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Dems delegate fight turns ugly

So much for party unity: As Florida Dems prepare for Saturday's Jefferson-Jackson dinner aimed at bringing the party "together once and for all," a spat over the Obama campaign's decision to replace some already-designated Florida delegates with Obama backers has intensified.

And how. DNC member Jon Ausman late Thursday e-mailed Dems (and reporters) choice sections of what he says were e-mails from Obama's Florida finance chair Kirk Wagar -- in which Wagar curses Ausman out and criticizes Sen. Bill Nelson and party director Leonard Joseph.

The highlights: "You (Jon Ausman) f&^%ed us. We are dealing with it. You need to accept the fact that you f*&^ed us."

And of Nelson: "I am getting very sick of (Senator) Nelson making a bad situation worse."

Said Ausman to Wagar: "We are at a point in time when we need to heal and come together. Help me understand how these messages, which you have sent to me in writing, help Senator Obama's campaign."

Wagar sent out an e-mail shortly after, apologizing for the profanity, but suggesting Ausman had used "out of context snippets from some ongoing and sometimes heated arguments we have had over the course of this campaign.

"I apologize for the profanity that you were subjected to," he said in the e-mail. "It is a vice of mine that I try to minimize but seems to rear it’s head with more frequency when I deal with Jon."

Of Nelson and Joseph, Wagar said he disagreed with them on seating the delegates, but "did not malign them in private nor in the excerpts Jon blasted out.  I have worked with Leonard for years, long before he came to Florida, and I have worked very hard for and with Senator Nelson. On this issue we disagreed and despite Jon’s effort to twist it into something more, it isn’t."

Comments

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NoneyaBiz

This is just the beginning. People who support Obama have no idea the kind of people he associates with. It will get much uglier in the coming months. With the 527's and CCE's running attack ads against him (we all know how brutal these groups are.)

Too bad these voters (most new voters) did not support Sen. Clinton. The only Dem that could actually win the WH. I say these youngsters have screwed our party's chances of winning the WH again. In 2000 the newbies in FL gave Ralph Nader 6% of the vote and the WH. And in 2004 there turnout for Sen. Kerry was under 30%. They will hold the blame for our party losing again.

Here's an idea... lets raise the voting age to 30 yrs. old, unless someone is active duty military.

Bob Krupienski

Obama was raised on Chicago style politics. What did people expect?

Gordon

What is wrong with Obama and Wagar? He was writing this stuff on June 6? That was AFTER Florida had been resolved. Does he not care about the Florida Democratic party.

I for one would much rather have Sen. Bill Nelson in charge than this jacka** Obama flack Wagar.

JDB

You know, I'm under 30, but my understanding of politics is such that I'm aware that no one "gave Ralph Nader the WH" in the year 2000. And of course, it's unimaginable that 527's would have anything to say about Hillary Clinton, lord knows her sterling reputation and low profile over the last 16 years wouldn't lend itself to those that might disparage her, and it's not like anyone in this country has any preconceived notions about her, either. Here's the reality: it's time to shed the baby boomer generation's dead weight in the leadership of this country. The specter of the politics of the 60's has too long cast a shadow over America, and it's usefulness is at an end. Just look at the impact of the Vietnam war on the last election, 30 years later, with the Swift Boat nonsense and the rest of it. We have a war on now, in case you forgot, and regardless how tempted one might be to draw parallels between Iraq and Vietnam, the boomers had no real solution back then, and they still have none. It's time for a new generation to assume the mantle of leadership, painful as that may be for those who were so outraged at their elders back then. It seems they've forgotten that they once demanded to be heard, and now they're asking us to shut up. No matter. President Obama is going to do good things for you whether you want him to or not, which will be a refreshing change from the last 8 years, when the opposite was true.

msmerlin

Obviously JDB is a part of the generation that's going to give the Repubs the WH again in 2008. He/she personifies the thinking that got us to this point. He/she makes his/her own case against himself. Read it and weep!

