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OnFrozenFilm: Stu Siegel and Cliff Viner Talk NHL Trade Deadline


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Good Letter Guys. Its kind of like the Panthers saying playoffs or bust, every year..

Maybe Yormark can call his Brother and set up a deal to give fans free tax advice at Panther games from now on.....

yes it is a multi step process,

Step one, hire the right people to run the hockey side
Step two, invest in scouting and development
Step three draft the right players
Step four sign the right free agents
Step Five don't be afraid to take chances

Viner looks in pain and lost, while Siegel is wondering how he got himself in this screwed up mess.

First step they need to take is clearing house in the front office. I like the scouting staff, but they need to bring in a GM who will work with his own people. Not previous regimes' people.

This is funny how much of a joke this is. These people actually get paid to run a NHL franchise. The world we live in is a complete joke!

PDB is probably thinking "losing Seidenberg... the only thing I can do is laugh right now!" We took a step back this summer and took another step back today... where are these two steps forward?

You need a guy who can score. You can teach skating but you can't teach scoring! We are a Pro-AHL team that gets paid NHL dollars. The rest of the NHL loves us because we teach them to play here, trade them, and then they do great and we get a new bunch of losers!

We released Skoula from tryouts and Pittsburgh picks him up until their All Star guys are back from injury... what did they see in him that we did not? Oh yes! Someone who could play major minutes for a NHL hockey team and somewhat succeed. We let him go for the Finnish guy that we played for 2 minutes a night after Helsinki!

So, do you think they'll fire Randy once the season is over, and get someone else to gm the draft?

"Where was all that offence the last 12 games?" - Randy Moller, after the Panthers scored the sixth goal against the Flyers 3/3/10.

Where, indeed.

When is the announcement to rename the team the Florida Nets?

NOW they decide to play like a team with energy????

Gret and entertaining game last night, but jeesh--now we'll make that run for the '9th' spot....woo...hoo....

I feel bad for the new owners. All they asked was that the Panthers get a bunch of draft picks and prospects for next season. Instead, they only get 2 draft picks for the 2010 draft. Not good, furthermore, this was the best day for the Panthers to get rid of bad players because they would have overpaid for them. Oilers and other REBUILDING teams picked up plenty of picks. Sexton made the team worst in the summer, and could not get rid of bad performers at the trade deadlines.
2 strikes and your out Sexton. I hope they are looking for a "builder' GM.

I watched the TSN Trade deadline show on NHL Network and Mike Peca, I think it was him that said he thought the Panthers letter was a good idea to inform the fans. I have no problem with it. If they did nothing the people complaining about the letter would be the people complaining they are doing nothing and don't care. For the first time in awhile Panthers have owners that are trying and do care. Give them a chance. You can't build a winning team at the trade deadline. Teams are held back by the cap. On draft day more teams are willing to deal. Every trade Sexton has done has been good. Three UFAs have returned a nice package of players and picks. Relax it is a slow process but so far so good.

Why is everyone so surprised? Yes the LETTER was sent out, and I give them credit for that. It was something that needed to be addressed probably at least 2 or 3 years ago...

But the bottom-line now is we're stuck with over-hyped players that also have bad contracts... So at least now they know that no one's willing to offer anything for contracts like Allen, Olesz, Stillman, Kreps, etc..

And I really hope they weren't expecting to get Jeff Carter for T-Vo... But I would've like to see them trade T-Vo for some sort of package of VanRiemsdyk, Giroux, picks and prospects... Holding onto him makes no sense. I don't see them getting a better deal later.. Teams want the guy for a playoff run NOW, not for 1 expiring year with a $6.3 cap hit...

Also his numbers can only get worse... Same thing with Horton. I think the the injury hurt them a bit there too... But Horton's numbers are up, but teams probably still aren't offering what many here think these guys are worth--hence PANTHERS PLAYERS = OVERRATED...

So that message should be clear... Nobody else wants this team's CRAP... I guess the next logical move is waivers and re-entry waivers if that stuff is still an option from here on out... If not, buy out Allen, Olesz, Stillman, Kreps, etc... and start from scratch...

Trade Horton, T-Vo, maybe Weiss and Frolik if the offer is right... Put a more physical, gritty, exciting product out there... Sure they won't win much for a couple years, but they'll be better in the long run....

Yes, they are rebuilding, I have little faith that Sexton is the guy to do it. Hire a REAL GM with previous playoff experience, Sexton is not it. No renewal!

