking spaces at the mall for gosh sakes!

Great opportunity for Mr. Ross to clean up the house, fire Philbin and Ireland and rebuild once and for all, it wouldn't bother me if the Dolphins get rid of the whole Roster, including that phony QB we have and Mike Wallace along the way.

"their workplace" is not like "our workplace"--stop trying to equate the two

Reporters keep saying Ireland and Philbin "knew", but never specify what exactly. If anything, they probably "knew" that Martin was getting as much as every other player on the Dolphins, or most other teams, get.

The more that comes out about this story, I'm reminded of the phrase, "there's no there there". But hey, "bullying" is latest cause de celeb, so let's not stop a profound narrative after it's picked up so much momentum.

So the Pats draft a guy who murders people and it's no flys on them, but we have a guy that leaves a voicemail message and it's "OH MY GOD SHUT DOWN THE ORGANIZATION"

dont you think "issues" like this are handled internally, in similar (or the suggested similar) fashion in the military?--police depts?--nhl locker rooms? (uh, they fight right on the ice....and the fans and players have said many times that they dont want that removed from the game)

Anyone on here who sides with Martin is a an idiot who will keep paying a ton of taxes in this country for all the people out there who are too lazy to work and too lazy to care


Advocating violence in the workplace?! That's the business of the NFL! Oh lawwwd

Posted by: Marc | November 07, 2013 at 10:45 AM

STOP BEING AN IDIOT!

On the field is Ok but, not in the locker room against your own teammates.

How about for legal reasons? Law suits? Insurance risk?

What if Martin & Cogs brawled in the locker room & others got involved or others hurt?

I swear to Christ. Some of you people should get your fukkin heads examined. YOU DON'T THINK! You advocate slugging people like it's a cool thing to do.

You blog like your macho when in fact, you're probably fat slobs with no guts to do what you're suggesting someone else do.

You think & blog like you're six years old. USe your brain for once in your pathetic lives!

Mark,

I did hear Ricky's comments. Very revealing. Like you, a huge Ricky fan!

And FYI,

Not that you're able to keep this on a non-personal basis, 'violence n the workplace'? You kidding me man? You part of the media or is this just part of your bias against Ireland?

If you're kid's getting picked on in school, do you hire a lawyer to deal with it or do you tell him 'to stand up for himself'. That's what Ireland did here. We don't KNOW he said 'punch Incognito in the face'. Stop taking everything so literally here and realize there's a lot of people with agendas at work here, including you.

Martin's a cream puff and it's clear he's had other people fighting his battles all his life. He's clearly not cut out for the NFL.

good strategy Ralph....I guess we'll just easily find 50 new players to just sign right up....we'll just "bring in a whole new roster"--that simple, huh?--small details like, uh, contracts to deal with.....where exactly are you gonna find a new/adequate mix of 50 guys to begin with?--why would you get rid of many of the players on the roster that are clearly good, in everybodys opinion?--but hey, thanks for bringing one more sensible suggetion

NO MORE IRELAND! NO MORE PHILBIN!

AHHHHH FYI.......the bleeding heart liberal.......it's called sticking up for yourself and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it......it's actually a good thing

Mando...I mean Oprah...Mando...I mean Dr. Phil...Mando...I mean The View.

Can you please report on the upcoming game on national TV Monday night? For god's sake!!

How come the Eagles havent come under such scrutiny, and have survived both the ugly Riley Cooper incident (dude didnt miss a beat....cathing TDs last week) and the Mike Vick signing/ordeal?

FYI,

Truly the big douche on the blog....

Can't discuss issues without getting into name-calling. Guess who?

Have a nice day d*ckhead....

FYI ...... I got in tons of fights in school ......... some I won and some I didn't ........ but I never backed down......never........as a man you just don't do that


If you're kid's getting picked on in school, do you hire a lawyer to deal with it or do you tell him 'to stand up for himself'. That's what Ireland did here. We don't KNOW he said 'punch Incognito in the face'. Stop taking everything so literally here and realize there's a lot of people with agendas at work here, including you.

Martin's a cream puff and it's clear he's had other people fighting his battles all his life. He's clearly not cut out for the NFL.

Posted by: Craig M | November 07, 2013 at 10:52 AM

Are you dense? I know Martin isn't cut for the nfl but, contemplate what you just wrote. Ignorance is bliss!

My kid would stand up for himself.

But, when I'm in charge of an organization where other people are at risk by my decisions, the LAST thing I do is get behind a violent altercation that impacts EVERYTHING in my orginization.

You must have a pea for a brain if that's how you REALLY think!

Trying to equate what's happening to kids on a street corner to what is happening inside a company filled with people dying to sue you is complete & utter ignorance.