macarb55

just
say http://www.justsaynodeal.com/
no deal

we are a coalition of millions with
one thing in common: NObama

RICK TRUTH SPEAKER

PRESIDENT OBAMA IS A SMART MAN. HE NEEDS TO PUT SOME OF HIS OWN BACKERS IN WITH THE BACKERS THAT ARE THERE. EVERY JOB I'VE WORKED WHEN A NEW BOSS CAME HE PUT SOME OF HIS KEY PEOPLE IN CHARGE ALSO. THIS IS STRATEGIC PLANNING. THIS ALSO ALLEVIATES THE CHANCES OF BEING SABOTAGED. PRESIDENT OBAMA KNOWS EVERYONE HAS NOT FULLY EMBRACED HIM AND A SMART LEADER WOULD DO EXACTLY WHAT HE HAS DONE. I PROMISE YOU BOTH SENATORS CLINTON AND MCCAIN WOULD HAVE DONE EXACTLY THE SAME. SMART PEOPLE DO SMART PLANNING. SMART PLANNING MEANS PREVENTION RATHER THAN RESOLUTIONS.

Joe

Obama campaign seems to be full of THUGS!

Tallytowngal

JDB in the 2000 election in FL Ralph Nader took 97,421 over 90% of those votes were cast at precients on or around college campuses. The final official Florida count gave the victory to Bush by 537. Yes the under 30's gave Bush the WH in 2000.

So, please check your history before you post a rant that is false.

Joe

Obama is part of Chicago's and Mayor Daley's political corruption. Youngsters who intend on voting for Obama better realize that Daley senior had friends in organized crime and was friends with union bosses who stole millions from the rank and file!
Obama's morals are non existent

slag

Yes. We all know that no other campaign in history has ever used profanity in their emails (of course, none of us ever do!). And Obama is an effete, elitist, pantywaist, liberal thug. And Hillary is such a unifying figure in American politics.

Way to peel the onion, commenters!

Bill

What's becoming clear is that the Obama campaign is moving quickly to take control of the Democratic Party at all levels and in many cases stepping all over the activists who have been working in the trenches for years.

What is unfortunate here is that you have people who committed to Obama before he became the presumptive nominee and even before it was known if they were going to actually go to Denver and now they are being told "we don't want you."

This sends a terrible message to Democrats in Florida and does nothing to help build the rift that exists down here.

I for one am likely to spend my efforts on local candidates - I will certainly vote for the Democratic nominee, but at this point don't see myself going out of my way to work the grassroots for him.

yikes

Here's Wager's full response:

Friends and fellow Democrats

I don’t know if you have received Florida DNC member Jon Ausman’s email about me yet but I assume you will. He has chosen to subject folks to out of context snippets from some ongoing and sometimes heated arguments we have had over the course of this campaign. I apologize for the profanity that you were subjected too. it is a vice of mine that I try to minimize but seems to rear it’s head with more frequency when I deal with Jon.

I have been told over the years that I should ignore Jon and never engage with him, even when I agree with him, because in the end, it is all about Jon. That seems to be the case. I will not go chapter and verse through the substance of his email but I will provide my context for anything that I think might be misconstrued.

Number 1, when I was referring to making a difficult situation worse, I was specifically talking about the fact that we asked that at the very least, the PLEO and AT Large Delegates not be selected until after the DNC Rules and By Laws Committee ruled. I asked both Leonard Joseph and Senator Nelson’s office to support waiting and they made a decision to go forward for tactical reasons. I disagreed with it but they were perfectly entitled to make that decision and I don’t fault them for it. I don’t think it is debatable that it made the delegate situation harder to deal with after the fact given that the Obama campaign did not participate in the elections, but it is not like anyone died. It was and is simply a situation that has to be dealt with. Both Leonard and Senator Nelson’s office know that I wanted a different outcome and I did not malign them in private nor in the excerpts Jon blasted out. I have worked with Leonard for years, long before he came to Florida, and I have worked very hard for and with Senator Nelson. On this issue we disagreed and despite Jon’s effort to twist it into something more, it isn’t.

