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Pat Shine makes great catch in Marlins' win Saturday

SAN FRANCISCO -- For hours at a time -- from the first pitch to the final out -- he sits inside the clubhouse staring at a video monitor that is divided up into 15 screens showing the field from different angles.

Few people outside of the team know his name.

But after the Marlins defeated the Giants late Saturday, Pat Shine was given the game ball.

“In my mind,” said winning pitcher Tom Koehler, who turned in seven scoreless innings in the 5-0 win, “Pat Shine won the game today. What he did was unbelievable.”

What Shine did was spot the Giants’ Brandon Hicks failing to touch first base while on his way to second after hitting a ball off the wall in the second inning.

Shine immediately phoned the dugout to alert manager Mike Redmond, who challenged the play under baseball’s new replay rules. After the reviewing the replays, the umps overturned the call. Hicks was out.

Had Shine not noticed and Hicks was allowed to stay where he was, the Giants would have had runners at second and third with one out. Instead, Hicks became the second out and Koehler finished off the inning by retiring the Giants’ next hitter.

“It takes guts to call down there and say you guys need to challenge this, because if he’s wrong, you lose your challenge in the second inning of the game,” Koehler said. “He’s been spot on all year with them.”
Chimed in pitcher Jacob Turner: “He’s the best in the league.”

Shine is like having an extra set of eyes. No one else on the Marlins noticed Hicks miss the bag. Redmond said he and the coaches were following the flight of the ball to see if it hit fair or foul.

The Marlins have been successful with eight of their nine replay challenges this season.

Koehler said that Shine examines every base hit, making sure that not only the batters touch every base, but every runner ahead of him does as well.

“That aspect of the game, in my opinion, is just as important as the on-field stuff,” Koehler said. “If you have a chance to overturn a call and get an out...it’s like having a lefty specialist coming out of the bullpen.”

By team rule, Shine -- who was hired late in spring training as an administrative coach in charge of reviewing plays -- is not allowed to talk to the media.
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Giancarlo Stanton was given a day off on Sunday, something Redmond has been wanting to do to give his slugger a breather.
Stanton had started every game until Sunday.
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Comments

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Alex

I wilol admit that I'm a Redmond hater. Not only do I dislike the way he manages the bullpen, but I don't think this guy manages this team like he's in a PENNANT RACE. I mean the team is a half game out of first place, not because they have played so well, but because the rest of the division hasn't played great either. So what does he do today? HE GIVES STANTON A DAY OFF. WHY? The whole team will have a day off tomorrow! The kid is HOT. He is 24 years old; and he does NOT look tired.

I'll tell you why I believe Redmond makes these kind of crazy moves. Because LORIA DOESN'T WANT TO HAVE SPEND ANY MONEY AT THE TRADING DEADLINE, THAT'S WHY. If the team is still within a few games of a playoff spot, the pressure to IMPROVE THE TEAM at the deadline, like ALL CONTENDING TEAMS DO, will be on Loria. And with attendance in the toilet, he does not want to do that.

Redmond just wants to not lose 100 games this year. If the team finishes at .500 he will get credit for a great job. So why get crazy and actually TRY TO WIN SOMETHING?

Alex

Of course I hope I'm wrong about Red. And about Dunn too. Cause that would be good for the team. Of course that would be bad for my IMAGE over here as a great baseball EXPERT, LOL!!! Because as we all know, guys who really know baseball are NEVER WRONG ABOUT ANYTHING. That's why every guy they pick in the draft becomes a STAR, and every kid they sign to a contract makes it to the majors.

MDX

Wow, it only took one inning for Turner to lose the game.

Alex

Yeah, Turner looks really bad, MDX. Of course it's still EARLY and this team has been hitting well and really battling back this year. Then again, with Stanton RESTING the chances of a comeback are not that good. But hey, Red don't care. So what, they lose a game here, a game there. If this team was really a contender it might matter, but...

Hey Flav, I don't know about Turner. He seemed to be getting a bit better, then THIS. I should have known when I saw him lick his lips and gulp in fear...LOL...hey I better stop. After all, no one has brought up "my past transgressions". Well, that's not true. HE DID bring them up. Well played by him, don't you think? LOL...

Cleveland Spider

Turner stinks! They need to get him out of the starting rotation. I hope this is his last start. I would rather have Wolf in the rotation or to bring up one of the youngsters. Anything would be better than Turner.

