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Source: Dolphins did not know of harassment

A primary reason Dolphins owner Stephen Ross asked the NFL to investigate the harassment allegations leveled by Jonathan Martin against Richie Incognito -- aside from the fact he probably wouldn't know where to start his own investigation -- is he wanted accountability.

The Dolphins owner wanted to know if his coaches or their assistants or the personnel department was aware of the harassment and did nothing about it -- thus making those people complicit in the behavior.

And while the NFL investigtion will have final say on this matter, the Dolphins have done some self-scouting per se on the matter and a person familiar with the direction this is going tells me there is no hard evidence Dolphins personnel people or coaches knew Martin was under duress until after he left the team.

(And assuming that is true, which I now believe it is, the sound you are hearing is a lot of people within the organization feeling much more secure about their jobs).

Understand that we're talking about provable evidence here. We are talking phone texts or e-mails or voice mails that would prove someone was aware of Martin's problem with Incognito. There is apparently none of that.

The source would not go so far as to guarantee there was never a conversation or passing exchange that might remotely link the Dolphins to knowlege of the Incognito-Martin problem.

"I cannot guarantee that because no one knows every single word uttered in every single conversation that has ever taken place within or without the walls of the facility," the source said. "But as to hard evidence, we're comfortable. There's none."

This information, by the way, falls in line with what the Dolphins have pretty much been saying all alone. Coach Joe Philbin has said he was not aware of any harassment of Martin. Players have universally said they were not aware of any harassment. And on Monday, owner Stephen Ross said no one else in the organization knew of such behavior.

“I never heard that," Ross said. "Coach didn’t hear it, nobody heard that. I think you heard from the players, I have not heard that.”

Obviously, this has legal as well as league ramifications. Aside from pointing away from Dolphins personnel under fire, this could also relieve the Dolphins of some but not all responsibility in a workplace violence or harassment suit by Martin. Lawyers tell me Martin doesn't need to prove the Dolphins knew to bring a suit but the team's liability would be lessened.

But here's the thing that still looks bad as a result of this: Apparently nobody on the Dolphins knew anything.

A prominent member of the organization (the starting left tackle) claims he was being harassed by at least one other prominent member of the organization (the starting left guard and a member of the leadership council) and nobody seemed to notice.

Not the head coach.

Not any of his assistants.

No one in personnel.

Not the trainers or equipment managers or anyone else.

Yes, that suggests a disconnect. And that is not good.

But I'm thinking the Dolphins will happily take that because the alternative is much, much worse.

 

Comments

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Who cares? It's Ireland's fault that that either one of these losers were Dolphins in the first place.

This story has just become a long drawn out gong show that should have been discarded already. Just release both these guys and move on. We all know Incognito bullied Martin and that Martin doesnt wish to ever return to the Dolphins. So its time the team just moves on from both these guys and start anew. I mean really. Were these two even difference makers on what was the worst offensive line in team history.

Mando, I don't really see what difference this makes ?

If Philbin was as unaware of his locker room as this suggests then ignorance is no excuse.

He states he takes his locker room work environment seriously ? Where is the evidence of this ? A good lawyer will wipe the floor with his avoidance strategy.

When he is up there on the stand you can't get away with not answering the question, its yes or no and factrs only.

The off field issues are bad enough, but its his coaching and lack of leadership that have given me reason to want him out.

No playoffs and he is gone. A new GM will do that anyway, he isn't worth keeping.

"A prominent member of the organization (the starting left tackle) claims he was being harassed by at least one other prominent member of the organization (the starting left guard and a member of the leadership council) and nobody seemed to notice.

Not the head coach.

Not any of his assistants.

No one in personnel.

Not the trainers or equipment managers or anyone else.

Yes, that suggests a disconnect. And that is not good."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Or, it could mean that Martin has issues that run beneath the surface and no one was aware of them. It's quiet possible that there was no signs for anyone to see.

Maybe the reason no one notice that something was going on is because nothing was going on.

As a fan since the inaugural season, the past decade as a FinFan sickens me. The same blatant dumbfounding errors being made over and over again. And now, this stupid ridiculous mess that never should of happened in the first place, for a bunch of reasons.

I could care less what direction Armando takes his articles. I've come to believe Mando's column is honest, accurate, my now my primary source to find out what the heck is going on with this team and I'm thankful he put's his sack on the line day-in, day-out. Props to you, AS.

There was no harassment, just a guy in Martin who isn't able to cope with the real world. I don't like Jeff Ireland, but it's a shame that Philbin's chance at being a longtime NFL coach may get buried because of this flake's wild accusations. Martin is a freak.

Armando always takes the negative view, the view most against the team.