Slapshot1106, why would you trade Horton,Weiss, and Frolik when these guys are NoT the problem. Yes, I am one of many fans who were crying for Horton's head on the chopping block,but this season he has done what we've all wanted and their is no reason to trade away our top guys for draft picks who won't make the team for another few years and then expect those players to do what Horton,Weiss and Frolik are doing now. I liked our trades because it brought us draft picks which can be used as leverage in trades come draft day and Seidenberg said he enjoys it here,so we might just sign him in the offseason. I will give this new ownership group the benefit of the doubt because they took over in the middle of the season and didn't have much play when it comes to this past offseason,and they actually seem interested in the franchise and want to win, unlike Cohen. Let's see how our team looks come training camp next year, I mean I hate the whole (waiting until next season) shpeil but new owners, maybe a top 5 draft pick, acouple of decent moves and signings and we arent too far off.

It is clear that this team was not built correctly,

first the GM has only left handed defensemen, how can anyone have an NHL team with no right handed defenseman, we have 4 or 5 (depending on how you count Allen) new defensemen this year and none are right handed

Sexton doesn't have a clue, he has to be the 30th best GM currently employed in the NHL

Get rid of the front office and bring in hockey people so we can build a team

More like 40th best Gm in a 30 team league. There are better GMs out of work presently, managing junior league teams, or working as assistants in the NHL. I despise the existence of Keenan, but I'd rather have Keenan working with DeBoer than Sexton.

The way this organization is right now, they need to purge EVERYTHING that has had any association with the past ten years here in Sunrise. That means management and players, and I mean everything. That includes Weiss and Horton, and Weiss has been my favorite Panther pretty much since his draft day. He's a good cerebral player, and a GREAT character guy, even if he was a dancing monkey for Cohen and his son, for a period of time.

the blind leading the blind

No way Clash...no way to Mike Keenan!

Dave, I realize Horton, Weiss, and Frolik wouldn't be such a problem if we had other solid players around them, but this org has made those guys the future of this franchise over the last 5 years or so.... They provide no leadership for other young guys around them, they have a half-ass work ethic, and are frankly lucky to be on a piss-poor team such as this to get top-line minutes and PP time...

So I know they aren't the only major problem, but one that we should've realized and dealt away at least 2-3 years ago while they had more value... Now other teams realize they are overvalued and won't give a decent return... I think the Panthers best value may be to package some one star, one bad contract and/or pick and hope you can get something in return. At this point, we've got nothing to lose...

You have to give to get back... We're probably stuck watching this same crap for a few more years, but I'd rather they blow it up and start over, rather than be the LA Clippers...

Cut the owners some slack. It's a bad hand they've been dealt... Personally since most people like PDB, they should consider making him GM... Or at least have the Coach and GM on the same page... No sense in Sexton signing Koistenen and Clemmensen if PDB doesn't like them, and doesn't work into his system...

Koistenten was signed for Yormark and the Finland trip

clean house is the only way

Keenan? He's one of the reasons we're in this mess in the first place...

STH... agree, clean house, STARTING with Yormark.

George, what is the feeling the players get about upper management (i.e. Yormack)? Is this something you ever ask 'off the record'? Or is it pretty much 'hush-hush'?

I mean, the blame was on Keenan, then Martin, then Jokinen, then Cohen, then J-Bo, then scouting, then Sexton....where does it end??

for those of you applauding Sexton for the 2nd round picks we picked up in the draft here is the research courtesy of ESPN.

Only 25.8% play a total of 82 games in the NHL.

Of those the average will be 29 NHL points (goals and assists).

Their conclusion is that you trade for a 2nd round pick when you don't want a contract in return.

statistically if the player makes it in the NHL the statistics are the same whether he was a 2nd round pick or a 5th round pick.

At the end of the day, we traded away players we were not going to keep for the odds of getting nothing in return.

Lastly, who would you have more confidence in drafting that player that makes it in the NHL, Jim Rutherford who also traded for multiple 2nd round picks or Randy Sexton.

I would pick Rutherford without a second thought.

sth: That's an interesting stat. Still, by having three picks he's tripled his chances of finding another David Booth (2nd round, 53rd overall in 2004).