Heaney is ready to come up. Why not bring up the kid? With Fernandez out for the year the time is now for Heaney. The Marlins are only a half game out of the division. The time is now.

Cleveland Spider

I don't know what Redmon is doing? He gives Stanton the day off but then also gets one of his big bats out when he puts Mathis in for Salty. That makes no sense. If you are going to keep Stanton out of the line up then make sure you have your best hitters in there to pick up the slack.

BTW- Redmon cost Turner an out in the first inning. Blanco was clearly out on that stolen base and he did not come in to challenge it. You wonder what the score would be if Redmon had come out and challenged that play. Shortly after that play the Giants scored 3 runs.

Cleveland Spider

I knew we were going to lose this game. Anytime he is on the mound you are sure to see a loss. To make matters worse Redmon pulls out his two best hitters out of the line up. It is almost like Redmon was content with the split and was just willing to throw this game away.

Lou Vales

Many managers do this crazy stuff with resting 24 year old kids even in San Francisco where nobody is going to be sacked by the humidity.
I don't like to cpme on here and say something was DUMB unless I said it at the time it occurred. Well, I did. In the 5th inning with 1st and 2nd and 1 out I "believe" he had to pinch hit for Turner and not give up an out with Turner bunting. You're down by 3 with a great bullpen waiting to close you out so how can you give up a chance when you don't know how many chances you will get. There is the FAMOUS off day tomorrow so had had ample ammo in his own pen to roll the dice. Of course Turner immediately gives up a bomb in top of the 5th to make it 4-0. I thought it was crazy BEFORE it happened.

Alex

In some ways I think it's a VERY GOOD THING that Stanton was given the day off. That way all those who have been so anxious to get rid of Stanton could take a good look at what this team looks like without him. He is the ONLY guy in this line up that puts any fear at all in opposing pitchers, and the entire line up benefits when he's in there. But hey, there are some Marlins fans who have been trying to get rid of him for YEARS. Well, pretty soon I believe they will get their wish. If Stanton continues with his monster year, he will be eligible for at least 12 million dollars in arbitration next year. NO WAY will Triple Chinned Jeffrey pay that kind of money (although he stupidly paid 9 million a year for 3 years to Heath Bell!) for Stanton, so expect him to trade The Big Guy. Then all the Stanton haters will finally get their wish. Who knows? Maybe they can still get Mark Teahen!

Cleveland Spider

Ozuna needs to be sent down to the minors. I really liked him coming into this year but he has been awful. It is time to give another kid a shot. It does not look like he has a plan when he comes to the plate. Pitchers have figured him out.

I hope that this was Turner's last start of the year. I have seen enough of him.

Lou Vales

Alex, I just recently returned to this Forum so I hope you are wrong about anyone hating Stanton. That would be pretty silly. I can honestly say I hate nobody associated with the Marlins although I do have a strong and onerous dislike for Mr. Rehab. I don't know, I just have this gut feeling that Mr Rehab wanted a nice easy year and pick up some pocket change.Where is he now? Greensboro, Jupiter, Jacksonville, New Orleans or pool side at the The Clevelander?

Alex

"It is almost like Redmon was content with the split and was just willing to throw this game away." - Cleveland Spider

Cleveland Spider, BINGO! If a Mets or Yankees or Red Sox manager was "content" with a split the fans would go BALLISTIC on talk radio, etc. He's managing as if the team is 15 games out and it's mid September. A manager who REALLY BELIEVES that he has a team that can actually MAKE THE PLAYOFFS would not be conceding any games at all, not even in April or May. A manager who REALLY BELIEVES that he has a team that can actually MAKE THE PLAYOFFS would be trying to win every single game he can, not experimenting around by bringing in Marmol or Slowey in tie games or giving his best hitter days off BEFORE a day off as if the guy is Derek Jeter. A manager who really believes he can win would be managing every game as if that game WAS IMPORTANT, because you know what? They ARE important. But he is CONTENT to just basically give this game to the Giants and go back home a game and a half out of first place.

The reason I believe he is managing this way is because of Fat Boy Loria. Remember 2008 & 2009? The Fish were in playoff contention BOTH years and he did NOTHING at the Trade Deadline. His EXCUSE back then was he was saving his money for when they move into the new stadium. Well, he doesn't have that excuse this year. This year Loria's excuse is the poor attendance, so why should he spend money at the Trading Deadline? Redmond's job is safe as long as he doesn't lose 100 games, so he's not going to go all out to win. Especially if the owner won't try to get some help at the Deadline, the way all contenders do.