Number 2, I fundamentally believe that the Obama campaign should be able to send the delegates that most deserve it to the convention and because that the campaign did not participate in the process and strike anyone, people who knew the system were able to get a slate passed of people that were important to them and their local politics. There is nothing untoward about those individuals putting forth a slate in the absence of the Obama campaign participating. I do not think it is appropriate that that slate stands unchallenged now that the DNC RBC has ruled on Jon’s appeal, but that is MY opinion, not of the campaign. I have great respect for both Dianne Glasser and Bret Berlin and consider Bret a good friend. I would have done exactly what they did. My point has always been that I personally don’t think that it should be binding on a campaign that did not participate and now that there is an opportunity to at least try to fix the situation, we should.

Number 3, I have no idea what he is talking about with regards to Gerry McEntee because I would have never in a million years thought he would be having conversations with Jon Ausman.

For the past 2 weeks, I have poured over the lists of Obama delegates, tried to find every avenue to have everyone who should be a delegate either be one or get similar credentials, talked to numerous party leaders to try to find a way to make sure everyone or almost everyone would end this final process of the primary pleased and united. At every turn Jon Ausman demanded his pound of flesh. The mistake I made, in addition to language that I am extremely embarrassed about circulating to good Democrats around the state, was trying to rationally discuss alternatives with Jon. This was about Jon’s ego and his view that control over party rules was his only power.

I am sorry you were brought into this. I am sorry that I used unprofessional language with Jon, despite it being a two way street in the back and forth, but most importantly, I am sorry that we cannot do anything in a simple and succinct manner so we can win this state in November for Barack Obama.

I have no idea who Jon sent this to so if someone forwards you something with a “What the heck is this” email, please feel free to forward my response.


Kirk Wagar

dmd76

If you want to lay the blame for Bush's election on any age group, I suggest you look at the actual exit polls for both 2000 (http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2000/results/index.epolls.html ) (the 30-59 age groups were the only ones that went for Bush) and 2004 (http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/states/US/P/00/epolls.0.html ) (the 60+ group went for GWB by the biggest margin of any age group; the 18-29 age group was the only one Kerry won). So much for the wisdom of our elders.

Tallytowngal

dmd76
You are citing exit data from the entire country. I was referring to FLORIDA!

from earlier post:
(JDB in the 2000 election in FL Ralph Nader took 97,421 over 90% of those votes were cast at precients on or around college campuses.)

Trust me, I was a member of the Gore campaign here in Tallahassee as well as a DEC member. And believe me... we know exactly where the majority of those Florida Nader votes came from.

And another thing the 18-29 year old demographic "turns out" the lowest percentage of voters of any one particular demographic. Followed by African Americans, who "turn out the vote" in 2nd to last place.

TW

JDB: you say that you want to shed the baby boomer "specter," yet you promote Obama, who is a straight-down-the-line 1960s style leftist who only pretends to be post-partisan, pragamtic, forward looking, etc. (give me one example of where he has led in the real world Senate in a manner that even remotely reflects his bloated rhetoric). Rather than getting hung up on people's ages, let's concentrate on ideas. With that in mind, I agree, we should bury the spector of 1960s leftist groupthink and all of its myriad byproducts - but every former leftist who comes to realize how convoluted is/was the new leftism of the 1960s should welcomed back into "reality based community" with open arms, regardless of age.

Maryland Dem

Let me say first that I'm not a Floridian and so I can't claim to understand how difficult this situation has been for all of you. I've tried to take an objective standpoint in reading these comments and both sides make some good points and some not so good points.

That being said we are now all supposed to be working to get Barack Obama elected. (It seems from the comments that most everyone supports the Dem party in this election.) So this kind of public bickering needs to end already, even if an Obama representative might have been out of line and even if a Clinton supporter might have also had something to do with that by supposedly having instigated it or contributed to the devolution of the tone of the exchange. Everything you do that is not working towards that goal is working against it.