He says it looks bad that nobody knew. Well that is one legitimate take. The other legitimate take is Martin freaked out used the bullying excuse not realizing it would catch fire.

Mando, you seem to be on the case now too > I think you have seen enough now.

Off field issues aside Philbin has not been good enough to coach, lead or control this team.

Losing to 0-8 Bucs with the season on the line means together with the rest of his mistakes means we are years away from building a winner under Philbin.

Philbin would have been involved in the drafting of the players no doubt.

Unless some truly serious event took place, this story was far overblown from the get go. Once the media goes crazy it amplifies everything well beyond what it is.

The public are always the suckers, they tend to believe the bigger the print, the bigger the story...and don't stop to think about much else.

People, including Armando, are oblivious to a very real possibility ... Jonathan Martin had emotional issues that lay dormant as his behavior did nothing to make anyone notice there was a problem. Then one day, he had had enough and lost it, walking out and initiating this whole chain of events. If not now, he may very well have melted down at some point in the future. It happens. It's not like everyone who has a nervous breakdown leaves an obvious trail. Hell, people even kill themselves sometimes and you often hear people close to them say they had no idea they were in a position to take their own life. Why is no one considering that Jonathan Martin had a very sudden and unexpected/unforeseeable emotional breakdown?

They should have known they had a problem on their hands when they observed him sitting down to pee. He wears one more pad than the other players.

CLASSIC Doug - that was funny!
HWayne sold this franchise's soul to the Devil (Jimmie Johnson) 15 years ago & we've been a joke since. One thing after another. Don't be mistaken here fellow fans...Ross did not bring Shu, Marino, Taylor, Dungy & that group together to advise him on the direction of the Dolphins - AS 'SHOULD BE' THE CASE....he simply brought them in as ethics advisors for addressing the lockeroom/atmosphere issues. He needs to ASK Coach Shu what direction HE believes the team should go with their next GM & maybe HC - but he won't & we'll continue to wallow in irrelevance.

Found this on another post..

No small coincidence that Martins Mom is an attorney who specializes in workplace harassment and discrimination. She used to write a regular article for US Today on this very subject. So he listens to Mommy, lets his teammate's career get hammered, and lets his team down. What a great teammate and person he is. Why didn't he do what one of the Bronco's starting O-Lineman did this year? Can't remember his name, but 5 games into this season he quit! He didn't blame anyone, other than himself. Walked away from a $1 M/year salary because he said he didn't enjoy football anymore and wanted to do something else. That guy at least didn't take the ship down with him.

Read more here: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/2013/11/drafting-jonathan-martin-was-a-consensus-decision.html#storylink=cpy

Martin is a whiny little baby. This whole thing is RIDICULOUS! This is pro football for gods sake. It's not the Girl Scouts. And Martin was never physically attacked. So who cares! Some words? Cog said some mean things? Big deal! Who the hell cares. Grow a set. #teamincognito

Well, Monte and Zonk are going to be crushed to tears. Let's support them in their time of grief.

This means Irish isn't going anywhere.

This organization is a joke the laughingstock of America tthe soft&cuddly dolphins and their stupid hillbilly 1970's fight song !! This franchise is and has been irrelevant since 1985 !! Hasn't drafted well since 1977 a joke a place where players either come to enjoy the night life or come to retire !! A fanbase who are ignorant&delusional a fanbase that every year vows they're team is or better than the pats. Yet they're not only looking up at the pats (the norm) but are not only looking up at the jets, but couldn't even beat the lowly bills at home so sad it's not even laughingstock !! A franchise that rather have gutless goody goody guys than ballers !! A pathetic stoic head coach (clueless joe) who needs his victory speeches scripted on a cue card and a woman leading him by the hand. And a gm who thinks he's R.Wolfe, yet he can't for S**T and he mocks players and overpays for mediocrity yes folks these are your Miami Dolphins in a nut shell America's greatest reality show, so pathetic you can't make this stuff up !!

New reports coming out that Soliai wet his pants at practice and apparently two other lineman laughed at him. They were suspended and now Soliai is filing a harassment charge.

One man's harassment is another's tough love- and Wells might see it from Martin's standpoint.

It's still in the can-of-worms stage so the Dolphins shouldn't get too comfortable.

If what Armando claims to be true, then this is what I said all along. This is Martin issue and not with Richie!!! He has personal issues and is taking down the credibility of this franchise and the people who work hard. Say what you want about Philbin or Ireland, neither one deserves this. Locker room culture and teammates ribbing has been going on for decades, and for the media to put Richie and organization hostage before knowing all the facts is a microcosm for today's media!!!!

For all the flaws on the field this team still has a chance to make a good season!!