This team is going to have to win IN SPITE of the owner & manager. Sorry, but I just don't see that happening.

Lou Vales

Alex, Leyland used to pull crap like this constantly and they WERE playing for something. Ripken's streak would have ended at 88 games if Senor Smokes(Marlboros)had been managing him.

The WORST thing remains Turner being allowed to bat in the 5th.

Alex

"I don't like to cpme on here and say something was DUMB unless I said it at the time it occurred. Well, I did. In the 5th inning with 1st and 2nd and 1 out I "believe" he had to pinch hit for Turner and not give up an out with Turner bunting. You're down by 3 with a great bullpen waiting to close you out so how can you give up a chance when you don't know how many chances you will get. There is the FAMOUS off day tomorrow so had had ample ammo in his own pen to roll the dice. Of course Turner immediately gives up a bomb in top of the 5th to make it 4-0. I thought it was crazy BEFORE it happened". - Lou Vales

You are 100% right of course, but it's WORSE than DUMB, Lou. Dumb is trying to win, but doing something stupid. Putting this line up out there and not pinch hitting for Turner in that spot was a sign that he DOESN'T CARE IF THEY LOSE THIS GAME. Like Cleveland Spider said, he's CONTENT to go home with a split and a 4-7 road trip. The only way this team wins is if THE PLAYERS win DESPITE the manager and the owner.

Lou Vales

IF he does not hit Stanton for Lucas, then there should have been an investigation. All I want done is the OBVIOUS. Many things are open to debate. The Top of the 5th and Stanton hitting for Lucas were not debateable.I like the way they fight back. I respect that. They must really be aware they have been burdened with more than one albatross--and that ain't fair.

Lou Vales

It's hard to quantify this but he has the same deer in the headlights look as Fredo in Atlanta. He just does not look like he is capable of engendering respect. I never liked McKeon because I believed his to be a Pitcher Wrecker but I knew they played for him. They are always talking about the proverbial "foxhole" and I just can't see many guys not moving to the far end of the hole to be away from Red. Sciosia, Gardenhire, Girardi, Showwalter and a host of others would have guys spilling their being. Do you guys see that with Redmond?? Honestly??

Alex

"Alex, I just recently returned to this Forum so I hope you are wrong about anyone hating Stanton."

Lou, there are some Marlins fans that have wanted Stanton traded for YEARS. And I'm not talking specifically about guys on THIS forum, although if the shoe fits, wear it. There are guys that have said "trade Stanton" publicly many times over the years.

And Lou, there's nothing wrong with being a Stanton hater. Everyone is ENTITLED to their opinion. Just because I say someone is a Stanton hater based on what they have said over the years, doesn't mean I am ATTACKING THEM, either. Like I said, I admit to being a Dunn hater. So what? Everyone is ENTITLED to their opinion!

Guys take themselves WAY TOO SERIOUSLY on the internet. Like their "IMAGE" on some website is so important. Some guys you can't say ANYTHING to, unless it's to stroke them and tell them how much you agree with them, and how wonderful their baseball knowledge is. Gimme a break with that. There are no REAL "experts" here, just Marlins fans trying to enjoy themselves.

Alex

The umpires continue to SCREW THE MARLINS every chance they get. Look how many plays have been overturned by replay; thank GOD for that! But on balls & strikes they still shaft the Fish, like they did today, and also on other plays that are not reviewable.

My theory on why that happens? It's because the umpires, like EVERYBODY in baseball, have NO RESPECT for this Franchise. The fire sales, the CHEAPNESS, the smug look on Loria's face..it all adds up.

Lou Vales

Girardi thought it was beneath him to dispute calls and Redmond probably does not think he is allowed. You don't need to get tossed all the time but just show your players you have their backs. Does wonders.

Stan M

How can anyone understand Redmond/s moves. First he rests Stanton with a day off following and facing a critical game. If anything, Hech, who has also played every game, should be rested. Then in a possible game changing situation, he lets the pitcher hit in an obvious pinch hitting situation with Stanton available. One can't blame Redmond for not realizing that a base runner was out, but the video man who looked do good yesterday, sure blew one today.