If the press reports on some of these things the best thing to do is to just let it pass. When the people who are supposed to be showing party unity get into shouting matches about Clinton and Obama it just further goads the press and the pundits into focusing on that issue. And it certainly doesn't help with on the fence voters who are considering abandoning the Republican Party for Obama. All of us need to recognize this and put all our efforts into convincing voters that Barack Obama is the best choice for America in 2008. Unless we do that now, none of this back and forth about how a future election might go means anything anyway.

Maryland Dem

Let me say first that I'm not a Floridian and so I can't claim to understand how difficult this situation has been for all of you. I've tried to take an objective standpoint in reading these comments and both sides make some good points and some not so good points.

That being said we are now all supposed to be working to get Barack Obama elected. (It seems from the comments that most everyone supports the Dem party in this election.) So this kind of public bickering needs to end already, even if an Obama representative might have been out of line and even if a Clinton supporter might have also had something to do with that by supposedly having instigated it or contributed to the devolution of the tone of the exchange. Everything you do that is not working towards that goal is working against it.

If the press reports on some of these things the best thing to do is to just let it pass. When the people who are supposed to be showing party unity get into shouting matches about Clinton and Obama it just further goads the press and the pundits into focusing on that issue. And it certainly doesn't help with on the fence voters who are considering abandoning the Republican Party for Obama. All of us need to recognize this and put all our efforts into convincing voters that Barack Obama is the best choice for America in 2008. Unless we do that now, none of this back and forth about how a future election might go means anything anyway.

 Political Pundit

The Obama led coup of the Florida democratic party has begun....Wait till you see what they have planned for America!

JDB

Precisely, dmd676. And, if the rest of you would read carefully, you'd notice I was addressing a probably honest mistake in this sentence: "In 2000 the newbies in FL gave Ralph Nader 6% of the vote and the WH." Ralph Nader did not win the White house, nor my demographic. I'm fully aware of the opinion that Nader votes 'delivered' the state for Bush in 2000, but I submit that the cowardice of of the Democratic leadership was equally if not more responsible. I worked on the Gore Campaign, and was one of many younger people that were outraged by the unwillingness of the Democratic leadership to fight back against the Bush crowd during the recount, fearing some sort of political backlash might harm the party's image, as opposed fearing to eight years of Bush that have seen the erosion of our Constitution and economy that have come to pass. The old, entrenched, Democratic power structure was not willing to fight for change and true progressive policy then, and there are still those who are not willing to do so now, preferring to stay quiet, as they've become accustomed to doing in the years that the Neocons had the power to silence them. Don't believe me? Watch as Dennis Kucinich's articles of Impeachment are shot down in committee, even as 54% of Americans think Bush should be held accountable for his crimes. But again, it makes no difference, Barack Obama IS going to be elected president this year, and those of you who choose to believe whatever gets put in your inbox via chain email will, as I stated before, be safer, healthier, and wealthier as a result, whatever your unfounded opinion of the man is. He represents the willingness of Democrats to stop acting like victims and start acting like leaders. All politicians get to where they get in exactly the same manner, and it's not always pretty. You should give younger people a little more credit for being able to identify which of those politicians represent our ideas and positions, and realize that our thoughts on policy are just as valid and important as your own.

dmd76

Tallytowngal: I was responding both to you and NoneyaBiz.
Here you go: http://msnbc.com/m/d2k/g/polls.asp?office=P&state=fl
Florida exit polls! By your logic, the age group that went for Gore by 15% (18-29) is more responsible for the election of Bush than every other group (none of which went for Gore). And again, the 60+ age group was the most pro-Bush of all. Try again.

JLG

JDB, you think Obama and his change is going to fix this country? Son, his change is nothing new. It has already been tried by Jimmy Carter and it failed MISERABLY! You think things are bad now, just wait to see what happen under Obama. You think he is going to help us with gas prices? Obama's fix for gas prices is make gas even more expesive so that we drive less. How does that help working families that must drive 60 miles rountrip to work in order to put food on the table? Sorry bud, we don't live in city where you bike your arse to work!

elgrancane77

Let everyone that wants to pay the government more of their hard-earned cash vote for Obama!!! Vote for Change.... Vote for More Taxes!!!

elgrancane77

Let everyone that wants to pay the government more of their hard-earned cash vote for Obama!!! Vote for Change.... Vote for More Taxes!!!