Many fans already feel this way, but I have to say if the Dolphins onfield struggles were not so dumbfounding, their off field issues could be written off as an overreaction by Martin. But Martin's accusations do translate on to the field. The oline has been out of sync, with no harmony and communication. There is leadership issues, otherwise, why are they so unprepared to play after long layoffs. How come the coach is constantly frustrated with their energy level at practice, (are they tired from partying the night before?) We read article after article about disconnect between players and player personnel on decisions. Where there is smoke, there is fire.

This whole thing is an episode of "as the world turns".....as Armando quickly runs and scrambles to the other side of the story....gotta mend some fences now....

Just ONE BLOG ago you were all for the scorched earth policy when it comes to the FINS FO.....

I'll man up for you Armando....and hold ground.....

Not knowing is JUST AS BAD as knowing....and a case can be made that it is even worse....you have attempted to make that case on here (wish I had a blue link)....and here (another blue link).....

So stand down if you must Armando.....some of us will hold the forte.....the fact that it got to this level should be grounds enough....

One more thing Armando.....

If you got nothing "new" to really write about....

Can you write about the game....

It's FRIDAY already.....

I really think Ross is in a coma. There is a disconect between what he says and reality. He's a nightmare owner from a fans perspective.

Both Martin and Cognito will bring lawsuits.

Nobody knew because there was no harassment. It's just a case of a guy who flaked out because he couldn't handle the pressure. Jonathan Martin should be embarrassed to show his face in public which might explain why we've seen neither hide nor hair of him since he went AWOL.

Go get him Kris!

If, as someone mentioned earlier, Huizenga sold the Dolphins sole for Jimmy Johnson, Salguero sold his own sole for clicks on a blog.

Armando's legacy will be that he had the most clicks on articles in South Florida*

* Clicks are defined as number of page views, non unique, of which more than two thirds are people refreshing the page to look at responses to their own posts, people posting under multiple names, and single posters posting dozens if not hundreds of times. Things in your rear view mirror are larger than they appear. If you should have an errect1on for more than 4 hours, call a doctor.

It was quite obvious to me that Martin was setting the dolphins up for a lawsuit. Mommy is a trial lawyer. duh.

There was definitely harrassment. Along with extortion and racism. The NFL investigators will uncover the real facts. Shula or Marino asking questions is meaningless. Martins lawyers know his case is solid.

Mando, Mando, Oprah, Oprah, Oprah, Mando.......man you got one non-football related story to 'report on' and you just can't let it go. Wake me when you are ready to discuss....you know....the do or die game taking place in 2 days.

Armando, find out how much hush money Ross is offering Martin.

Agree AJ unless we here something different from the Wells Talk with Martin today I suspect and always did that Martin didn't want to move to the right side.

When is Ireland speaking on this matter? He is the GM isnt he?

Of course the self-investigation within the Phins will "conclude" they did not know anything ;-)
LOL. This organization for whatever reason decided to be tight lip before this mess even tho Ross himself said he wanted more transparency early in the season.

Ross please do not do it for us, do it for you to protect your investment and fire everybody, and yes that includes secret master, Aponte, and start with a clean slate. Like many have said willful ignorance is insulting everybody's intelligence. Countless players and ex players have said all the locker staff is well known by the coaches but they defer to the players as to how to lead in there UNLESS say you learn picks someone like Cogs to "lead" the locker. Duh!!!!!!!

Wow! It's not what you know it's what you can prove! So the Dolphins entire organization from the players to the upper management are playing the 'CYA' game. Cover your you know what. A good way to go in limiting liability. When everyone is complicit just indicate ignorance. LOL

Martin's real objective is to be released, become a free agent and get paid....I'm a Dolphin fan but this organization has no class if your article is true Armando. That said it's just a business so limiting liability is applied.

Of course the self-investigation within the Phins will "conclude" they did not know anything ;-)

The Tale of Two offensive lineman continues.One of them is being vilified for being too offensive and the other for not being offensive enough.
The remedy for some posters on this board is to get rid of the offensive lineman loving GM and start the aquisition process of MORE OFFENSIVE LINEMAN high in the draft and in free agency.I disagree completely they should get replacements off course but NOT as High draft picks and NOT with prior emotional problems,just middle of the road offensive lineman that can blend in to a team atmosphere.
It dosent matter to me that Parcells drafted Long as the number 1 pick in the draft,that was a mistake unless thats the way you want to set up the teams budget that is to pay that type of money to offensive lineman.The skill players and impact players are still the ones that should command the top dollars they are the ones that directly impact the score of the game and that will never change unless the rules of the game completely change.
Every offseason in todays free agency and draft, NFL the teams will have to constantly be in the market to upgrade their skill and impact players because some of them just wont fit in to the prospective franchises systems or plans.A couple of examples Bush and Marshall.

cant wait for jan

So Philbin and Ireland are clear of any wrong doing.