Flav C.

How can Redmond rest Stanton? How dare him? Here I am, from the comfort of my couch with a beer can in my hand, remote control by my side....and no Stanton? Shame on you Redmond!!! My veteran eyes, even after watching baseball for what...30-40 years (maybe more) tell me Stanton is not tired! And I know this much better than any physical trainer, coach, or manager.

It doesn't matter the big guy is all banged up from smashing onto the wall a few times in this road trip, or fouling balls in his left foot. For all I care he is big and probably bionic. Later on, he will go to the DL and I will be the first one to say "he is injury-prone".

Oh wait....Salty is also out? How so? Wasn't it the other day he was 0-for-forever and I wanted him out? Who cares if starting 35 games in the first 40 is the most he has played in his whole career, at this point in the season? Let him play!!

Let's those guys play! Who cares if there will be 9 games in a row, including a few with very little rest between one day and the next.

What? Jose Abreu just hit the DL with tendinitis in his left ankle, possibly because of too much playing time? What does it have to do with my favorite players? Abreu is not bionic and super-human like Stanton...That's why!

Lou Vales

I'm sure one AB in the 5th would mot have set him back. How did Ripken, Fielder--ROTFLMAO---, Minoso, Trammel, Kaline and the myriad number of guys play 154 to 162 games. I wanted one BLANKING AB!!!!!!! in the 5th inning in 60 degree temps and no humidity. I would have chanced him not tearing a hamstring or a patella tendon.

MDX

Turner just doesn't have it, time to bring Heaney and see if there's something there.

Lou Vales

I didn't mention---guess I did---that the off day was a "decision" , the NON AB in the 5th with a bunch of power arms in the pen and a starter looking sharp was NOT a decision unless you wish to call General Custer's excursion into those hills a "decision", there are decisions and there are "Random Acts of Redmond" or the "S" word if you wish to use it.

Lou Vales

Flav, IF you had been managing Mays, Mantle , Williams, Griffey in their PRIMES and you had opted to give them a day off, would you have adjusted in the 5th inning of a 4-1 game and let them have one AB?? ONE!!

Flav C.

Lou,
Stanton had an opportunity to hit later in the game, with runners on base. It wasn't the 5th, as you wished, but still meant scoring some runs. Guess it didn't work out. But maybe, maybe, maybe...the 5th inning was the charm!

Lou Vales

IF you were intent on resting him, it would have made the most sense to hot him EARLY with 2 on and I out as opposed to hoping you would have a similar chance later with a much fresher arm going against him.

Stan M

Let's examine this situation about Stanton:
*Has he shown signs of fatigue? No
*Has his performance been sub par recently? N0
*Is there a chance for rest in the future? Yes very next day off
*Does Stanton enjoy playing on the West cost? Yes
*Does Stanton play a position that is particularly tiring? No
*Is the weather inclement? No
*Could he be given Tuesday off to make it 2 consecutive days off? Yes
*Was his playing against SF more important than against the weaker Phillies? Yes
*After losing the team's other star, was this possibly not the right time to remove the offensive leader? Yes
*Is there any other player who hasn't missed a day? Yes Hech
*Does this player play a more taxing position? Yes
*Would the team miss this player as much as Stanton? No
*Was the wrong player given this day off? Yup

richie

First inning, Giants runner attempted stealing 2nd base. TV broadcast replay showed runner was tagged on lower leg before hand touched the base, but, ruled safe by the umpire. Everybody watching on TV anticipated a challenge from Redmond. It never came and Rich and Tommy didn't discuss it anymore. What is up with that? On Saturday Mr. Shines did "Shine" but on Sunday it seems that Mr. Shines was merely a "Smudge". There was no challenge on the play. The Giant ended up scoring 3 runs in the first inning when they would have scored zero runs had the play been challenged.

Flav C.

Sorry Stan,

You are not the manager, nor the physical trainer so your opinion about Stanton needing a day off or not is simply based on conjectural information. I prefer to base my opinion not on how things "seem to be", but rather on what the player and the team has been saying.

Stanton was shaken up after 3 or 4 times he went against the wall during this trip. Besides, comparing the ground he has to cover day in, day out with what Hech has to cover is not even funny. And you don't think covering the amount of ground he has had to cover, specially playing the shift several times and having to cover all the bombs flying in deep right-center field and deep right field is tiring? Have you been watching the same games as everybody else?