Vail Beach

Every political leader has an effect on the language. Obama's will be the elevation of the word "snippets" to the status of magic word that can alter the meaning of plain English. You say Rev. Wright said "God Damn America?" Well, not so fast: That was a "snippet." Kirk Wager sends threatening, muscling kinds of notes to Jon Ausman. Hold the phone: Those phrases, too, were just "snippets." I guess if you say something objectionable, but then call it a "snippet" that is supposed to neutralize it.

That smacking sound you hear is Josef Goebbels, in hell, hitting his head saying "Why didn't I think of 'snippets'?"

Linda C.

Obama is consolidating power and effectively bought the entire DNC leadership lock stock and barrel. They will walk over anyone, including people who put in their time, effort and money to be elected delegates by the voters. Again disrespecting those that ran and those who voted. Obama never claimed to be a democrat. He pushed that the democrats of the past were no different than the republicans. He was going to be the face of the new party and new coalition. Now what part of that don't you all understand. He is doing exactly what he said he was going to do. Why are they worried about surprises? Because according to the rulz, he isn't the nominee. The democratic party, according to the rulz, doesn't have a nominee. Senator Clinton did not release her pledged delegates or assign them to Obama. That is why they are consolidating power now because he is the selectee until August.

The only one to stop the power grab is Senator Clinton. At this point she is not in position to be the nominee. However, she got a bucket full of delegates that can wedge the complete take over of the party by the shadows of Obama's power supporters. This whole primary season has been more about who is going to control the party rather than who was going to be the nominee. In order to prevent our party from being totally highjacked like the RNC help Senator Clinton quickly pay down her debt. There is no way even the Clinton's can come up with that much cash that quickly.So if you supported Senator Clinton and want to put some balance back in the DNC, send Senator Clinton a 10 spot.

gob

Hey Lesley Clark, how about actually covering the substance of the argument over the delegates, instead of giving everyone cheap thrills by publishing profanity? Maybe then we could make a reasonable judgment about the importance of it and the rights and wrongs of it.

Doozzer

Not only was I raised in the South Carolina State House but I had a MA in Political Science before I was 30. Does that give me the right to vote in your little world?

Gekkobear

"Barack Obama IS going to be elected president this year, and those of you who choose to believe whatever gets put in your inbox via chain email will, as I stated before, be safer, healthier, and wealthier as a result, whatever your unfounded opinion of the man is."

well of course. What could help the economy more than higher energy prices, fixed energy consumption, high tariffs, unreachable mandates for several industries, higher taxes, and new spending by the Government requiring more money (or higher debt)?

All of these will make you "richer". Not in dollars, but in that warm liberal feeling you get when the Government takes your last dime and legislates away your job and you start starving to death.

I'll do without being "richer" through damaging the economy with increased taxation and increased regulation while crippling trade and outsourcing jobs.

Or maybe some definition of how this "richer" might occur. How do you get "richer" with more hands in your pocket and less opportunities to make money JDB?

Jerry

You Will Do It My Way
Heil Obama

Buck Nekkid

Obama is an empty suit. He has great oratorical skills and infinite charm. But none of his ideas have a basis in reality, except that "change" is good and "yes we can."

Not all change is good. And yes, we can do many things, but by further restricting our rights, ability to act and digging deeper into our pockets, the only change will be spare change that we can't even afford to give to the street corner entrepreurs who so sincerely ask us for "change."

Tell me one real accomplishment of Obama. He can't even keep the promise he made to IL voters that he would serve out his term. He has been campaigning since he was elected.