Considering how badly JM and Keenan did, I'm willing to give Sexton more time. He did get Kulikov, which was considered quite the coup, and managed to salvage something from the complete clusterbomb that was Bouw's departure. I hope we get to see how he handles the offseason before throwing in yet another management team with their own agenda/vision/blinders/issues. There's something to be said for stability in and of itself, and if they take off the interim tag it might even lure a free agent.

HAhahah, forget I typed that. This team won't shell out for any quality free agents.

Over the years they have added some players to compliment the core group, they have hired and fired coaches, hired and fired GM's, changed owners...maybe its the core players that is the problem. When you have players who have never made the playoff year after year..maybe the core needs to change and bring in players that understand what it takes to win!

The core has changed over the years. First it was the rebuilding with guys like Podollan and Nemirovsky with Wells and Wilson as a youth movement. Then it was Bure and the team complimenting him. Then it was Luongo, Jokinen, Huselius, and Hagman. Then as they started to falter, it became Weiss, Bouwmeester, and Horton. Now its Booth, Frolik, and Ballard. Ownership really didn't change until recently, but former ownership's management team is still here, starting with Yormack. Ironic the NJ Nets are one of the worst teams in basketball, and I don't even know a thing about basketball except to know that.

There has been consistency here. There has consistently been a losing attitude with empty promises to the average fans, so they continue to shell out money and pay for the more privileged of sunny South Florida to get perks around the arena.

As for Keenan, I said I despised the man. Got banned from HFboards for calling every stupid roster move he and Martin made before it happened. My point is, there are better GMs than Sexton out there, even ones who suck as bad as Keenan.

Very good point JJ... Yes I think changing the CORE is more important than who the GM is... As far as the CORE now being Booth, Frolik, and Ballard, that's more of the problem... I would say it should be Booth and Kulikov... If we had a solid team I would add T-Vo in there, but since we don't, why keep a very good goalie around making $6.3 when your team isn't ready to compete yet...

Find cheaper goalies for a couple years until you build a solid foundation, then pay more for a top tier goalie.... If not, you do what this team has done for years--fool yourself into thinking you're closer than you really are... 9th -12th place finishes just tell a few more seats and not realizing your CORE isn't good enough is this organization's ongoing problem....

And Frolik may be better if surrounded with better guys, but as of now he's kind of like Zednik... Streaky scorer that goes through flashes, but fails to offer enough in the 10 games between spurts.... And Balllard is more of a 3rd or 4th Dman, not a Top 2 guy like he's being paid.... But that's another of this teams problem--overpaying for average talent because they haven't built a solid CORE...

The GM decides who the core will be and the core is a reflection of where the GM wants this team to be. Thus making the GM more important than the core, as he is responsible for direction a team is heading.

You keep a guy like Vokoun, because in addition to keeping the puck out of the net, a good goalie who communicates well with his defense also is a sort of assistant coach to the young kids, by telling them where he wants them as plays develop. You don't want marginal goalies or young goalies doing this with young defensemen. This was a problem with Luongo and why he seemingly does better in international competition, because the defense is usually more experienced.

I like Vokoun, and obviously he isn't the problem here... But what's the sense keeping a rather expensive goalie when your team is only fooling itself if they truly believe they are ready to compete...

Vokoun deserves a shot in the playoffs on a legitimate team, so it's a shame a deal wasn't made with the Caps, Flyers, or Hawks, etc... So instead we try to make a deal in the off-season with one of those teams that gets knocked out early due to poor goaltending... But the return you'll get is way less, and certainly won't include a Jeff Carter...

As far as the core goes, I know they'll never admit it, but I'm sure neither PDB or Sexton's ideal core would include Horton... That's why his name keeps popping up in trade rumors, but it's too late because other teams value him as 2nd line material like he should be, and won't be willing to give a 1st line return like we would like....

On the NHL radio network they said the panthers have only competed for a playoff spot because of Luongo and then Vokoun,

without them we would be battling for 30th every year instead of 20th

If things are going to change it must start form the top down. Stu and Cliff need to clean house. New scouts, new assistant coaches if they are keeping DeBoer, and the same goes in Rochester. Our scouting and player development stinks, so you can have all the draft picks you want. We cannot develop them with the current staff.
We need a VP of Hockey Operations for the GM to report to.
Sexton may have done the best he could, but he's not the guy to change the team.

Finally, the culture must change. Most of these players have been here too long and are associated with losing. Therefore a huge turnover is required.

I agree- too many of the players on this team have been here too long and don't understand what it takes to win!

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