Coming from you it is no surprise!

For the guys that are hear to DISCUSS football......

What do you guys see happening Monday? I don't see a big drop off from Cogs and Martin to Garner and Clabo. You guys?

I think this team will come together and I expect Tannehill will build on some of his good play from the last game. I'm expecting a big game from Wallace. Thoughts?

oohhh, easy there FYI....we dont want any offensive language on this blog.....or threats.....might lead to violence, or worse!---easy big fella.....easy there....now lets escort you out of the building, need to take a deep breath.....sing with me now.....koombaya my lord, koombaya....

FYI,

You must have missed it.....no interest talking to you....f*ck off......capiche?

Just FYI Bill Romo ended a teammates career by breaking his eye socket. Other players have done similar. Richie has never physically fought a teammate from what I've heard...


AHHHHH FYI.......the bleeding heart liberal.......it's called sticking up for yourself and there is absolutely nothing wrong with it......it's actually a good thing

Posted by: Silverback | November 07, 2013 at 10:53 AM

I'm as anti liberal as it gets douche. Stop thinking you're smart r know people.

The fact that you advocate a violent altercation inside a business shows how idiotic you are.

This isn't about kids fighting or name calling with no ramifications to it.

What happens inside a business or company is a LIABILITY & you put everything at risk.

You are obviously a low life with ZERO accomplishments in life to risk the health of you business by advocating a violent altercation.

It's not about red, white or black. It's about common friggin sense which you and Moron Craig have NONE of.

I cant believe how reactionary (terrible) Armando is...I thought yesterday was bad, but now this? give me a break man. everyone knows (who knows Fins football) that its been Incognitos & Pouncey's goal to "toughen Martin up"...hes LITTERALLY TALKED ABOUT IT. this is shocker to Mandy? good grief. this is your job? maybe hes trying out for ESPN, the official bashing network of the Miami Dolphins...I hope you get it...good riddance!
Go Fins

It's Thursday...no more talking about all this non-sense...

craig,
the BEST thing I saw on Thursday was the use of 6 OL...it was great. Tanne only needs 4 weapons...keep him up, he'll make the play.
im not worried.
I think the rest for Clabo was good...hopefull the mini-bye helps too.

FYI......your point is moot..........I understand you're talking about a professional organization, but it's an organization that sells violence. You win an NFL game by using violence...... no matter how you turn or spin it, you can't take violence out of the NFL mentality. By you're reasoning, when Martin gives up multiple sacks, he just ask the guy to stop coming so hard?

again, easy FYI.....relaaax....easy big guy (or little worm...oh, sorry)---we wont tolerate your offensive language or "bullying" (oh my gosh, no!) on this blog, ok--please refer to the Dolphins in Depth Manual for how to conduct yourself properly here....we NEVER offend people (unacceptabe).....no offensive language, bad behavior....shirts must be clean (ironed preferably)....easy big guy....we're sensitive here, and want "blog peace".....deep breath....

on that sweet crosser to Wallace, I THINK he was the only target...keep RT up, and we'll do fine.
I love Yeatman in there.
they TOTALLY abandoned it in the 2nd half...not sure why...maybe they know RI was hurt w neck and worried theyd loose their LAST OL by having them all out there...???

To get off the heated subject for a moment. Let's compare 2 players taken in the 2013 draft. This is evidence of the complete incompetence of Jeff Ireland.
First, the 3rd pick in the draft, Dion Jordan:
Tackles-10, Sacks-1, PassDef-2, ForcFumb-0
Now let's tack a look the 13th pick of the draft, Sheldon Richardson, of the hated NY Jets:
Tackles-41, Sacks-2.5, PassDef-1, ForcFum-1
As you can see Dion Jordan has been largely invisible while Richardson has been an impact player. And Ireland moved up to pick this guy!
I also rewatched the Phins-Bengals game and saw an alarming lack of effort by Jordan on a couple of plays. So far, Jordan is a complete bust seeing how he was picked 3rd overall.

Posted by: JUST FYI | November 07, 2013 at 10:51 AM

Why you half poster.
Someone needs to slap you and make your momma say ouch!

everyone keeps saying martin can't come because he quit on the team. wasn't ricky williams welcomed back with open arms?

"blog peace"....you guys think I can copyright that?

My moma will slap Incognito's face off...

Imagine the look on fat boys face when Martin actually brought the money...

...Craig M..I have said all week that I have a hard time thinking this team is going to play a very good game this week. Not to say we are going to lose. But there is no way that the players could have been completely focused for Tampa.

« 1 2 3 4 »

The comments to this entry are closed.