FLGirl

Obama's campaign tendns toward anti-semitism, Look at the anti-semitic rant posted on Obama’s website presented on No Quarter

http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/06/09/rabid-anti-semitism-on-obamas-official-2008-campaign-website/

What about the anti-semitic, anti-Israeli clerics on Obama’s spiritual outreach committee who were only expunged after they were exposed: Jeremiah Wright, Father Pfleger, Willie Barrow.

http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/06/03/obama-has-another-farrakhan-problem/

What about the Obama surrogates that have openly attacked members of the Jewish community.

http://www.seraphicpress.com/archives/2008/04/antisemitic_oba.php

Whether it is secret meetings with Hamas, the bigoted rants of Obama surrogates, his association with members of anti-Israeli terror groups like Rashid Khalidi, or Hatem el Hady, or the physical manifestation of Jew bashing on his website, it cannot be denied that Obama’s campaign thinks ill of the Jewish community. We cannot allow this to stand!

We will all pay for our silence if we do not speak out now!

PUMA - Just Say No Deal!

RICK TRUTH SPEAKER

THE BOTTOM LINE IN ALL HONESTY IS THE FACT. REGARDLESS OF WHAT PRESIDENT OBAMA SAYS, MANY OF YOU WILL FIND SOME WAY TO DISTORT IT. THE DEMOCRATS SAY THEY ARE UNITED, BUT I WONDER. THIS MAN AND HIS WIFE ARE VERY SMART. THEY KNOW JUST BEC AUSE A BEAR IS NOT TRYING TO CLIMB UP THE TREE, DOESN'T MEAN HE'S NOT WAITING TO GET YOU. SOME OF THOSE WHO SAY THEY ARE UNITED ARE MERELY WAITING AND HOPING TO FIND SOMETHING TO TAKE AWAY THIS NOMINATION. THIS WILL NOT HAPPEN, BEC AUSE IF THIS MAN HAS WITHSTOOD ALL THE LIES THAT HE HAS ALREADY. HE WON'T FALL NOW. REMEMBER. WHAT DON'T WHIP YOU, WILL ONLY WORK YOU.

MrNick

What can Republican supporters bring to the table? Lower taxes, for anybody that makes over a billion, who cares. Live in fear, check on everybody, no thanks, not anymore. Weapons of Mass Destruction, in your dreams. What about the economy, a complete disaster.

Older people are always afraid of change, America was founded on change, new country, new lands, new horinzons, new dreams, new people, new ideas. Whenever a new generation stands up, change is going to happens, don't be afraid of it, go for it; anything is better that whatever we have today.

There is nothing Republicans can say about somebody they don't know. Senator Obama is the best chance to get the country in a different direction, any other direction is better than to keep the course of action.

So for all of us, in the need of a new hope, a better future, Obama is the right choice.

p_lukasiak

wow... if anyone wants to know how corrupt the entire Obama campaign is, check out this excerpt from Wager's own explanatory email...

I fundamentally believe that the Obama campaign should be able to send the delegates that most deserve it to the convention and because that the campaign did not participate in the process and strike anyone, people who knew the system were able to get a slate passed of people that were important to them and their local politics.

Wager and the Obama campaign clearly think that the purpose of a national convention is to do whatever the candidate chosen decrees. This is simply not the case --- delegates are/should be elected to represent the interests of the voters in the districts/states that they are elected from.

Team Obama shows its essentially authoritarian nature in Wager -- the ONLY person whose interests can be represented in Denver is Barack Obama, and the priorities and concerns of the millions of people who voted for Obama are to be ignored.

Perhaps some of Obama's supporters are willing to "sieg heil" him -- we've certainly seen enough of that type in the blogosphere -- but my guess is that most of Obama's voters had no idea that Obama would demand that THEIR PRIORITIES and THEIR CONCERNS would be forbidden to be part of the Democratic party.

Wayne Arnold

The Obama Democrats will never win this state. Even John Q Public knows how the so called Democratic Party has treated Florida and has refused to count our votes. Come November we'll have our say and that vote will count....MAYBE!!

Franc

Obama essentially moved the DNC (aka the Democratic Party) to Chicago this week. The Obama people are a nasty piece of work and you can ask Clinton supporters if you do not believe me.