I am pretty amazed you still think he is bionic.

Redmond has gone on the record to say he is trying to give Stanton a day off since the series against the Padres. He said over and over Stanton was pretty spent physically, and even Stanton recognizing that, he wanted to keep playing.

Like I said, if he gets injured with muscle fatigue, or hammy issues, the very first thing people will say is "its the FO fault", or "Stanton is injury prone".

For me, the Math goes like this:

1 = 1 and 0 = 15.

1 day off, equals 1 game missed.
0 day off, could mean 15 games missed.

As an organization, the team must look in the long run, and not being short-sided. They have a 9 games stretch now, where the team will play several day games, with short rest between games. You gotta have your best players rested.

Flav C.

Besides, the "weaker" Phillies beats us 0-3 in the first series and it is only 2 games behind the Fish. they just come from a series win against the reds, where they scored 20 runs in this series.

On Tuesday, they come with a veteran A.J. Burnett, while the Marlins has a rookie on the mound. I'd think playing a direct divisional foe, where every loss or win is magnified it is much more important in order to have a complete lineup on the field.

But again, this is the opinion of someone who didn't see Mantle, Mays, etc...

Lou Vales

Based upon what you have "heard" about Mantle and Mays and assuming you were the manager and had decided to rest one of them ,would you have thought it overly taxing to have either have an AB in a situation where it became apparent you would not have many chances but now you did in the 5th inning of a game against a pitcher showing first signs of distress? After the AB either could have gone back to the cool confines of the clubhouse, however, since it was San Francisco it would have been cooler in the dugout.

I'm a Mac Guy

Flave, with the one and one postulate as a guide, what do two days off equal? This new math system is confusing to me, damn common core in our schools. In terms of covering ground, are we talking about casually jogging out to a position? Surly you can look up the number of outs each player has and activity in the field? I thought it was common baseball knowledge that you put your best fielder at short, because they get more opportunities? But what do I know.
Perhaps Stanton, who has spent some time on the DL in the past, needed a day off because he was sore, and they wanted to rest his legs before he had to fly across the country and be confined to a leather recliner in the sky. Stanton may be big and powerful, but he certainly isn't graceful. He'll end up a Yankee with Puig and Trout in a few years, anyway, why argue about the guy. Unless Red has a dell and spends time commenting on this blog, I don't believe anyone here is the Marlins Manager.

Lou Vales

I understand this game and that decision will NOT cost them a playoff spot, however, I view it as important that players and coaches recognize the manager understands the game and "game situations" These guys on this team appear fairly intelligent and I guarantee they were surprised to see Turner batting in that situation. I also like to see each game--no matter how meaningless--played in a fashion commensurate with achieving a victory. You could have rested Stanton 175 minutes in a game that took about 180 to play and still have achieved both objectives.

It remains shocking to me that I care so much about a team I know will not make the playoffs and yet am not enjoying fully the Detroit Tigers--a team I have loved since 1956--making a mockery of the AL Central and with 6 road wins in the last week against the Orioles and Red Sox. I LOVE underdogs and don't like to see them farther burdened by albatrosses similar to what Samuel Taylor Coleridge described in the "The Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner" I take solace in knowing when(IF??) this team is READY to win Redmond will be somewhere else.

Dionysus Thelxinoe

Personally, I'm ok with the 4-7 road trip. Considering their 2-10 road record starting out...

But what is truly, truly PATHETIC is their signing of Miguel Tejada. What. Are. They. Thinking? Seriously, man. Tejada himself acknowledges how badly his skills have eroded by virtue of having used peds, for which he received the longest suspension ever handed down before ARod (and which he's still serving)... NOT TO MENTION that he hits the big four-oh next week!

One final note, Mick Jagger is now a great grandfather! He keeps reminding me of the old saying, "If I had known I was going to live this long, I would have taken better care of myself."

Stan M

Flav, you always come up with meaningful stats and are quite good in that area. The arguments you have presented in trying to prove me wrong are certainly not in the same category. It goes without saying that if there was some inside information that forced Redmond's hand, then any position, no matter how logical, would be irrelevant. That is so obvious that I didn't bother to state it. That being said, any argument that tries to show how waiting an extra day that would be less ruinous to the team's momentum is so specious that I question the reason for its presentation.

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