Incognito is handling this the right way by having "The Union" file a grievance with the league and should be reinstated in a couple weeks.

The Fins need to win on Sunday in order to keep pace.

Can someone please explain why we only play the Jets Once this season.

Once again I say " Martin wanted out and that's it" Nothing more to say. Mando and the rest of the media are hell bent on writing this story and forgetting about Incognito's side of it. FREE RICHIE!

Icognito's a JACKASS!! He'll never play another down n the NFL. All the top coaches including Shula said they'd never have him on their team.

That's because, ladies and gentlemen, there was no harrassment. Just a lost, pathetic 340 pound little boy.

dashi u drunk again? we play the jets twice like always, 2 more losses

steve shulas not a top coach in nfl, hes a fat old man who forgets what day it is

Didnt the Jets just get Ed Reed?

Posted by: Dashi | November 15, 2013 at 08:14 AM

Any team would be able to look after the weakest members of that unit.

Philbin hasn't managed that locker room or created the culture where players look after each other.

His playcalling, coaching and man management are not good enough.

11-14 is also not good enough. If I had seen him getting the most out of his team, like Ryan then you could out forward an arguement for them staying.

No doubt Cogs is a loud mouth prankster that crosses over the line, and at times is probably a jackass. We all know people
Ike that, but that's no excuse for walking out on your team and dropping a bomb on the locker room. Not to mention ruining people's careers. Any team would be foolish to even let Martin come for a visit. Somebody may joke around with him causing a media circus. This guy should have told Cogs ENOUGH! Not funny anymore. That's if it was really that bad to start with. The team may end up with bigger legal problems with Incognito. They jumped the gun and took the p.c. Route without due process or gathering facts.

it will all be over soon fellas, 4-12 to end year and we clean house. jan will be a great moth, finally beheading ireland

Playoffs? We will be real lucky to finish 6-10 or 7-9 again. The draft and free agency has done absolutely nothing to improve this team,again! And now this soap opera,wtf? Martin was mediocre at both left or right tackle and signing McKinney was the last straw for him. That is the only reason that he walked and I can't ever see him on another team in the NFL,ever!

Dolphins have become an immature classless, unprofessional group of players.

Philbin has created this by his lack of awareness as to what goes on in his locker. At this stage in the game I've seen enough. There are other coaches or co-ordinators out there that could have us in a winning position with the talent we have on this team

Wallace just hasn't become bad for no reason, same with Wake, Jordan, Pouncey Ellerbe, Wheeler, Jones and other members of the team.

When your players leave and go on to other clubs and continually play better Philbin has massive weaknesses throughout his time here.

Ross do the right thing and go find a man to coach this lead this team.

If these scrubs go 7-9 they'll throw a parade lol

Armando : When are you going to eat crow & admit that you were wrong? Anybody familiar with Joe Philbin as a person & head coach knows that he would NEVER knowingly allow harassment or bullying on his team.

Dashi,what are you saying,we ony play the Jets one time this year? We play them in New York in three weeks and then again at home the last game of he season.

The Chargers have a pretty good offense again. At least the passing attack.

The Fins still can't cover a TE and the one guy who can cover a TE doesn't see the field as a LB. They want to play him at DE even though he still isn't big enough to set the edge as a DE against the Run.

If you spend a #3 Overall Pick on the Best Defensive Prospect in the Draft, you make sure that player is the focal point of your defense. D.Jordan should be a 3 Down player that brings pressure from different positions. Play DJ at OLB on 1st and 2nd, then move him to DE for 3rd Down. If the other team has a Game changing TE, put DJ on them. DJ is one of only a handful of defensive players that can Cover Gronk or J.Graham 1 on 1.

Hopefully the Fins are just bringing DJ back slowly to make sure he doesn't re-injure his shoulder this season.

That or Doyle needs to watch some JT tapes or L.Taylor tapes to see how to properly use D.Jordan. Doyle needs to watch how D.Thomas use to play or how the Ravens use T.Suggs.

Same thing with Cam Wake. Wake is not being used properly. Wake can be moved from side to side to create a mismatch in Wakes favor from time to time. Plus it forces an Offense to constantly adjust.

ross wont go find him, the new gm will

rick has armando ever gotta anything correct on here?? hes just here for shock value nothing more

problem is dashi jordan cant hold any of those guys jocks u mentioned

Nobody approached him. Nobody cared. That is the maximum expression of abuse. Isolation. That makes a Person a non-person.

Dashi, arent you going to school today?

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