Chicago is the home of Jesse Jackson, Farrakhan, Rev Wright and other bigots & anti-Semites who are on Obama's team. These people are the power behind Obama. A lot of Democrats are starting to wonder just who we nominated when they moved the DNC to Chicago. If Obama wins he and his gang will own the party. A lot of Democrats are VERY uncomfortable with that idea. We should have picked Edwards or Hillary.

slag

Franc,
First of all, your use of the word "gang" is incredibly inappropriate in this context. Secondly, neither Obama nor his team members are anti-semitic. Your use of the word "we" here implies that you are a Democrat, but if you are, you are not a good one. Your KLAN really should learn to hide its true colors more effectively. In other words, as far as bigotry is concerned...backatcha.

skmckinney

just say no deal: http://www.justsaynodeal.com/

we are a coalition of millions with one thing in common: NObama

skmckinney

Everyone, Please help Sen.Hillary Clinton with retiring her debt.

Here is the direct link:
https://contribute.hillaryclinton.com/form.html?sc=2481
Choose one-time contribution, and give as much as you possibly can. Add a $0.44 for good measure; it will take care of the processing costs. Thank you.

LET US LIBERATE HILLARY TO LEAD US HOWEVER SHE FEELS IS THE BEST WAY TO LEAD US, WITHOUT THE MANIPULATIVE PRESSURES OF DNC AND OBAMA.
Thank you.

skmckinney

I agree with this.

They can consolidate power and try to put a hold on the Party all they want..... IT DOESN'T MEAN WE HAVE TO VOTE FOR OBAMA IN NOVEMBER! LOL This is really the most important part of it....

DEMOCRACY!!!!!! SHOW THEM THE POWER OF YOUR VOTES!!!!! WE ARE A ONE CITIZEN= ONE VOTE COUNTRY!!! DEMAND DEMOCRACY EVERYWHERE!!! SHOW THE POWER OF YOUR VOTES!! THANK YOU FELLOW CITIZENS!!!!

skmckinney

Oh, yes, this is also another important piece.


Quote:
Obama spokesman Josh Earnest said the move would affect just a few delegates. "By the time Nov. 4 rolls around, it will be clear to Democrats across Florida that stopping John McCain from extending Bush's policies for another four years is more important than a handful of hotel rooms in Denver," he said


Now, dont forget.. In Pennsylvania, Rendell was asked to do fundraising tomorrow (saturday) for Obama and when he said the day has important events and people may not show up for this, Obama said, get this:
"We don't need the people, just their checks."

THAT is how much he cares about the people.

It is about money, and your votes so that he can rise in power.

He has done nothing for people. In his 1 term senate, he has studied backdoor politics to backstab and ascend above fellow-men and women.

Dont hesitate one iota to vote for McCain in November. At least the country will be safe from hooligans and bamboozlers taking over and hoodwinking you...

Dont believe the stuff about McCain giving us 100 years of war. This is masterful twisting of words. Germany and Japan have the kind of 100 years of base that McCain is talking about.

Dont fall for the scare tactics of Roe V.Wade being overturned. They want you to be chicken and flock to the FLUFF Obama. Roe v. Wade is not that easy to overturn. McCain may appoint conservative judges but they are also reasonable heads. Now Obama's choices would be extreme left, McCain's would be moderate right. We can live with McCain's choice.

NObama.
just say no deal: http://www.justsaynodeal.com/

Leisa

Attitudes like those of commenter JDB: "Here's the reality: it's time to shed the baby boomer generation's dead weight in the leadership of this country. The specter of the politics of the 60's has too long cast a shadow over America, and it's usefulness is at an end."

This idea is prevalent among the many Obama supporters... It is not unifying, and this arrogance and ignorance allows this thuggery and ugliness to be justified in their minds.

We have to find a way to stop this... The presumptive nominee does not even acknowledge these problems but I lay them squarely on him. He is, after all, supposed to be the leader of this "movement".

Here are just two examples of the way the some of the lowly early Obama supporters are treated... This has happened throughout the campaign and within the DNC.

http://www.techpresident.com/node/301

http://tinyurl.com/4urn7p

Debbie UK

There seem to be a lot of McCain supporters on here stirring things up.

Maggie05

Democrats! Do not vote for Obama. Join us, Democrats who have left, to bring this party down.

Dean and the DNC have perpetrated a fraudulent election and handed the Democratic Party over to Richard Daley and the city of Chicago.

Revolt!

Maggie05

Democrats! Do not vote for Obama. Join us, Democrats who have left, to bring this party down.

Dean and the DNC have perpetrated a fraudulent election and handed the Democratic Party over to Richard Daley and the city of Chicago.

Revolt!

Maggie05

Democrats! Do not vote for Obama. Join us, Democrats who have left, to bring this party down.

Dean and the DNC have perpetrated a fraudulent election and handed the Democratic Party over to Richard Daley and the city of Chicago.

Revolt!

Dallas

Could somebody please tell RICK TRUTH SPEAKER that Obama isn't PRESIDENT yet?

Sadly, Hillary would have been president if Obama, Dean, Pelosi, and Reid hadn't hijacked the party. Oh, well. She can run again in four years against PRESIDENT MCCAIN.

mouve

Hi.

To all who still seem to be unsatisfied with the FL seating outcome, please read
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/03/17/776838.aspx
I just wonder why the FL and MI primary have been set too early... something's fishy there. Or did they get carried away? Anyway, I don't think Sen. Obama was involved (just wrote this in case someone had this hair-raising suspicion).

Oh, now we're talking snippets again... ah, well, might as well go straight on with it:

@Maggie05:
Hitting "Post" once is completely sufficient.

@skmckinney:
About the "checks" thingy: Yeah, doesn't sound too good at the first glance. But none of us was there and got the true meaning of this statement. This snippet doesn't provide enough information to judge the situation objectively. Sure, it provides enough information to back your theory that Sen. Obama isn't interested in people... but that shouldn't satisfy you if you're interested in fair judgement.
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"He (Sen. Obama) has done nothing for people. In his 1 term senate, he has studied backdoor politics to backstab and ascend above fellow-men and women."

So you're from Illinois then? And you're perfectly familiar with his 1st term in senate? And, yeah, I think McCain didn't do any of this "back-stabbing"... nor did any other politician, right? Maybe you're right, but please do back your statement with some reliable source.
And in principle it is perfectly OK to seek ascension in politics.
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"It is about money, and your votes so that he (Sen. Obama) can rise in power."

I say, I totally forgot... McCain doesn't care about votes and money.
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Someone stated above Sen. Obama stood for tax raises. He does but if you're not one of the richest people in the US it probably won't bother you.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html
I personally like how he deals with the bottom of this list, that is, people with the lowest incomes. It's a pretty new idea, I reckon... I don't know if you disagree with Sen. Obamas plans, but if you did, you couldn't possibly be considered a very nice person given the fact that you would deny financial alleviation to those who need it.
Sorry, but Sen. Obama all in all has the better attitude towards the american people.
By the way, McCain's plans involve overall tax cuts. Where would he possibly find money to govern? Other taxes won't suffice, I think...

Enough snippets for today. I'd just like to say that considering yourself a Democrat (capital D) and voting Republican seems a bit odd to me. Are the differences between Sens. Clinton and Obama really that big? I don't think so (way less than between each of them and McCain). So please don't divide the Party by behaving so ill-tempered. Ask yourselfs: Can you really, really afford the next 4 years to be like the last 8 years? I know what I'd answer to this: "No, I can't!"

Addict Free

Re: I'd just like to say that considering yourself a Democrat (capital D) and voting Republican seems a bit odd to me.

Why is that? Granted certain themes of one party are inherent in most candidates, but at times one has to vote for the other party because there's simply no better alternative.

That said, this year I think the differences are quite stark and I tend to agree in this particular case, assuming what makes you affiliate yourself with a give party is one of the main issues.

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